Regardless of whether you believe in the legitimacy of IP or not | Page 10 | TigerDroppings.com

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Poodlebrain
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re: Regardless of whether you believe in the legitimacy of IP or not


So what other parts of the constitution should we just disregard as inconvenient? The fundamental law of the United States recognizes intellectual property and its value to society. If you think the law is wrong why aren't you trying to change the law instead of arguing why you should be able to ignore the law?

I have more respect for Metallica as Americans for trying to protect their property rights than I have for any of the people who criticize them. Being given the tools to commit a crime is not the same as being given permission to commit a crime. Why anyone would think otherwise reveals a weakness in their logical processes. If you can steal someone's intellectual property without remorse, then why should you complain if someone steals your iPod loaded with the stolen intellectual property? Does your storage medium deserve more protection than the contents? Why?






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ForeLSU
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The Corner of Sanity and Madness
Member since Sep 2003
34760 posts

re: Regardless of whether you believe in the legitimacy of IP or not


quote:

An idea doesn't exist in nature. It's an abstract. You can't own an idea.


true...however a software program solving a problem is no longer an idea but a tool. If the program is being used to grow better corn, I don't own the idea that corn can be better, but I do own the software I developed to effectuate the process. Doesn't mean you can't come up with your own corn improvement program. But if I license my solution to you, you're bound by the terms of that license.



This post was edited on 2/5 at 9:37 am


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joshnorris14
Florida Fan
Florida
Member since Jan 2009
21453 posts

re: Regardless of whether you believe in the legitimacy of IP or not


quote:

But if I license my solution to you, your bound by the terms of that license.


I agree






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joshnorris14
Florida Fan
Florida
Member since Jan 2009
21453 posts

re: Regardless of whether you believe in the legitimacy of IP or not


quote:

So what other parts of the constitution should we just disregard as inconvenient?


In all honesty, I'd prefer if people stopped using the Constitution in place of a well reasoned argument.

The Constitution says that Blacks should be considered as 3/5ths a person. Should we disregard that?






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ForeLSU
LSU Fan
The Corner of Sanity and Madness
Member since Sep 2003
34760 posts

re: Regardless of whether you believe in the legitimacy of IP or not


quote:

I agree


good, now correct my improper use of "your" in your quote






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Poodlebrain
LSU Fan
Way Right of Rex
Member since Jan 2004
15735 posts

re: Regardless of whether you believe in the legitimacy of IP or not


quote:

In all honesty, I'd prefer if people stopped using the Constitution in place of a well reasoned argument. The Constitution says that Blacks should be considered as 3/5ths a person. Should we disregard that?
The 13th, 14th and 15th Amendments corrected that, so yes, we must disregard blacks being 3/5th a person. Your failed argument proves the validity of my argument. We have methods to make corrections, and those methods work. You are just too lazy and impatient to try and correct what you feel are errors using the prescribed methods for doing so. If your arguments were so compelling you would have no trouble convincing the necessary majorities of the need to amend the constitution.






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joshnorris14
Florida Fan
Florida
Member since Jan 2009
21453 posts

re: Regardless of whether you believe in the legitimacy of IP or not


I don't really care about those methods. I prefer good reasoning in place of "but the Constitution says..."

Just because the Constitution says it doesn't make it good, and it also doesn't prevent it from being not enforced (IP in the future is nearly unenforceable).






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Poodlebrain
LSU Fan
Way Right of Rex
Member since Jan 2004
15735 posts

re: Regardless of whether you believe in the legitimacy of IP or not


quote:

I don't really care about those methods. I prefer good reasoning in place of "but the Constitution says..." Just because the Constitution says it doesn't make it good, and it also doesn't prevent it from being not enforced (IP in the future is nearly unenforceable).
So how did the constitution come to exist? Could there possibly have been some "good reasoning" put forth for each of the provisions, but you just don't quite have the "good reasoning" skills to recognize it? That's the only answer I come up with that makes sense.

ETA: Enforcement of intellectual property rights will not be unenforceable just as enforcement of tax laws are not unenforceable. Selective enforcement will be used to discourage widespread theft of intellectual property.



This post was edited on 2/5 at 10:08 am


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joshnorris14
Florida Fan
Florida
Member since Jan 2009
21453 posts

re: Regardless of whether you believe in the legitimacy of IP or not


quote:

So how did the constitution come to exist?


A group of gentleman preferred a stronger centralized government to the one they had at the time.

quote:

Could there possibly have been some "good reasoning" put forth for each of the provisions


It's quite possible, but it's irrelevant. Use good reasoning instead of the Constitution.

If I say, "Ban all guns", it is much better and more convincing to reason out why that is a bad idea than to say "But, the 2nd amendment prevents that."






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NC_Tigah
LSU Fan
Member since Sep 2003
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re: Regardless of whether you believe in the legitimacy of IP or not


quote:

I prefer good reasoning in place of "but the Constitution says..."
Perhaps you use terms "self-serving" and "good" interchangably?






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joshnorris14
Florida Fan
Florida
Member since Jan 2009
21453 posts

re: Regardless of whether you believe in the legitimacy of IP or not


The internet is an instant copy machine. Sorry if you think its very existence is the beginning of the end for your much revered "Intellectual Property," but it is, regardless of how much you hate it.

