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Belgium A5 Info
Posted on 11/9/18 at 8:08 pm
Posted on 11/9/18 at 8:08 pm
I've got a Belgium A5 Magnum 12 (Full choke* 32" barrel) that I'd like to shoot a few ducks/geese with, but I'm not sure what's safe. It sounds like steel is a for sure no go. What about bismuth or anything else? Anyone with personal experience. I'd hate to mess up this gun.
9
Posted on 11/9/18 at 8:32 pm to speckledawg
You should be ok with bismuth, that's what I use in my A5 20 mag. Dont know about tungsten.
Posted on 11/9/18 at 9:28 pm to Duckhammer_77
I thought tungsten was harder than steel? So it would be worse
Posted on 11/9/18 at 9:40 pm to speckledawg
Browning says not to shoot steel but my dad has shot several cases through his with no bad side effects on the barrel that I can tell. 3” magnum Belgian made.
Posted on 11/9/18 at 10:07 pm to speckledawg
From the Browning website: See. No.3
1. WILL ACCEPT ALL CURRENT FACTORY STEEL SHOT LOADS:
All Browning shotguns with the Standard Invector, Invector-Plus or DS choke tube systems, However, we do not recommend the use of Invector full or extra full chokes with steel shot. They pattern too tightly, and sometimes result in a "blown" pattern.
2. WILL ACCEPT ALL CURRENT FACTORY STEEL SHOT LOADS EXCEPT THOSE WITH T, F, BB AND BBB SIZE SHOT:
The B-2000 and B-80 shotguns with conventional chokes (Non-Invector)
3. DO NO USE ANY STEEL SHOT LOADS:
The Belgian-made A-5, Superposed, Leige, and other Belgian Over/Under models, Double Automatic, American-made A-5 and all other models not listed in category 1 or 2. Note: Belgian Auto-5 barrels are interchangeable with the new Invector barrels which are made in Japan. With this new Invector barrel installed on the Belgian-made Auto-5 receiver, steel shot loads can be used.
1. WILL ACCEPT ALL CURRENT FACTORY STEEL SHOT LOADS:
All Browning shotguns with the Standard Invector, Invector-Plus or DS choke tube systems, However, we do not recommend the use of Invector full or extra full chokes with steel shot. They pattern too tightly, and sometimes result in a "blown" pattern.
2. WILL ACCEPT ALL CURRENT FACTORY STEEL SHOT LOADS EXCEPT THOSE WITH T, F, BB AND BBB SIZE SHOT:
The B-2000 and B-80 shotguns with conventional chokes (Non-Invector)
3. DO NO USE ANY STEEL SHOT LOADS:
The Belgian-made A-5, Superposed, Leige, and other Belgian Over/Under models, Double Automatic, American-made A-5 and all other models not listed in category 1 or 2. Note: Belgian Auto-5 barrels are interchangeable with the new Invector barrels which are made in Japan. With this new Invector barrel installed on the Belgian-made Auto-5 receiver, steel shot loads can be used.
Posted on 11/9/18 at 10:08 pm to Boston911
Grey Cloud baw!
Posted on 11/10/18 at 2:59 am to speckledawg
Do not shoot steel through an older fixed full shotgun. You will egg the barrel.
Bismuth should be fine since it is pretty soft. I wouldnt sholt tungsten or any other non tox load. Stick to bismutb
Bismuth should be fine since it is pretty soft. I wouldnt sholt tungsten or any other non tox load. Stick to bismutb
Posted on 11/10/18 at 6:16 am to speckledawg
There are tons of loose A5 barrels floating around. I would consider finding one with a more open choke for ducks.
Posted on 11/10/18 at 6:41 am to speckledawg
I would spend the extra dough and shoot the bismuth shells.
Better to be safe than ruin a barrel.
Better to be safe than ruin a barrel.
Posted on 11/10/18 at 10:01 am to Capital Cajun
Will probably try some bismuth. It won't be getting used much. May eventually pick up one of the invector barrels for it.
Posted on 11/10/18 at 10:14 am to ecb
quote:
I thought tungsten was harder than steel? So it would be worse
Lead is also more dense than steel shot
Posted on 11/10/18 at 10:26 am to speckledawg
It has something to do with how the barrels are choked. Same reason some full chokes say NO STEEL SHOT on them while other say STEEL SHOT OK. You should be able to shoot tungsten or bismuth out of the A5. Companies like hevi-metal make shells designed to be shot out of the old classic guns like you have.
