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re: Coal is dead...
Posted on 3/28/17 at 5:20 pm to Spaulding Smails
Posted on 3/28/17 at 5:20 pm to Spaulding Smails
quote:
renewable energy's 650,000 jobs
Not any more. Those bogus scam grants are going bye bye. Solar and wind are little more than jokes. It doesn't work to any level of comparative cost, efficiency, or reliability with nukes or fossil fuel based systems.
0
Posted on 3/28/17 at 5:25 pm to Eli Goldfinger
quote:
Coal is dead...
And it had been for over 300 million years.
Now that I fed my inner smart arse, who can really predict the future trends of a free market? Not long ago when my gas furnace was getting long in the tooth, I was looking into the economics of replacing it with electric. Natural gas prices were climbing fast, and my gas bill was becoming disconcertingly high. Thankfully it survived to the fracking revolution and a new gas furnace now resides in my attic saving me money every old snap!
There are still many coal fired generators in the USA and world. There are other uses for coal than burning it. Don't underestimate innovation that may increase its demand. Also as more customers switch to cheaper gas, demand may overcome supply. The resultant price increase may revitalize coal. Free markets are unpredictable.
Killing an industry by Obama EOs was just plain litarded.
Posted on 3/28/17 at 5:28 pm to wickowick
No, that's Jodi, that's my wife.
Posted on 3/28/17 at 5:28 pm to Eli Goldfinger
I appreciate your being an obvious proponent of LNG, but you're very wrong about coal and how LNG will even be refined and used.
I'm a securities broker and use to consult for an independent MLP energy company. I've done significant analysis on the direction of energy in this country.
The future is Methanol, which is a by-product of all sorts of fossil fuels and bio-fuels. Both LNG and coal can refine very cleanly into Methanol. In fact, coal does it about as efficient as LNG and Corn with less waste.
The country is slap full of coal-burning plants as well and it'll be some time before they are taken over by alternative sources.
Not to mention, China and India are further from a transition than even we are. We will be a net-exporter of coal before we're a supplier of LNG to the world.
Coal has decades of longevity still.
I'm a securities broker and use to consult for an independent MLP energy company. I've done significant analysis on the direction of energy in this country.
The future is Methanol, which is a by-product of all sorts of fossil fuels and bio-fuels. Both LNG and coal can refine very cleanly into Methanol. In fact, coal does it about as efficient as LNG and Corn with less waste.
The country is slap full of coal-burning plants as well and it'll be some time before they are taken over by alternative sources.
Not to mention, China and India are further from a transition than even we are. We will be a net-exporter of coal before we're a supplier of LNG to the world.
Coal has decades of longevity still.
Posted on 3/28/17 at 5:29 pm to Eli Goldfinger
quote:
coal jobs aren't coming back.
Yeah, maybe not.
But they sure helped keep Hillary out of the WH.
Posted on 3/28/17 at 5:30 pm to 225bred
The downvotes on my post show me that my original post went over a lot of people's heads
Posted on 3/28/17 at 5:31 pm to RobbBobb
quote:
Regs, my friend, regs
That is now changing
I would like to see what regs make coal competitive with natural gas...keep in mind coal was dead before the Obama through the last shovel of dirt on it's coffin with the power gen regs.
Posted on 3/28/17 at 5:34 pm to Eli Goldfinger
Solar is deader. Er. What a waste of an industry.
Coal: the major positive impact on coal is coking coal for steel production. Call me back when steel can be produced with natural gas on a commercially viable level.
Coal: the major positive impact on coal is coking coal for steel production. Call me back when steel can be produced with natural gas on a commercially viable level.
Posted on 3/28/17 at 5:38 pm to Eli Goldfinger
quote:
Add that to the fact that natural gas power generation plants cost half as much to build, are much cleaner, require less maintenance, and require fewer workers and you have the death knell for the coal industry.
Very true. Coal has to be transported by rail, managed and pushed around on a stack with heavy equipment when on site, placed on conveyor systems, pulverized into a powder, and the ash handled. Burners foul and soot blowers have to be used to prevent tube surfaces from becoming coated. Natural gas is transported in a pipeline and burns without fouling equipment. Would be an easy decision for me if I were building a power plant.
