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Started By
Message
Do you believe in Social Security choice?
Posted on 7/7/14 at 3:06 pm
Posted on 7/7/14 at 3:06 pm
Meaning being able to opt out of mandated social security and invest your own money into your own personal retirement account that politicians can't dip into.
I support this and am pro-choice when it comes to Social Security.
I want to hear reasons why this is a bad idea.
I support this and am pro-choice when it comes to Social Security.
I want to hear reasons why this is a bad idea.
20
Posted on 7/7/14 at 3:08 pm to goldennugget
quote:
I want to hear reasons why this is a bad idea.
Because then the government can't use our retirement money for something else, duh.
Posted on 7/7/14 at 3:09 pm to goldennugget
It isn't, frick SS. If they told me I could opt out today and not receive a penny after retirement I would. I could do a way better job investing my money. I could honestly give two shits about the boomer's retirement as well.
Posted on 7/7/14 at 3:10 pm to goldennugget
I would forego all of the money I've already paid in if it meant I didn't have to pay another cent into SS.
Posted on 7/7/14 at 3:13 pm to goldennugget
It's a bad idea because anyone with a brain will opt out and the rest will not be able to fund it. It is already unsustainable...imagine if 60% opted out.
The Feds will never give up money from their pockets. It's too much of a vote-buying slush fund to give up.
The Feds will never give up money from their pockets. It's too much of a vote-buying slush fund to give up.
Posted on 7/7/14 at 3:13 pm to UGATiger26
quote:
Because then the government can't use our retirement money for something else, duh.
What part of lockbox do you not understand? !?!?!
Posted on 7/7/14 at 3:13 pm to Rickety Cricket
6.2% of every dollar i make is forced to go in there as well as my employer matching that 6.2%
if that were going into a 401K i could retire much earlier in life....
if that were going into a 401K i could retire much earlier in life....
Posted on 7/7/14 at 3:14 pm to goldennugget
Personally, I would love to be able to opt out of it and invest the money myself. I'm young so I could throw everything into a Vanguard target retirement fund and end up with a lot more money than the current Social Security system will give me.
Reasons why it might be a bad idea:
Most people are not savvy investors, and some people would become victims of investment fraud.
The government would need some way to ensure that people who opt out of SS have actually invested the money for retirement. Otherwise, if the citizens spend the money, they're going to be a burden on everyone else when it's time for them to retire.
How could the government be sure the system isn't abused?
Reasons why it might be a bad idea:
Most people are not savvy investors, and some people would become victims of investment fraud.
The government would need some way to ensure that people who opt out of SS have actually invested the money for retirement. Otherwise, if the citizens spend the money, they're going to be a burden on everyone else when it's time for them to retire.
How could the government be sure the system isn't abused?
This post was edited on 7/7/14 at 3:15 pm
Posted on 7/7/14 at 3:16 pm to goldennugget
Yes.. SS should never have been put into place. It's a Ponzi Scheme.
Posted on 7/7/14 at 3:17 pm to ehidal1
quote:
It's a bad idea because anyone with a brain will opt out and the rest will not be able to fund it. It is already unsustainable...imagine if 60% opted out.
That's too damn bad... where does personal responsibility fall into this, if you decide not to opt out and continue to invest your $$$ into social security and it fails, that's your fault that you chose to put your money into a failing system
People would have no sympathy if we invested our $$$ into a failing mutual fund or stock and lost our money, why have sympathy for those who invest into a failed social security program. Both were just poor investment strategies.
Posted on 7/7/14 at 3:18 pm to goldennugget
Nope, choice is only important when it comes to kill babies or deciding what sex you want to be.
Posted on 7/7/14 at 3:19 pm to goldennugget
quote:YES X INFINITY
Meaning being able to opt out of mandated social security and invest your own money into your own personal retirement account that politicians can't dip into.
Posted on 7/7/14 at 3:20 pm to goldennugget
quote:
Meaning being able to opt out of mandated social security and invest your own money into your own personal retirement account that politicians can't dip into.
I support this and am pro-choice when it comes to Social Security.
I want to hear reasons why this is a bad idea.
You're proposing that we replace an insurance program with a savings program.
That would kinda defeat the point of having an insurance program.
If you know any history it also means every few decades millions of people will become destitute in retirement all at once.
Now - if you want to ADD individual retirement accounts to the program I'll all for it. Take the regular, what is it, 12% combined EE+ER SS insurance contributions and add in another - say - 4% required retirement savings contributions - and I think that's a good idea.
This post was edited on 7/7/14 at 3:22 pm
Posted on 7/7/14 at 3:22 pm to goldennugget
Yes. As others have said, I believe I can do a better job saving/investing for my retirement than the government can. I would opt out tomorrow if allowed.
Posted on 7/7/14 at 3:23 pm to SpidermanTUba
quote:
If you know any history it also means every few decades millions of people will become destitute in retirement all at once.
So, what's your point?
Posted on 7/7/14 at 3:23 pm to jclem11
quote:
Yes. As others have said, I believe I can do a better job saving/investing for my retirement than the government can.
That's what everyone thinks but history has shown that they are frequently wrong and when they are they tend to be wrong right along with everyone else at the same time.
Posted on 7/7/14 at 3:23 pm to Zach
quote:
quote:
If you know any history it also means every few decades millions of people will become destitute in retirement all at once.
So, what's your point?
Would you prefer society wait to bear that cost when it gets to that point?
Posted on 7/7/14 at 3:24 pm to goldennugget
quote:
That's too damn bad... where does personal responsibility fall into this, if you decide not to opt out and continue to invest your $$$ into social security and it fails, that's your fault that you chose to put your money into a failing system
we do a very poor job of letting people completely sink with their bad choices, just look at the last 10 years for evidence.
The reason that this is a bad idea is
a) 50% people opt out
b) 50% of those people don't save a penny
c) at retirement age, they whine and bitch and vote their access to those who saved
d) we have the cost but not the revenue for the program.
This is the problem with the idea, its destined to fail.
Posted on 7/7/14 at 3:24 pm to goldennugget
When social security was passed, the retirement age was the same as the the average life expectancy. Today, people are living much longer. If the retirement age for social security more closely matched the average life expectancy, it would be solvent.
The issue is that having Social Security there for retirees does two things:
It reduces workers' abilities to save as more of their income goes to taxes.
It incentivizes not saving because citizens are guaranteed income at the end of their lives whether they save, work, or not.
The issue is that having Social Security there for retirees does two things:
It reduces workers' abilities to save as more of their income goes to taxes.
It incentivizes not saving because citizens are guaranteed income at the end of their lives whether they save, work, or not.
Posted on 7/7/14 at 3:25 pm to SpidermanTUba
quote:Ah shite, I always forget it's Social Security Insurance. It makes a little more sense that we can't control the investments.
You're proposing that we replace an insurance program with a savings program.
That would kinda defeat the point of having an insurance program.
If you know any history it also means every few decades millions of people will become destitute in retirement all at once.
Now - if you want to ADD individual retirement accounts to the program I'll all for it. Take the regular, what is it, 12% combined EE+ER SS insurance contributions and add in another - say - 4% required retirement savings contributions - and I think that's a good idea.
I agree that adding a savings/investment program to SS would be a good idea. I don't know about tacking on another 4% that gets taken from your paycheck... but restructuring SS to allow for investing sounds like a nice thing.
I think Australia has a mandatory retirement savings program and it seems to work reasonably well. I'm not an expert on it, though.
This post was edited on 7/7/14 at 3:29 pm
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