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re: When will something actually get done to stop these islands from washing away?
Posted on 7/8/14 at 2:33 pm to Galactic Inquisitor
Posted on 7/8/14 at 2:33 pm to Galactic Inquisitor
quote:
They didn't do it with my permission. Just because they bought and paid for elected officials, and clearly continue to do so, it doesn't mean they don't have any responsibility.
Then go ahead and sue them as an individual and report back on how that works out for you.
Your beef is withe the governors and bureaucrats of the last 50 years (read EWE) Not Exxon. Not BP. Not Jindal (alone). The oil companies complied with the regs in place at that time. We have no case.
We can piss off the major employer and money producer for the region in the process though. And the state will still sink. figuratively and literally.
3
Posted on 7/8/14 at 2:34 pm to Galactic Inquisitor
quote:
They need us as much as we need them.
are you 10? Or are you just trolling?
Posted on 7/8/14 at 2:36 pm to Galactic Inquisitor
quote:
Worst trip every year is the first one in spring to see a little more of Last Island washed away
.............and Racoon..................
Posted on 7/8/14 at 2:37 pm to tigerinthebueche
quote:
The oil companies complied with the regs in place at that time.
No, they absolutely did not.
quote:
We have no case
There was actually a quite strong case, which is why the O&G companies paid a whole lot of money to get a law written to stop it from proceeding. Do you really think they would put that much money and effort into getting that law passed if they felt "we have no case"?
quote:
We can piss off the major employer and money producer for the region in the process though.
Well, I'm pissed off about all of the islands I fished growing up not existing anymore. Welcome to the club, O&G. Feeling emotions may justify being able to make large individual campaign contributions.
quote:
And the state will still sink. figuratively and literally.
The literal part you're okay with?
Posted on 7/8/14 at 2:38 pm to TJG210
quote:no
don't they just dump limestone, cover that with a tarp like material,
quote:yes. they use big dredging tankers to vacuum up sand off the seafloor then use a water cannon to directionally place the sand into a landmass. They then use vibrating machines to consolidate the land mass for construction.
sand
first LA doesnt have good clean sand for this to work.
second with the depth these dredgers need, they would never be able to get near enough to spray it.
These are the some of the big reasons it is so expensive here for this type of construction. Finding clean enough borrow material and transporting it from point A to point B
Posted on 7/8/14 at 2:38 pm to tigerinthebueche
quote:
are you 10? Or are you just trolling?
Yes, I'm 10. You got me. Everyone that disagrees with you is 10. Maybe that high ground you're standing on won't subside.
Posted on 7/8/14 at 2:40 pm to CarRamrod
quote:
yes. they use big dredging tankers to vacuum up sand off the seafloor then use a water cannon to directionally place the sand into a landmass. They then use vibrating machines to consolidate the land mass for construction.
first LA doesnt have good clean sand for this to work.
second with the depth these dredgers need, they would never be able to get near enough to spray it.
These are the some of the big reasons it is so expensive here for this type of construction. Finding clean enough borrow material and transporting it from point A to point B
Also, I'd be willing to bet they have a more stable base onto which to pour the sand. Subsidence would affect them, too.
Posted on 7/8/14 at 2:41 pm to tigerinthebueche
quote:more like 80.
Your beef is withe the governors and bureaucrats of the last 50 years
Posted on 7/8/14 at 2:45 pm to Galactic Inquisitor
quote:The whole "Finding clean enough borrow material" is a major context clue that we have shitty soils here in LA.
I'd be willing to bet they have a more stable base onto which to pour the sand
Subsidence is cause by the shitty soil
This post was edited on 7/8/14 at 2:46 pm
Posted on 7/8/14 at 2:47 pm to tigerinthebueche
quote:
The oil companies complied with the regs in place at that time. We have no case.
THis is not entirely accurate. Every lease has a clause that requires them, at some point in time, to restore the land to its original condition. Problem is, the government generally does not enforce it. Private landowners do, very often, and those claims have resulted in huge payouts, since the La. Supreme Court decided (correctly) that the money paid to restore is not limited to the value of the land. Plaquemines Parish School Board had several such claims for land it own, about 10-15 years ago. I don't know what happened, but assume they settled at some point.
No one is going to do anything about it because oil companies have shite loads of money, power and influence and there is a prevalent attitude of "they employ so many people, we can't piss them off". There is no reason they cannot fill in canals, clean up the land and put shite back how it was when they are finished with it. The only other option is to get rid of levees, which obviously isn't going to happen.