So adapt. Not that I have to tell you that for it to happen. You're human, so you'll adapt and thrive.

And it doesn't matter what I, Wiki, or you want, it's going to be the natural course of things.



This post was edited on 2/5 at 10:11 am


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NC_Tigah
LSU Fan
Member since Sep 2003
54172 posts

re: Regardless of whether you believe in the legitimacy of IP or not


quote:

The Constitution says that Blacks should be considered as 3/5ths a person. Should we disregard that?
That's esentially analogous to claiming a Salem law says witches can be executed. It does. Then again it is a law long since amended by the people.

The Constitution says it can be amended. That fact says your 3/5ths claim is silly.






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Poodlebrain
LSU Fan
Way Right of Rex
Member since Jan 2004
15735 posts

re: Regardless of whether you believe in the legitimacy of IP or not


Of course he does. And since all of his reasoning is by definition good, anyone who disagrees with him does not deserve any respect for their ideas. Also, good reasoning is a transient concept. What is a good idea today may become a bad idea the next day due to changing circumstances. So we become a society ruled by the whims of men situated to exercise good reasoning rather than a society governed by laws.

What our resident fool does not understand is that rules to control the processes for changing laws do not prevent good reasoning from occurring. In fact they amplify the need for good reasoning to justify changes.






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joshnorris14
Florida Fan
Florida
Member since Jan 2009
21453 posts

re: Regardless of whether you believe in the legitimacy of IP or not


Nevertheless, my claim that "Just because it is in the Constitution, doesn't make it a good and thoughtful initiative."

If my claim wasn't true, there would be no need for amending the Constitution. Should the government really be involved in mail? Back in the 1840's Lysander Spooner outperformed the US Postal Service by a large margin and was arrested for it.

The Constitution doesn't replace good reasoning is all I'm saying. So instead of bringing the Constitution into a discussion of whether IP is something that CAN remain in existence, one should explain why it could.






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joshnorris14
Florida Fan
Florida
Member since Jan 2009
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re: Regardless of whether you believe in the legitimacy of IP or not


This discussion has NOTHING to do with the fricking Constitution. NOTHING. I asked a question about the future of IP protection. The Constitution is irrelevant in that regard.

Just because the Constitution says that labels own the rights to music hasn't changed the fact that everyone uses P2P to download their favorite albums for free.






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NC_Tigah
LSU Fan
Member since Sep 2003
54172 posts

re: Regardless of whether you believe in the legitimacy of IP or not


quote:

The internet is an instant copy machine.
Is it?

Send me a copy of MS Word source code please. Perhaps a copy of Safari source code too. Hell, I'd settle for Cerner EMR code so we could work to fix that POS. Can you use your internet copy machine to get that for me? Teach me something. I'd appreciate it.







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Patrick O Rly
New Orleans Saints Fan
y u do dis?
Member since Aug 2011
38223 posts

re: Regardless of whether you believe in the legitimacy of IP or not


I think people forget just how leverage the music industry use to have. They had all the distribution. The internet actually helped the artist out a lot because they made very little off of music sales. The downloading of songs essentially became free advertisement for the artist who make the bulk of their money off of touring.





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joshnorris14
Florida Fan
Florida
Member since Jan 2009
21453 posts

re: Regardless of whether you believe in the legitimacy of IP or not


quote:

Is it?


Yes.

quote:

Send me a copy of MS Word source code please. Perhaps a copy of Safari source code too. Hell, I'd settle for Cerner EMR code so we could work to fix that POS. Can you use your internet copy machine to get that for me? Teach me something. I'd appreciate it.


What you have said doesn't disqualify what I'm saying.

If you upload a word document and torrent it, EVERYONE can have it. It is copied everywhere.

If you upload a picture, EVERYONE can have it.

If you put out an idea, EVERYONE can have it.

If you make music and upload it to Youtube, EVERYONE can have it.

And you still have your copy.






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WikiTiger
LSU Fan
Member since Sep 2007
40721 posts

re: Regardless of whether you believe in the legitimacy of IP or not


quote:

Send me a copy of MS Word source code please. Perhaps a copy of Safari source code too. Hell, I'd settle for Cerner EMR code so we could work to fix that POS.


just because there hasn't been a breach, doesn't mean there won't be.

give it time.

more and more information will continue to be released, and once the cat is out of the bag, there's no getting it back in.

that's the point of the thread that you simply don't understand.

there future is one where IP cannot survive







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ForeLSU
LSU Fan
The Corner of Sanity and Madness
Member since Sep 2003
34760 posts

re: Regardless of whether you believe in the legitimacy of IP or not


quote:

If you upload a word document and torrent it, EVERYONE can have it. It is copied everywhere.

If you upload a picture, EVERYONE can have it.

If you put out an idea, EVERYONE can have it.

If you make music and upload it to Youtube, EVERYONE can have it.


in everyone of these cases I'm sharing something the I've created, I don't really see an IP issue with that. Now if you torrent a copy of a piece of software you've purchased so that EVERYONE can have it...that's a problem.






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