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Message
In a Perfect World...
Posted on 1/19/14 at 1:55 am
Posted on 1/19/14 at 1:55 am
The Saints have a team meeting and, one by one, each player is taken into another room with his agent to discuss next season and whether or not they want to be here.
At that point, the negotiation begins. Not for all players, only for a few that we want to resign and others we want to restructure.
Restructure:
Drew Brees
Lance Moore
Roman Harper
Curtis Lofton
Resign:
Jimmy Graham - Franchise Tag for one year to sign him fully next season
Cut:
Will Smith
Pierre Thomas
Patrick Robinson
Malcolm Jenkins (I think he still has another year for 1.6MM)
FA to sign:
Captain Munnerlyn, CB, Carolina Panthers - Young and might end up coming out cheap because of all the other CB's on the market that will land top dollar. (Grimes, Verner, Talib, Davis)
Michael Johnson, DE, Cincinnati Bengals - Why not? If only we can afford him too.
At that point, the negotiation begins. Not for all players, only for a few that we want to resign and others we want to restructure.
Restructure:
Drew Brees
Lance Moore
Roman Harper
Curtis Lofton
Resign:
Jimmy Graham - Franchise Tag for one year to sign him fully next season
Cut:
Will Smith
Pierre Thomas
Patrick Robinson
Malcolm Jenkins (I think he still has another year for 1.6MM)
FA to sign:
Captain Munnerlyn, CB, Carolina Panthers - Young and might end up coming out cheap because of all the other CB's on the market that will land top dollar. (Grimes, Verner, Talib, Davis)
Michael Johnson, DE, Cincinnati Bengals - Why not? If only we can afford him too.
5
Posted on 1/19/14 at 2:45 am to tadelatt
Jenkins is a free agent and we need PT. We probably beat Seattle with a healthy PT. No fumble or dropped balls by Ingram and Cadet.
Ingram really fricking shite the bed ... Between him and Payton calling screens, I dont know who cost us the fame more.
ETA: We need to cut Lance Moore. He misses too many games every season and we have a newer better version of him in Stills.
Ingram really fricking shite the bed ... Between him and Payton calling screens, I dont know who cost us the fame more.
ETA: We need to cut Lance Moore. He misses too many games every season and we have a newer better version of him in Stills.
This post was edited on 1/19/14 at 3:01 am
Posted on 1/19/14 at 3:33 am to tadelatt
Lance Moore
why would we restructure lance moore? You restructure guys that are going to be here a while by giving them their contract money in bonuses. I don't want him on the books, let him go.
I really like lance moore's game; but stills is a MUCH cheaper, serviceable version of lance moore. Plus, I can't fricking stand lance moore and all his post play antics. We will be down in a game and he's acting like a idiot.
why would we restructure lance moore? You restructure guys that are going to be here a while by giving them their contract money in bonuses. I don't want him on the books, let him go.
I really like lance moore's game; but stills is a MUCH cheaper, serviceable version of lance moore. Plus, I can't fricking stand lance moore and all his post play antics. We will be down in a game and he's acting like a idiot.
This post was edited on 1/19/14 at 3:35 am
Posted on 1/19/14 at 3:43 am to Pendulum
Completely agree to an extent. I love Moore for everything he's done, please stop fricking dancing and taunting when we're down in a game. The same goes to Graham as well.
This post was edited on 1/19/14 at 3:44 am
Posted on 1/19/14 at 8:30 am to LaBornNRaised
quote:
Jenkins is a free agent and we need PT. We probably beat Seattle with a healthy PT. No fumble or dropped balls by Ingram and Cadet.
That was Ingram's second career fumble. It sucked, but we probably win if Payton doesn't call all those stupid screens, which don't really work against Seattle at all.
Posted on 1/19/14 at 8:32 am to tadelatt
Patrick Robinson and Jenkins are UFA.
Unless you can get Roman restructured down to his dead money levels, I say just cut him loose.
Will Smith HAS to go.
Unless you can get Roman restructured down to his dead money levels, I say just cut him loose.
Will Smith HAS to go.
Posted on 1/19/14 at 8:53 am to tadelatt
Why in the frick would PT get cut??
Posted on 1/19/14 at 9:04 am to LaBornNRaised
quote:
we have a newer better version of him in Stills.
why are we assuming stills takes over this role? stills mostly played on the out and rarely went over the middle, which is where moore plays. if anything, I think they take a look at tanner to replace him.
Posted on 1/19/14 at 9:13 am to LaBornNRaised
I'll hop on the critique too...
Generating a list of restructure, re-sign, cut, etc without making a case is akin to the "Get Player X" threads with no more than "What do ya think?"
