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Decline of upland birds

Posted on 1/6/15 at 6:59 pm
Posted by OffroadSportsman89
Alabama
Member since Jan 2015
490 posts
Posted on 1/6/15 at 6:59 pm
I've heard stories my whole life of how good quail hunting used to be in Alabama up until the 2000's. What is the real reason for the decline of quail in Alabama and the rest of the south? Texas and Oklahoma have even had down years recently. Preserve hunting without wild birds just isn't fun to me
Posted by Geauxtiga
No man's land
Member since Jan 2008
34377 posts
Posted on 1/6/15 at 7:01 pm to
Habitat.
Posted by KingRanch
The Ranch
Member since Mar 2012
61603 posts
Posted on 1/6/15 at 7:04 pm to
Urbanization
Posted by OffroadSportsman89
Alabama
Member since Jan 2015
490 posts
Posted on 1/6/15 at 7:04 pm to
How has the habitat drastically changed? There are tons of places that look the same now as they did 30 years ago.
Posted by Tiger In the Swamp
Louisiana
Member since May 2014
839 posts
Posted on 1/6/15 at 7:06 pm to
I thought it was mainly fire-ants and predators, besides the habitat.
Posted by Geauxtiga
No man's land
Member since Jan 2008
34377 posts
Posted on 1/6/15 at 7:07 pm to
quote:

How has the habitat drastically changed? There are tons of places that look the same now as they did 30 years ago.
I can show you places we used to run bird dogs on that are not neighborhoods. Also, many farmers no longer have fences along their properties so a lot less fence/tree lines.

Posted by cave canem
pullarius dominus
Member since Oct 2012
12186 posts
Posted on 1/6/15 at 7:31 pm to
yep, it be the fire ants coupled with small egg eating varmints no longer being trapper for fur.
Posted by REB BEER
Laffy Yet
Member since Dec 2010
16201 posts
Posted on 1/6/15 at 7:36 pm to
There used to be tens of 1000's of small family farms with grown up fence rows in between. Grown up fence rows happen to be prime bobwhite quail habitat.

Changes in farming and timber practices are the main reason for the decline in quail populations in the south.
Posted by Spankum
Miss-sippi
Member since Jan 2007
56030 posts
Posted on 1/6/15 at 7:37 pm to
I have noticed a big decline in all of the "prey"- type animals over that time...I have also seen a big increase in coyotes to the point that I hardly ever see a fox any more...also, farmers nowdays are able to keep their crops cleaner than I have ever seen, so there is not a lot of cover in a rowcrop field like there used to be...

I am guessing that predators coupled with lack of cover have just decimated them......
Posted by Larry Gooseman
Houston
Member since Mar 2014
2655 posts
Posted on 1/6/15 at 7:40 pm to
For about $800/day you can come hunt wild quail in S Tx.

I've read about quail leases that are $20k/season.
Posted by AutoYes_Clown
Baton Rouge, LA
Member since Oct 2012
5175 posts
Posted on 1/6/15 at 7:44 pm to
Not sure if its related, a tangent, or has nothing to do with it... but my Grandfather's land in North Alabama was awesome quail hunting territory when I grew up. Nothing changed with the property but over the years, the number of Killdeer exploded and Bobwhite declined. I know Killdeer prefer open areas and quail prefer cover, but the land was grassland with patches of taller grass.
Posted by Spankum
Miss-sippi
Member since Jan 2007
56030 posts
Posted on 1/6/15 at 7:46 pm to
quote:

Nothing changed with the property but over the years, the number of Killdeer exploded and Bobwhite declined.


now, that is an interesting observation...I would like to hear a biologist's take on that...

lots of biologists read this site, hopefully a couple chime in here...
Posted by Pop
Member since Feb 2013
762 posts
Posted on 1/6/15 at 8:02 pm to
Lots of good reasons already mentioned but one additional factor could be the increase in birds of prey (hawks) after the DDT ban years ago.
Posted by Geauxtiga
No man's land
Member since Jan 2008
34377 posts
Posted on 1/6/15 at 8:15 pm to
quote:

There used to be tens of 1000's of small family farms with grown up fence rows in between. Grown up fence rows happen to be prime bobwhite quail habitat.

Changes in farming and timber practices are the main reason for the decline in quail populations in the south.

Great point. I remember when a farmer with 200 acres had a big farm. Now farmers plant 1000+.

Instead of a bunch of family's farms having fences, the fields are not only combined but lazer-leveled. That takes out a lot of levees too. Not sure if that affects the birds but the bigger spreads, minus the fences separating them surely does.

It's amazing how there are fewer farmers who farm more land, and the amount of crop they bring in. Combines are $350,000.00 and rice carts haul more than we used to take in a bobtail to the dryers.
Posted by LSUTiger205
Ocean Springs, MS
Member since Aug 2006
10820 posts
Posted on 1/6/15 at 8:15 pm to
It's great where I hunt. But we do have a couple thousand in a pen.
Posted by DonChowder
Sonoma County
Member since Dec 2012
9249 posts
Posted on 1/6/15 at 8:16 pm to
I've always read that it's the fire ants. But that argument doesn't really work for places like CA who've also seen a decline in upland bird populations.
Posted by plazadweller
South Georgia
Member since Jul 2011
11449 posts
Posted on 1/6/15 at 8:24 pm to
Loss of habitat for a variety reasons. Quail hunting isn't nearly as popular as it once was. Our tract of land in South Georgia has several covey of wild quail which is kind of unheard of to a degree. People don't manage their land specifically for quail habitat anymore. Farmers here have been buying the shite out of land clearing it & putting up irrigation pivots. Developers have bought a lot of what was once prime time quail hunting land & built houses.
Posted by Fat Neck
Member since Dec 2013
466 posts
Posted on 1/6/15 at 8:42 pm to
quote:

Loss of habitat for a variety reasons. Quail hunting isn't nearly as popular as it once was. Our tract of land in South Georgia has several covey of wild quail which is kind of unheard of to a degree. People don't manage their land specifically for quail habitat anymore. Farmers here have been buying the shite out of land clearing it & putting up irrigation pivots. Developers have bought a lot of what was once prime time quail hunting land & built houses


I will strongly disagree with you hear. Lots of people all across south spend big money just to manage for Mr. Bob and still struggle to produce huntable number

More articles and opinion on this topic than you can read in one lifetime
Most chalk it up to:
1. Change in habitat, while habitat may look same to your eye, subtle change can cause huge effect in bobwhite suitability. Also as one hand pointed out, decrease in small farms. You can probably thank the welfare and government dependency for decrease in share croppers who all had 40 acre with okra and corn patch

2. Increase in predator, decrease in trapping actitvity

3. Quail not migratory, they can't replenish areas that been shot out easily. Or replenish in area that is once again suitable ground

FAT
Posted by weagle99
Member since Nov 2011
35893 posts
Posted on 1/6/15 at 8:42 pm to
quote:

There used to be tens of 1000's of small family farms with grown up fence rows in between. Grown up fence rows happen to be prime bobwhite quail habitat.

Changes in farming and timber practices are the main reason for the decline in quail populations in the south.


This. Plus fireants.

I also heard a theory that increases in deer and turkey numbers have had an effect. Not sure about that, but it does seem that limited DNR budgets go more towards deer these days than small game since deer is the cash cow.
This post was edited on 1/6/15 at 8:46 pm
Posted by weagle99
Member since Nov 2011
35893 posts
Posted on 1/6/15 at 8:47 pm to
Side point: I hunted Gambel's quail in the desert last year. That species is apparently going strong with lots of birds available.
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