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Started By
Message
re: The Hurricane Katrina "Certain Death; Catastrophic Damage" warning.
Posted on 8/29/16 at 12:05 pm to MightyYat
Posted on 8/29/16 at 12:05 pm to MightyYat
quote:
An LSU criminologist actually studied the stats form 2006-2009. Take a look at what he found. I'm sure it was all the big, bad NOLA thugs causing the "225s" to act up. In fact, the "225s" didn't even exist prior to 8/29/05.
First, you are assuming an awful lot about what I posted. I never said that the folks came in from New Orleans and started killing everyone. I said there was a big spike in murders and crimes. There was. There was also a tremendous amount of assaults and the like that were attributable to what can only be described as gangs of groups from the Baton Rouge area, vs groups from the New Orleans area. Again, I'm not sure what exactly a criminologist was able to witness from his office at LSU, but I never once saw him at a fight on Ned avenue at midnight.
There is without a doubt a criminal element in Baton Rouge that are native to the area. The amount of crimes that they perpetrated went up in the interim after Katrina. There was also a small element of folks who were from New Orleans that came to Baton Rouge and committed crimes. Some of those crimes were against each other specifically because they were from different areas. None of those facts are debatable. I'd imagine there are other stories like this from Houston and other areas. There was additional life lost due to the storm, and not just from the storm surge that won't be measured or counted in the losses.
1
Posted on 8/29/16 at 12:20 pm to Fratigerguy
quote:
First, you are assuming an awful lot about what I posted. I never said that the folks came in from New Orleans and started killing everyone. I said there was a big spike in murders and crimes. There was. There was also a tremendous amount of assaults and the like that were attributable to what can only be described as gangs of groups from the Baton Rouge area, vs groups from the New Orleans area. Again, I'm not sure what exactly a criminologist was able to witness from his office at LSU, but I never once saw him at a fight on Ned avenue at midnight.
There is without a doubt a criminal element in Baton Rouge that are native to the area. The amount of crimes that they perpetrated went up in the interim after Katrina. There was also a small element of folks who were from New Orleans that came to Baton Rouge and committed crimes. Some of those crimes were against each other specifically because they were from different areas. None of those facts are debatable. I'd imagine there are other stories like this from Houston and other areas. There was additional life lost due to the storm, and not just from the storm surge that won't be measured or counted in the losses.
Crime absolutely went up in Baton Rouge. It went up in Houston too. You essentially doubled the population of Baton Rouge. People were testy. However, you said "and countless lives lost after it that were a direct result of so many being displaced will never be attributed to the storm." You see, the problem is they do keep track of things like murder. In 2005 BR listed 49 murders. In 2006 it was 56. 2007 got up to 72. I can assure you that most of the population was out of BR by 2007. I know because my department was involved heavily in finding housing for the indigent population. BR can only pin so much on the 504s.
eta: I was at the PMAC triaging patients and some of the stories were insane. One woman was genuinely terrified because she heard they were raping women in the streets around the River Center. Another group of people tried to barricade themselves inside our Rx unit because of a rumor of some type of foreign black op type unit coming in off the river. It was crazy times.
This post was edited on 8/29/16 at 12:27 pm
Posted on 8/29/16 at 12:23 pm to MightyYat
quote:
Crime absolutely went up in Baton Rouge. It went up in Houston too.
Very temporarily
And then quickly went back down to below the pre-Katrina numbers.
Houston loves using Katrina as a cause for their problems despite the stats saying otherwise.
Posted on 8/29/16 at 12:25 pm to Fratigerguy
quote:
But don't fricking think for one minute that because you go to your office job and go home to your subdivision that this wasn't a problem because you didn't see it.
Posted on 8/29/16 at 12:49 pm to Roll Tide Ravens
We read this aloud on the air at the radio station many times that night. We got calls from people saying it was a scare tactic. Obviously before it hit cause everything (equipment and towers) in Chalmette got wiped out @ 6:42 am.
This is always a rough day for me. That National Weather Service warning had everyone at the station in a holy hell what's going to happen mode
This is always a rough day for me. That National Weather Service warning had everyone at the station in a holy hell what's going to happen mode
Posted on 8/29/16 at 2:54 pm to MightyYat
quote:
You see, the problem is they do keep track of things like murder. In 2005 BR listed 49 murders. In 2006 it was 56. 2007 got up to 72. I can assure you that most of the population was out of BR by 2007.