You want to cut PT23? Make a case! That's a thread in itself. The team's leading rusher, almost twice as many rushes as the next guy, one of the best screen pass receivers I have seen in my life, a great locker room guy, costing $2.9mil of cap... I'm not convinced.
Restructure Lofton? We have seen the result of continuously rolling cap money forward. Will Smith is the ultimate example. There is only $2mil & $1mil of dead money on Lofton for 2015 & 2016. Increasing that will only increase the amount the Saints are "stuck with him"- like Harper now. I'm more interested in the cap freedom than taking another $3mil hit for a guy that is no longer on the team.
Generating a list of restructure, re-sign, cut, etc without making a case is akin to the "Get Player X" threads with no more than "What do ya think?"
You want to cut PT23? Make a case! That's a thread in itself. The team's leading rusher, almost twice as many rushes as the next guy, one of the best screen pass receivers I have seen in my life, a great locker room guy, costing $2.9mil of cap... I'm not convinced.
Restructure Lofton? We have seen the result of continuously rolling cap money forward. Will Smith is the ultimate example. There is only $2mil & $1mil of dead money on Lofton for 2015 & 2016. Increasing that will only increase the amount the Saints are "stuck with him"- like Harper now. I'm more interested in the cap freedom than taking another $3mil hit for a guy that is no longer on the team.
Posted on 1/19/14 at 10:26 am to BlacknGold
quote:
why are we assuming stills takes over this role? stills mostly played on the out and rarely went over the middle, which is where moore plays. if anything, I think they take a look at tanner to replace him.
This.......Stills will be a vertical threat. He and Moore are not the same type of receiver. I agree that they may look at Tanner to replace Moore, or maybe at J Edelman (FA I believe) to replace Moore. Excellent Slot receiver who is a very good return man as well.
Posted on 1/19/14 at 10:57 am to infantry1026
You dont cut PT. I cwn get on board with trading Sproles. These aren't garbage running backs, we can get a late rounder for a Sproles and we could definitely get a good pick for PT but there is absolutely no reason I see us trying to do that. He is the best screen game running back in the league and that is a staple of Brees and Payton. Move along from the cut PT talk, please. You won't ever have me convinced.
Posted on 1/19/14 at 11:13 am to LSUSkip
I didn't say anything about cutting PT. I actually don't mind retaining PT....IF he restructures!
Sproles has lost a step and is not as effective; which is why I am advocating letting Moore go and signing Edelman to a contract. Edelman is a very good slot receiver and a good return man to replace Moore and Sproles.
Sproles was brought in to be the return guy and the main 3rd down back. He is definitely not getting the job done in the return game, and he became much less effective in the second half of the season out of the backfield.
Edelman can kill two birds with one stone regarding a slot receiver and return man. The 3rd down back can be filled either by Cadet or possibly another UDFA scat back.
Sproles has lost a step and is not as effective; which is why I am advocating letting Moore go and signing Edelman to a contract. Edelman is a very good slot receiver and a good return man to replace Moore and Sproles.
Sproles was brought in to be the return guy and the main 3rd down back. He is definitely not getting the job done in the return game, and he became much less effective in the second half of the season out of the backfield.
Edelman can kill two birds with one stone regarding a slot receiver and return man. The 3rd down back can be filled either by Cadet or possibly another UDFA scat back.
This post was edited on 1/19/14 at 11:15 am
Posted on 1/19/14 at 11:34 am to infantry1026
okay, we're $17mil-ish over the cap
Jimmy Graham needs to be paid along with figuring out if ya wanna pay Strief, Jenkins, dlP, etc. Whoever plays those spots will have to get paid.
The plan is to cut Sproles & Moore. That's a $4mil cap hit to do.
Then we sign Edelman. I dunno but let's ballpark that somewhere between Welker at $6mil a yr & Moore's 5yr/$20mil deal. That's $5mil a yr
So -$4mil cap for the cuts, another $5mil for Edelman, $9mil to the cap total to replace Sproles-Moore with Edelman.
Yeah, it's that easy! Cadet had ZERO carries and 2 catches for 5yds. That's almost Sproles-like.
And restructuring PT23?!?! All $2.9mil worth? We've pushed the limit of rolling contracts forward already. We need to do that with a 30 year old RB?
Jimmy Graham needs to be paid along with figuring out if ya wanna pay Strief, Jenkins, dlP, etc. Whoever plays those spots will have to get paid.
The plan is to cut Sproles & Moore. That's a $4mil cap hit to do.