ETA - it's not entirely the O&G industry's fault. It's shared with the state/nation/COE in general for channeling the river. But no one can deny that O&G cutting thousands of miles of canals all over the coast and leaving trash all over the place does not contribute. Whether the canals were permitted or not, they are responsible for the canal and the effects it has.
This post was edited on 7/8/14 at 2:51 pm
Posted on 7/8/14 at 2:47 pm to Galactic Inquisitor
I'll make this as short as I can.
The LA coastline is an extremely complicated system. Hell just understanding the lower MS river is a monumental task in itself.
My background and research is more in the chemistry side of coastal systems, but I have a decent amount of knowledge on physical processes. We can't straight up apply the same techniques used in say FL for beach nourishment, because of the above mentioned reasons. There is a reason the Master Plan is a multi decade plan. If we were to rush in and simply "dump sand and stone" in these barrier systems, 15 years down the road we would all be screaming at the same people for wasting tax dollars on poor government planning and execution.
I know quite a few of the guys on here have much more coastal knowledge than I do (and I hope to hear your insight), and I'm not tying to blast anyone, but this is an extremely complex problem and if we're in it for the long haul, we must have patience
The LA coastline is an extremely complicated system. Hell just understanding the lower MS river is a monumental task in itself.
My background and research is more in the chemistry side of coastal systems, but I have a decent amount of knowledge on physical processes. We can't straight up apply the same techniques used in say FL for beach nourishment, because of the above mentioned reasons. There is a reason the Master Plan is a multi decade plan. If we were to rush in and simply "dump sand and stone" in these barrier systems, 15 years down the road we would all be screaming at the same people for wasting tax dollars on poor government planning and execution.
I know quite a few of the guys on here have much more coastal knowledge than I do (and I hope to hear your insight), and I'm not tying to blast anyone, but this is an extremely complex problem and if we're in it for the long haul, we must have patience
Posted on 7/8/14 at 2:48 pm to CarRamrod
quote:
Once we let the river change course to replenish the coast.
This is the only thing that can rebuild south east LA. The atchafalaya delta keeps expanding and silting in and we are washing away.
Posted on 7/8/14 at 2:49 pm to Galactic Inquisitor
quote:
Yes, I'm 10. You got me. Everyone that disagrees with you is 10. Maybe that high ground you're standing on won't subside
and overly dramatic, I see.
And in point of fact, the whole coast is subsiding and has been for years. I've been hearing about this since I was in grammar school 40 years ago. Yet GI is still there. Cocodrie is still there. Venice is still there. I don't deny the erosion or the effect of the coastal dredging. I do think its a fool's errand to try and sue the oil companies when more effective alternatives (already posted) are more easily attained.
Posted on 7/8/14 at 2:51 pm to tigerinthebueche
Fourchon beach used to extend a mile further into the gulf not too long ago
Jut saying
Jut saying
Posted on 7/8/14 at 2:53 pm to TJG210
There are a few companies building islands currently. I spoke with one CEO in BR about the process. It is incredibly expensive because of the equipment involved, but they have been building them
Posted on 7/8/14 at 2:54 pm to Galactic Inquisitor
quote:
why the O&G companies paid a whole lot of money to get a law written to stop it from proceeding
Really? Or had politicians who care enough not to piss on the biggest employers in the state. Unemployment is bad for the politicians.
Posted on 7/8/14 at 2:54 pm to tigerinthebueche
The oil companies could back fill every pipeline canal ever made and after a few storms it would wash away just like every beach refurbishment project on last island. Without new natural sediment there is nothing to keep the man made land from washing away. Just look at a map everything between the Atchafalaya and MS river is washing away there is nothing to keep the marsh healthy.
Posted on 7/8/14 at 2:55 pm to BrotherEsau
quote:
There is no reason they cannot fill in canals, clean up the land and put shite back how it was when they are finished with it.
except for the fact that the oil companies will deny the damage is their fault. I guarantee you you will not find a consensus that the oil companies are solely responsible for what has happened. Take the money we would spend on this suit and put it into restoration now. You still wont solve the problem anyway. You may buy some time, but you wont change anything. The best bet is to let the MR follow its natural course. And that sure as hell aint happening.
Posted on 7/8/14 at 2:57 pm to tigerinthebueche
Yep if there is a finger to point it is at the Corps of Engineers for diverting the MS river and starving off its natural tributaries most importantly bayou lafourche that feeds Terrebonne parish via bayou terrebonne.
Posted on 7/8/14 at 2:58 pm to TJG210
quote:
Really?
Absolutely.
quote:
Or had politicians who care
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