Wasn't aware Baton Rouge was the only landing place for refugees from Nola. Hmmm maybe they were actually displaced all across the country and we have no idea how many there actually were...aka countless.
quote:
BR can only pin so much on the 504s.
Again, no one tried to pin anything on the 504s, except what you were trying to infer I was saying.
Posted on 8/29/16 at 3:16 pm to Fratigerguy
quote:
Wasn't aware Baton Rouge was the only landing place for refugees from Nola. Hmmm maybe they were actually displaced all across the country and we have no idea how many there actually were...aka countless.
No, this is what you said. If you want to start talking about other areas of the country let's do it. Every major city all the way down to the smallest town keeps track of murders. Let's see how high your imaginary body count stacks up. Give me some cities.
quote:
The gang "wars" that ensued in the BR area, and countless lives lost after it that were a direct result of so many being displaced will never be attributed to the storm. The "225s vs the 504s"....fun times for public safety in Baton Rouge for years after.
quote:
Again, no one tried to pin anything on the 504s, except what you were trying to infer I was saying.
Except see above.
Let's look at Houston.
YEAR / MURDERS
2002 - 256
2003 - 278
2004 - 272
2005 - 334
2006 - 377
2007 - 351
2008 - 294
Now, here' what their study found out about the crime. Do you honestly believe Nola sent it's best assassins to these places?
LINK
quote:
First, he saw that in Houston there was, in fact, a statistically significant increase in certain violent crimes — homicides and robbery — in the aftermath of the storm. But other violent crimes, like aggravated assault and rape, didn't tick up in the same way. The number of property crimes like burglary, auto theft and arson didn't change significantly either.
Second, Varano found that San Antonio and Phoenix didn't have the same types of crime trends as Houston post-Katrina, even though they also received evacuees. In Phoenix, only homicide numbers changed, but robbery figures didn't. In San Antonio, crime levels were essentially unchanged.
The two discoveries seemed to undermine the premise of leaders who blamed Houston crime on Katrina evacuees.
If a bunch of violent New Orleans residents were taking over the streets of Houston, it would be unlikely they'd commit homicide but not other crimes.
And if evacuees were really driving a crime wave, then all three cities likely would have seen similar patterns, even if they weren't of the same magnitude.
"The fact that we saw the trend in homicide is important and notable, but what our data show is a more tempered picture," Varano said. "The idea that there was a crime epidemic — I believe that's overrated."
He added that if the conversation had focused on Houston's homicide rate — the number of homicides that occur for every 100,000 residents — there's a good chance it didn't increase at all. After all, larger cities tend to have more crimes. And Houston became much larger overnight. But because it's unclear exactly what Houston's population was following Katrina, it's impossible to know the true crime rate.
Posted on 8/29/16 at 3:51 pm to MightyYat
For NOLA... here's the warning I think most people never heard yet should've heard the loudest
NOLA Flash Flood Warning... official confirmation of 1st levee breach
ETA: Bill Capo on WWL TV was working as a meteorologist to give the regular meteorologists a break... he interrupted an interview and read this warning... but then they went back to the interview instead of talking about the levee breach... I don't think it really registered what he just read
NOLA Flash Flood Warning... official confirmation of 1st levee breach
quote:
BULLETIN - EAS ACTIVATION REQUESTED
FLASH FLOOD WARNING
NATIONAL WEATHER SERVICE NEW ORLEANS LA
814 AM CDT MON AUG 29 2005
THE NATIONAL WEATHER SERVICE IN NEW ORLEANS HAS ISSUED A
* FLASH FLOOD WARNING FOR...
ORLEANS PARISH IN SOUTHEAST LOUISIANA
THIS INCLUDES THE CITIES OF...NEW ORLEANS
ST. BERNARD PARISH IN SOUTHEAST LOUISIANA
THIS INCLUDES THE CITY OF CHALMETTE
* UNTIL 215 PM CDT
* A LEVEE BREACH OCCURRED ALONG THE INDUSTRIAL CANAL AT TENNESSE
STREET. 3 TO 8 FEET OF WATER IS EXPECTED DUE TO THE BREACH.