Then we sign Edelman. I dunno but let's ballpark that somewhere between Welker at $6mil a yr & Moore's 5yr/$20mil deal. That's $5mil a yr
So -$4mil cap for the cuts, another $5mil for Edelman, $9mil to the cap total to replace Sproles-Moore with Edelman.
quote:
The 3rd down back can be filled either by Cadet or possibly another UDFA scat back
Yeah, it's that easy! Cadet had ZERO carries and 2 catches for 5yds. That's almost Sproles-like.
And restructuring PT23?!?! All $2.9mil worth? We've pushed the limit of rolling contracts forward already. We need to do that with a 30 year old RB?
Posted on 1/19/14 at 11:44 am to LSUSkip
quote:
You dont cut PT. I can get on board with trading Sproles
I'm the exact opposite. PT did NOTHING down the stretch, I'm only for keeping him if he is a pure backup and we don't use carries on him.
Posted on 1/19/14 at 11:54 am to Rand AlThor
I think peeps need to step back and look at PT23. He was fricking injured at the end of the year. He was even on the injury report the last 3 weeks of the regular season. He only had 6 carries per game the last 5.
How bout before that? Week 6-11 69 carries for 349yds, 5ypc. Oh, then there is the matter of 77 catches. We can pick up any old scat back that can do that.
This is as myopic of armchair GM-ing as I have seen around here. I'm all for taking a hit on non-producers or the overpaid but PT23 is neither.
How bout before that? Week 6-11 69 carries for 349yds, 5ypc. Oh, then there is the matter of 77 catches. We can pick up any old scat back that can do that.
This is as myopic of armchair GM-ing as I have seen around here. I'm all for taking a hit on non-producers or the overpaid but PT23 is neither.
Posted on 1/19/14 at 11:58 am to Rand AlThor
We don't need Cadet. I still don't know what he is doing on this team. Thomas was injured down the stretch, its hard to do something from the sidelines. As far as Moore goes, he gets the job done. Not as well ad he used to, but it'll cost you twice ad much to cut and replace him.IImagine how much will be done at that position when there's nobody to play that position. About as much production we got out of it when he was injured.
Posted on 1/19/14 at 12:03 pm to blueslover
quote:
blueslover
All very good points.....par for the course where you are concerned
I can agree with you that Edelman is possibly not feasible. If that is the case.....we could possibly draft a scat back late in the draft to take up the mantle regarding KR and PR. Sproles is not the same player and should not be paid as such.
Regarding the Cap.....ML will definitely have his work cut out for him this offseason. Some of the fat will have to be trimmed. Sproles and Moore are definitely making too much money for role players (especially when you have cap issues).
No matter what.....I would not expect a big FA signing (I don't think anyone is), but the offseason will still be interesting in regards to the way ML will have to juggle contracts to make it all work out.
Posted on 1/19/14 at 12:14 pm to infantry1026
We're always able to get a mid level guy or two, which suits this team. Other than Drew Brees and Jimmy Graham, there is no other "face of the franchise" and Jimmy Graham was drafted, not picked up in FA.
Its two superstars and a ton of mid level guys. Has us in the mix for the Super Bowl every year and IMO is as close to the Patriots model as you can get.
Its two superstars and a ton of mid level guys. Has us in the mix for the Super Bowl every year and IMO is as close to the Patriots model as you can get.
Posted on 1/19/14 at 12:17 pm to blueslover
quote:You're right, I just wonder how much he has left in the tank at this point.
This is as myopic of armchair GM-ing as I have seen around here. I'm all for taking a hit on non-producers or the overpaid but PT23 is neither.
Posted on 1/19/14 at 12:17 pm to infantry1026
fair enough, I'm prolly as anxious to see fat trimmed as anybody- prolly more so. The point on these I see is that you have to have a viable replacement. Sproles is still a matchup nightmare threat even if the actual production may be in decline. Replacing unique skillsets isn't as easy as just throwing Cadet (0 carries/2 catches).
Let's talk Harper. I'm not a fan. I'm ready to see a new face. BUT he's gonna count $3.7mil against the cap even to cut him. As much as I am tired of his weaknesses it still is a total team loss to have almost $4mil of your cap go down the drain. I'd love him back (in whatever role) at that same $3.7mil that yer gonna have to acct for anyway.
Minimizing dead money is essential. Most were glad to see Hartley & Chris Chamberlain go. Guess what? They still will cost $1.4mil of Saints cap in 2014.
Let's talk Harper. I'm not a fan. I'm ready to see a new face. BUT he's gonna count $3.7mil against the cap even to cut him. As much as I am tired of his weaknesses it still is a total team loss to have almost $4mil of your cap go down the drain. I'd love him back (in whatever role) at that same $3.7mil that yer gonna have to acct for anyway.
Minimizing dead money is essential. Most were glad to see Hartley & Chris Chamberlain go. Guess what? They still will cost $1.4mil of Saints cap in 2014.
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