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Liberty Ammo Help (Conceal Carry)
Posted on 7/10/15 at 11:16 am
Posted on 7/10/15 at 11:16 am
Had someone highly recommend Liberty Ammunition to me the other day and it peaked my interest. I have a double stack in my rotation that I like to carry, so when he mentioned the weight difference (lighter) I liked what he said.
I know the differt material will change performance though and I wanted to see if someone had any experience to share. TIA
I know the differt material will change performance though and I wanted to see if someone had any experience to share. TIA
This post was edited on 7/10/15 at 11:32 am
5
Posted on 7/10/15 at 11:50 am to Langston
quote:
Had someone highly recommend Liberty Ammunition
It's what I use. Civil Defense in 9mm. I like the weight difference and I think the reduction in penetration is minimal at best. You'll have lots here who don't agree with me.
Posted on 7/10/15 at 11:52 am to Broke
quote:
It's what I use. Civil Defense in 9mm. I like the weight difference and I think the reduction in penetration is minimal at best
Thanks
quote:
You'll have lots here who don't agree with me.
That's okay, any advice is wanted and I will filter through it then. Just wanted to catch up with what's known and go from there.
Posted on 7/10/15 at 11:53 am to Langston
Expansion is good, penetration is not so good. Maybe 3"
ETA: And it's expansion is not as good as say a federal JHP that would probably have around a 7" expansion and probably a 9" penetration to vital organs. It's not as good a round but the trade off is ok for me.
ETA: And it's expansion is not as good as say a federal JHP that would probably have around a 7" expansion and probably a 9" penetration to vital organs. It's not as good a round but the trade off is ok for me.
This post was edited on 7/10/15 at 11:58 am
Posted on 7/10/15 at 11:59 am to Broke
quote:
Expansion is good
Great thing
quote:
penetration is not so good. Maybe 3"
I can see this being an issue. I don't want over penetration, but if 3" is right, that's really pushing it.
Posted on 7/10/15 at 12:02 pm to Langston
The round fragments more than a normal JHP because of the material, weight and deeper cavity in the hollow point, so that's kind of what I'm talking about with expansion.
Posted on 7/10/15 at 12:04 pm to Broke
quote:
The round fragments more than a normal JHP because of the material, weight and deeper cavity in the hollow point, so that's kind of what I'm talking about with expansion
I thought it would, but with the lighter round I'm not real sure what the velocity would do to counter.
Posted on 7/10/15 at 12:30 pm to Langston
quote:1. Assuming you have a 15 round mag, you're talking about reducing the weight by 3.4 ounces.
I have a double stack in my rotation that I like to carry, so when he mentioned the weight difference (lighter)
2. There's no way I'd accept reduced terminal performance to save carrying three friggin' ounces. I respectfully suggest buying a decent gunbelt that can support your weapon.
3. Do you know of a single major LE agency that issues this stuff ?? Until that happens, you'll be better off avoiding gimmicky products -- instead, use the ammo that the La. State Police, the FBI, or __________ major LE agency has decided is the most effective round.
Posted on 7/10/15 at 1:03 pm to dawg23
quote:
3. Do you know of a single major LE agency that issues this stuff ??
This is my exact line of thinking as well. If it was the most effective round at vital organ damage and trauma, why haven't any agencies adopted it? Because its performance is inferior. The same can be said about the RIP round. It's gimmicky.
That said, I carry Hornady Critical Defense standard pressure. It gives about 12-14" of penetration in a gel block with 4 layers of denim. This meets the standard set by the FBI.
Remember, the most likely things you will be hitting are bones and even more than likely you'll be shooting through someone's arm bones. The natural human defensive posture is putting your arms up in front of you over your vital organs. The FBI standard is designed to account for this.
A lot of people never take that into account and think 3" of penetration will be enough to pierce a ribcage and actually get to vital organs. This is also why I'm against birdshot for home defense.
While you don't want overpenetration, I would rather that over extreme underpenetration.
Posted on 7/10/15 at 1:19 pm to dawg23
quote:
1. Assuming you have a 15 round mag, you're talking about reducing the weight by 3.4 ounces.
The difference I was told was a lot more. Thanks
quote:
There's no way I'd accept reduced terminal performance to save carrying three friggin' ounces
Agree
quote:
you know of a single major LE agency that issues this stuff ?? Until that happens, you'll be better off avoiding gimmicky products -- instead, use the ammo that the La. State Police, the FBI, or __________ major LE agency has decided is the most effective round
Nope, don't know what any of them carry.
Posted on 7/10/15 at 1:21 pm to bapple
I agree with all of that.
I only shoot headshots so I'm good to go carrying Liberty.
I only shoot headshots so I'm good to go carrying Liberty.
Posted on 7/10/15 at 1:21 pm to bapple
quote:
I carry Hornady Critical Defense standard pressure
Me too
quote:
While you don't want overpenetration
This should be obvious, if ever needed in public or close quarters.
quote:
would rather that over extreme underpenetration.
Me too, but was just curious if the variances were much or not.
Posted on 7/10/15 at 1:47 pm to texag7
Yep I watched the video again and it penetrates IIIA body armor which is two levels higher than what cops normally wear.
Posted on 7/10/15 at 1:49 pm to Langston
I'll pass. 124 gr for me.
Posted on 7/10/15 at 2:22 pm to Langston
quote:
Me too, but was just curious if the variances were much or not.
I will say that lighter grain bullets will have less recoil. But in general, your first shot will be the most accurate and important shot anyway.
Posted on 7/10/15 at 2:39 pm to Langston
There are tons of great ammo that is tested and proven to work - pretty much all the good stuff in 9, 40, & 45.
Why try something new that when you want it to work might not? Why bet your life on a theory? Also, you need to cycle at least a hundred of them to prove them reliable.
Why try something new that when you want it to work might not? Why bet your life on a theory? Also, you need to cycle at least a hundred of them to prove them reliable.
Posted on 7/10/15 at 2:43 pm to Tigah in the ATL
quote:
Why try something new that when you want it to work might not? Why bet your life on a theory?
Couldn't agree more. I wasn't fimiliar with it and wanted to see others experience.
Posted on 7/10/15 at 2:55 pm to Langston
This was my primary Judge argument.
(altho clearly ok you you could guarantee a JTTF)
I shoot Cor-Bons
(altho clearly ok you you could guarantee a JTTF)
I shoot Cor-Bons
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