* LOCATIONS IN THE WARNING INCLUDE BUT ARE NOT LIMITED TO ARABI AND
9TH WARD OF NEW ORLEANS.
DO NOT DRIVE YOUR VEHICLE INTO AREAS WHERE THE WATER COVERS THE
ROADWAY. THE WATER DEPTH MAY BE TOO GREAT TO ALLOW YOUR CAR TO CROSS
SAFELY. VEHICLES CAUGHT IN RISING WATER SHOULD BE ABANDONED QUICKLY.
MOVE TO HIGHER GROUND.
A FLASH FLOOD WARNING MEANS THAT FLOODING IS IMMINENT OR OCCURRING.
IF YOU ARE IN THE WARNING AREA MOVE TO HIGHER GROUND IMMEDIATELY.
RESIDENTS LIVING ALONG STREAMS AND CREEKS SHOULD TAKE IMMEDIATE
PRECAUTIONS TO PROTECT LIFE AND PROPERTY. DO NOT ATTEMPT TO CROSS
SWIFTLY FLOWING WATERS OR WATERS OF UNKNOWN DEPTH BY FOOT OR BY
AUTOMOBILE.
LAT...LON 2992 9012 2994 9003 2987 8987 3001 8985
3004 8982 3008 8993 3002 9012
$$
ETA: Bill Capo on WWL TV was working as a meteorologist to give the regular meteorologists a break... he interrupted an interview and read this warning... but then they went back to the interview instead of talking about the levee breach... I don't think it really registered what he just read
This post was edited on 8/29/16 at 3:59 pm
Posted on 8/29/16 at 3:58 pm to Michael Stein
quote:
My dad was 16 when Camille hit southeastern LA in the middle of the night. He still has nightmares about it.
Me and my family were hauling arse from Destin to New Orleans about 6 hours before land fall, passing thru Gulf Port. I was 15 at the time and had never saw my dad scared till that day.
Posted on 8/29/16 at 4:05 pm to fishfighter
Others brought up the Tuscaloosa tornado...
Radar images are a freakingly hypnotizing thing... someone posted the image of Katrina earlier... here's the radar image of the Tuscaloosa tornado on the left w/ a look showing the debris ball on the right
Radar images are a freakingly hypnotizing thing... someone posted the image of Katrina earlier... here's the radar image of the Tuscaloosa tornado on the left w/ a look showing the debris ball on the right
Posted on 8/29/16 at 4:16 pm to MountainTiger
quote:
Betsy would be a better comparison to Katrina than Camille as far as New Orleans is concerned. If you look at the old photos of New Orleans flooding after Betsy, they're identical to the ones of Katrina. Mississippi took the worst of Camille along with Washington & St. Tammany Parishes.
This. Our house took on 6' of water from Betsy. Mom and Dad woke us up in the middle of the night as water came in. They put the six of us kids in a boat. We sat there till day light then moved to high ground.
Posted on 8/29/16 at 4:43 pm to danfraz
quote:
We got calls from people saying it was a scare tactic.
I think that bulletin came from a series of NWS bulletin scripts pre-written in the 1980s (or perhaps even going back to the 1970's). The meteorologist in charge could select the applicable one for whatever category of storm that the warned area was facing.
This post was edited on 8/29/16 at 4:45 pm
Posted on 8/29/16 at 6:24 pm to Theboot32
Just finished radio lab playing god.
Wow, one of the best pieces on radio I heard in a long time.
Wow, one of the best pieces on radio I heard in a long time.
Posted on 8/29/16 at 8:44 pm to rt3
A buddy of mine and his grandmother survived the tornado living right by the main DCH in the Highlands neighborhood which I grew up in as well.
He said it sounded like the Underground Railroad with all the folks walking out of Alberta City after it happened that late afternoon
He said it sounded like the Underground Railroad with all the folks walking out of Alberta City after it happened that late afternoon
Posted on 8/30/16 at 6:27 am to SomethingLikeA
If only there was some type of warning, maybe they could have evacuated. Sorry for your loss.
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