Posted on 11/10/18 at 10:33 am to jrodfishin
Lead is a lot softer than steel, so it won’t hurt the barrels
Posted on 11/10/18 at 10:58 am to speckledawg
Either that or a fixed modified barrel. Should be pretty easy to find a fixed modified which would be fine for shooting steel.
Posted on 11/10/18 at 1:12 pm to speckledawg
I have a Jap May 12 that had a fixed full choke. Gunsmith opened to a “loose” modified. Works great. Killed a limit of ducks with it this morning.
Posted on 11/11/18 at 10:36 am to speckledawg
My dad has same gun. When steel became law he bought another barrel for it. I did same for my A5 light my grandpa gave me I love shooting those guns
Posted on 6/11/23 at 12:51 pm to dwr353
quote:
I have a Jap May 12 that had a fixed full choke. Gunsmith opened to a “loose” modified. Works great. Killed a limit of ducks with it this morning.
bumping this ancient thread, rather than making one. I'm getting mixed results online. For a 1985 Japanese Mag 12 with a 32" barrel that has ["special steel 2 3/4" -3"] stamped on the barrel right after the engraving is that referring to steel loads or the steel the gun is made with? Lots of people online in other threads/sites were going back and forth on whether it was just is referring to the steel used on the receiver and/or barrel or whether it was steel shot ready.
it doesn't have choke threads and im guessing 32" is full choke. I was always under the impression the Belgiums were the ones you weren't "supposed" to shoot steel shot with without modifying to a new barrel but the Japanese ones were fine, but 1985 was before the lead ban so it gives me pause.
So @dwr353 you still had to have them modify the barrel? As posted here, I know you can get newer barrels but the barrel is pristine on this and 32" barrels just seem awesome as an occasional duck gun. If all else itll just be a project gun or one more for the collection, but this place seems to have all the answers.
This post was edited on 6/11/23 at 12:53 pm
Posted on 6/11/23 at 2:06 pm to BorrisMart
Browning stamped Special Steel to indicate premium steel the barrels were made of, not steel shot safe. My Mag 12 was Japanese made and had harder barrels than Belgian. My gunsmith claimed if you used smaller shot sizes you "should" be ok shooting in the full choke. I had mine opened up to Skeet 2 and hunted with it for 20 years with no barrel issues. I personally would not use steel in the Belgian barrel especially Full. Carson's Barrels on the web has used barrels for sale. The inventory changes as to what he gets in. What you have may be perfect for Bismuth as it usually works better with tight choke constrictions. I tried 20 gauge Boss shells last year and was very pleased with their performance. I got in a case of Boss 16 gauge shells last week to use in my Sweet 16 and my old Winchester Model 12 in 16 gauge. Congrats on having the best semiautomatic shotgun ever made!
Posted on 6/11/23 at 2:25 pm to dwr353
I will add that I have two barrels for my Sweet 16. A Modified for lead and a Full I opened up to Skeet 2 over 30 years ago. I have shot steel #4s in it for 30 years off and on with no barrel damage. Never shot steel in the Modified.
Posted on 6/11/23 at 3:44 pm to dwr353
quote:
Browning stamped Special Steel to indicate premium steel the barrels were made of, not steel shot safe. My Mag 12 was Japanese made and had harder barrels than Belgian. My gunsmith claimed if you used smaller shot sizes you "should" be ok shooting in the full choke. I had mine opened up to Skeet 2 and hunted with it for 20 years with no barrel issues. I personally would not use steel in the Belgian barrel especially Full. Carson's Barrels on the web has used barrels for sale. The inventory changes as to what he gets in. What you have may be perfect for Bismuth as it usually works better with tight choke constrictions. I tried 20 gauge Boss shells last year and was very pleased with their performance. I got in a case of Boss 16 gauge shells last week to use in my Sweet 16 and my old Winchester Model 12 in 16 gauge. Congrats on having the best semiautomatic shotgun ever made!
Thanks for the quick response, I appreciate it. I have a newer model a5 I hunt with some like a 2016 or something but it doesn't come close to the feeling of the older ones and I have started wanting to pick up more wooden and older shotguns when I come across them just because. I assumed that the steel stamp was for the gun, but couldn't get a super clear answer, but did see where people were saying bismuth would be ok. I'll probably pick up a new barrel to be safe, and it would be a fun gun to shoot buckshot with deer hunting.
To the post above, I appreciate that comment as well. I came across a ton of people saying they've ran cases of steel through pre steel shot A5's and had no problems with certain sized loads.
Sorry for the old bump but the info is much appreciated.
This post was edited on 6/11/23 at 3:47 pm
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