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Would the US bounce a check?? Does Congress's authority mean anything?
Posted on 7/5/14 at 2:23 pm
Posted on 7/5/14 at 2:23 pm
I read a piece today about Obama's continued use of executive power to unconstitutionally circumvent law.
The author was making the case that Congress should impeach Obama or vote to take away approved spending.
I thought about that a little. Do you think it matters anymore that Congress has approved spending or not? Have you ever seen anyone tell a President to stop spending?
How when the treasury is under the authority of the President do you stop them from writing checks? Who could bounce them?
The author was making the case that Congress should impeach Obama or vote to take away approved spending.
I thought about that a little. Do you think it matters anymore that Congress has approved spending or not? Have you ever seen anyone tell a President to stop spending?
How when the treasury is under the authority of the President do you stop them from writing checks? Who could bounce them?
This post was edited on 7/5/14 at 2:25 pm
3
Posted on 7/5/14 at 2:28 pm to I B Freeman
Once economics reach this scale, they seem to become almost abstract. Pretty hard to comprehend.
Posted on 7/5/14 at 5:37 pm to I B Freeman
quote:
Do you think it matters anymore that Congress has approved spending or not? Have you ever seen anyone tell a President to stop spending?
Every penny the President spends is appropriated by Congress.
Posted on 7/5/14 at 5:59 pm to SpidermanTUba
quote:Knucklehead, he's talking about congress refusing to appropriate funds the president wants to spend. Get your head out of your anus and actually read a post and comprehend it before you hit reply.
Every penny the President spends is appropriated by Congress.
Posted on 7/5/14 at 6:08 pm to I B Freeman
quote:
The author was making the case that Congress should impeach Obama or vote to take away approved spending.
Why?
Posted on 7/5/14 at 7:30 pm to Old Hellen Yeller
quote:
quote:
The author was making the case that Congress should impeach Obama or vote to take away approved spending.
Why?
He was talking about the IRS thing and failure to appoint a special prosecutor, the different military actions, the recess appointments, ACA changes outside the bill and now immigration.
So if Congress has not approved the spending and the Prez spends it what is their recourse short of impeachment??
Posted on 7/6/14 at 12:40 am to I B Freeman
quote:
So if Congress has not approved the spending and the Prez spends it what is their recourse short of impeachment??
How can he spend it without Congress's approval?
BTW - did you know that since Nixon, the President must spend as Congress appropriates? Before Nixon, the President had the power of "impoundment" - he could withhold any spending measure he saw fit. Since Nixon, he may only impound funds for 45 days pending approval from Congress.
This is why it is not all all unconstitutional for the President to raise the debt ceiling unilaterally provided it is to accommodate appropriated spending. If the Congress refuses to raise the debt ceiling when needed then they have created two contradicting laws - one which demands the President spend X dollars and one which demands he not spend X dollars. Since the President is only bound to execute the laws "in good faith" and since no one can possibly execute two contradicting laws simultaneously - it would be left to him to choose which law to break and which to follow.
Posted on 7/6/14 at 12:41 am to LSURussian
quote:k
Knucklehead, he's talking about congress refusing to appropriate funds the president wants to spend. Get your head out of your anus and actually read a post and comprehend it before you hit reply.
Posted on 7/6/14 at 2:56 am to SpidermanTUba
quote:
Every penny the President spends is appropriated by Congress.
Not true. Agencies also take in money from fees and such that can be spent. Passport fees, park service fees, trademark/patent fees, etc.
That said, the bulk of the money must be approved by Congress and, no, the POTUS cannot spend it if it hasn't been approved. There are ways to shift money around sometimes temporarily, and many agencies did this during the last shutdown to keep from sending people home. But no agency CFO is going to risk going to jail for gross intentional violations.
This post was edited on 7/6/14 at 3:03 am
Posted on 7/6/14 at 3:17 am to foshizzle
quote:
Not true. Agencies also take in money from fees and such that can be spent. Passport fees, park service fees, trademark/patent fees, etc.
Every penny of those fees is authorized by Congress.
quote:iagreewdis
That said, the bulk of the money must be approved by Congress and, no, the POTUS cannot spend it if it hasn't been approved. There are ways to shift money around sometimes temporarily, and many agencies did this during the last shutdown to keep from sending people home. But no agency CFO is going to risk going to jail for gross intentional violations.
Posted on 7/6/14 at 4:58 am to SpidermanTUba
quote:
Every penny of those fees is authorized by Congress.
Still not quite correct. The ability to spend money collected is authorized by Congress. Congress also will sometimes (not always) set the fee amount. But Congress does not decide how many people are willing to pay the fee and therefore does not authorize how much will be collected and subsequently spent.
Posted on 7/6/14 at 8:46 am to foshizzle
quote:
Still not quite correct. The ability to spend money collected is authorized by Congress. Congress also will sometimes (not always) set the fee amount.
If the fee amount can be set by the agency - that power is granted by Congress.
quote:
Congress does not decide how many people are willing to pay the fee and therefore does not authorize how much will be collected
They don't decide how much money people are going to make, either, and therefore don't authorize a specific amount of income tax revenue to be collected, yet I doubt you wouldn't considering spending of income tax revenue to be authorized by Congress.
This post was edited on 7/6/14 at 8:47 am
Posted on 7/6/14 at 12:30 pm to SpidermanTUba
What mechanism Spidy stops the treasury from issuing checks when the administration spends more than Congress authorizes???
Only impeachment that I can see.
Only impeachment that I can see.
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