re: Christians and the Hurricane Relief Effort

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If you're truly interested in why that comment you wrote is getting the shite downvoted out of it, read some Sam Harris on this subject.

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I've read and listened to a lot of Sam Harris. What do you have to say about it?

Why does it have to be objective? Why can't atheists have empathy/sympathy for their fellow man?

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Why does it have to be objective? Why can't atheists have empathy/sympathy for their fellow man?

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Because they are more than happy to judge people for not having empathy/sympathy for their fellow man. If there is no objective basis for helping others, everyone is free to help or not help as much as they want and should be free from judgment one way or the other.

There's also a matter of consistency with one's worldview, which most people don't seem to care about.

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Well, then we are considering that god/s to be the same as whatever god gives christians their moral compass too? Is it the simple belief of ANY god? Does it have to be a biblical god? The same people who had the desire to help their species also worshipped the sun. I don't think Ra is a good place to put the idea of a moral compass

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i am not implying it has to be a biblical god or even a religion that pushes towards any form of moralism. i just found your statement about ancestors not having a religion to be a bit of a stretch. i don't know of any ancient culture that is devoid of religion without some thought of afterlife and things done on Earth to achieve it, be that good or bad acts.


i'm welcome to being wrong on this front. don't think i am, but i'm open to it.

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If humans pre-religion found it important enough to help each other, then we do it today as well. I don't think doing it because a higher power keeps the tally on it is true. I think we, as a tribal/pack species innately have desires to help one another.

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So your basis for people helping one another is based upon innate desire? If so, I agree with you. The Bible explains this desire as God's law being written on the hearts of all mankind, who are created in His image.

However, this isn't an objective reasoning for helping others. By definition (at least yours), it's entirely subjective, coming from within individuals based on some feeling. So again I ask, what objective reason does an atheist have to help others? You have been critical of my initial statement but the crux of it was the word "objective".

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There goes that objectivity, eh?

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I assume you're an atheist. I bet you think it's terrible when some people sit by and let others suffer and/or die, right? You think it's bad when people need help and others don't step in and provide aide, right? If you are an atheist, you shouldn't judge those people as terrible or bad for their decisions not to help because there is no objective reason to help others in an atheistic worldview.

I think I'm speaking of going way earlier than that. What I'm saying is, I don't think religion is necessary to want to help or have a humanistic urge to help fellow man. Someone saying atheists have no objective moral compass is an insult and in my opinion, completely wrong.

What period of time are you referring to specifically?

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I assume you're an atheist. I bet you think it's terrible when some people sit by and let others suffer and/or die, right? You think it's bad when people need help and others don't step in and provide aide, right? If you are an atheist, you shouldn't judge those people as terrible or bad for their decisions not to help because there is no objective reason to help others in an atheistic worldview.

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This is a lot of assumptions

To answer your questions...

Yes, I'm atheists/agnostic/whatever you want to call me, I'm not religious

But no, I don't think its terrible for others to not help other in need, I think those people lack empathy most likely and cannot relate to their suffering.

You don't have to have an objective reason to help other people. We are emotional creatures. Our emotions dictate many of our actions. Most of those times, those emotions are either innate, or driven by past experiences.

I don't pretend to speak on Christian worldviews because I can't understand it.

You should probably learn to not speak on our worldviews.

Would you say objective morality is, as an entity, better or 'more moral' than subjective morality?