Posted on 3/28/17 at 5:40 pm to cokebottleag
quote:
Coal: the major positive impact on coal is coking coal for steel production. Call me back when steel can be produced with natural gas on a commercially viable level.
Refineries pretty much give coke away just to get rid of it.
Posted on 3/28/17 at 5:41 pm to Spaulding Smails
quote:
renewable energy is the present and the future
Posted on 3/28/17 at 5:45 pm to Lou Pai
you ever hear the rumors that ARAMCO is going public just so that the information regarding its stores are forced into the public to destroy our petro industry?
Posted on 3/28/17 at 5:46 pm to SlowFlowPro
No sir I haven't. Link?
Posted on 3/28/17 at 5:50 pm to Lou Pai
it's conspiracy theory bullshite i think
just curious if it had made the rounds here b/c i don't come around often these days
just curious if it had made the rounds here b/c i don't come around often these days
Posted on 3/28/17 at 5:54 pm to wickowick
Posted on 3/28/17 at 6:09 pm to Eli Goldfinger
quote:
Hopefully younger coal miners are smart enough to realize this and don't sit around waiting for their job to come back. Maybe they can get in with a fracking outfit.
economic migration is interesting.
Since I am a green socialist, I would like to see guys offered training in new technologies related to energy production. Moving expenses, 3 hots and a cot, in a trainng environment. After training, sent to work. Family is moved by the state.
a year in a transition home.
I lived in Altoona Pa for a while. It was decades after the railroad repair center had been closed down and they were still in a spin about it.
Pitt lost the debate vs WV U on which location was the more depressed part of Appalachia. WV debaters won.
The main thing I noticed about coal mining in that area was the fires. The mining companies owned the rights and if a fire happened in a mine, it would burn right up into someone's house sometimes.
Fracking is going to change Pennsylvania. 90% of the oil is still in the ground there. When they had the Titusville in the 1800's, they allowed rigs as close as you could put them. the view was blotted out by rigs as far as you could see.
They took off all the pressure and most of the oil is still there. 90% in Titusville.
So we can imagine that the poster suggesting young miners get into fracking is a real chance.
Posted on 3/28/17 at 6:15 pm to cwill
quote:
keep in mind coal was dead before the Obama through the last shovel of dirt on it's coffin with the power gen regs.
Natural gas production only caught coal in production in 2015, and that was after coal lost half their jobs since 2011
Obama killed coal. Coal didn't die a slow death
Posted on 3/28/17 at 6:22 pm to alphaandomega
quote:
As long as the technology is developed with private funds thats fine.
Most research and technological development for energy comes from publicly funded institutions or grant money.
Posted on 3/28/17 at 6:23 pm to RobbBobb
Obama didn't kill coal, the market did
quote:
Critics of the Environmental Protection Agency’s new Clean Power Plan are describing it in apocalyptic terms. But much of what they believe about the plan -- that it will destroy the coal industry, kill jobs and raise costs for consumers -- is wrong. And it’s important to understand why. The overblown political rhetoric about the plan tends to obscure the market reality that the coal industry has been in steady decline for a decade, partly as a result of the natural gas boom, but mostly because consumers are demanding cleaner air and action on climate change. Communities across the U.S. have led the way in persuading utilities to close dirty old coal plants and transition to cleaner forms of energy. The Sierra Club’s grass-roots Beyond Coal campaign (which Bloomberg Philanthropies funds) has helped close or phase out more than 200 coal plants over the past five years.
Posted on 3/28/17 at 6:49 pm to Spaulding Smails
quote:
“So if somebody wants to build a coal-powered plant, they can; it’s just that it will bankrupt them, because they’re going to be charged a huge sum for all that greenhouse gas that’s being emitted,” Obama said during a 2008 interview with the San Francisco Chronicle’s editorial board.
Today, the U.S. Environmental Protection Agency (EPA), under the President’s directive through his Climate Action Plan, issued a rule on that will kill the future for coal and raise costs for electricity in the future.
quote:
Between 2008 and 2012, the Wall Street Journal (WSJ) reports 50,000 coal jobs were lost
What is it that you don't get?
Obama took over in 2008. The coal industry began to decline. Specifically because of Obamas actions, not some random market forces. Those regs are now undone
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