re: Getting solar panels today!!

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And people with solar are helping the environment and saving tax payers from having more power plants built. Less oil being imported or whatever method particular places get their energy.

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Just an fyi, oil isn't used to create electricity.
Coal makes up 40%, nuclear 20%, Renewable 15%
natural gas is 25%
solar is 0.2%

Solar sucks if you ask me. The technology behind it sucks. Our battery technology sucks too. When those technologies get much better, we'll be better off Using it.

Also I see nothing negative about a new power plant being built. Tons of jobs, tons of contractor work. Tons of equipment sales.

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every penetration would have to hit a rafter.

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Any installer worth their salt can and will only go into your roof rafters. If you have asphalt, they can use Quick Mount and it will not void your warranty.

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(Admittedly, shingle warranties are pretty weak to start with.)

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Exactly. Again, use a reputable installer and they will give you a 10 year install warranty. A 25 year roof warranty is a joke. Try to get a warranty repair after the labor warranty is gone from the roofer.

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Then, what do the panels do under wind load?

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Stainless steel hurricane rated bolts are rated for 135 mph.

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I'm not too concerned with the extra weight, but that s a consideration.

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Again, as long as the go into the rafters you have no problem.

Lemme guess..

They installed a ~7KW system and it magically costs $25k? But he always brought up the.. "But it only costs you $5K after rebates!" Every system I've seen quoted by solar companies are ~7KW and always cost $25K.

...and they always give you a very conservative power output which virtually guarantees your output never drops below the estimate.

My guess is the equipment: panels, inverters (and I assumed micro inverters), roof brackets and install hardware costs the installer about $12,000 at most. Meaning you're getting charged $13,000 in installation/profit charges.

I looked into having solar panels installed. With over 35 years in the power industry, I kind of knew what is what. The last company I worked for had built a solar plant. If it wasn't for the tax credits to offset carbon output from other plants, they would of never invested a 100 million bucks.

When I had a guy come to the house for the BS of installing, I started asking all the right questions. He left with his tail in between his legs.

Do the systems work? Yes, they do. Do they really have the output as stated? Yes, but over time they start to break down. Then one has to have them clean often. That is one of the catches they hit you with on service calls. Battery back up systems, over time the batteries will have o be changed out. Big bucks for that. Kind of looking at replacing them about every 5-6 years. Read the fine print on the contracts. They are only covered X amount of time. Not 25 years.

Over all, yes, I'm all for solar power, but it still has a long way to go before I would install it on my house. And yes, I'm all for the tax breaks people get for installing them. Those tax breaks are good. They are NOT any monies going out of anybody's pocket. It's a credit, nothing more, nothing less.

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You sure about that? Willing to wager that nobody does?

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Yep
maybe indirectly, but sure as shite not directly. Maybe b/c diesel comes from oil, and we sometimes use diesel generators as backups at times, which is an enormous waste of money, but it's a backup system, and a rare one at that.

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Solar sucks if you ask me.


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The technology behind it sucks.

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If it was so great, than we should have solar panels just lined up in the barren parts of this country sucking in free energy, but we don't, b/c it's expensive, not efficient, and it sucks.

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Can't completely laugh you off screen for this part, but battery tech has come quite a ways. But why waste time telling a know it all like you?

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Oh it has? how come i can't have a phone that last more than 24 hours.
Why can't we come anymore close to understanding how to store energy?
Until we come out with a new technology to store energy, we will be in the stone age when it comes to battery tech. We've done little to nothing in two years compared to where we need to be.

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Also I see nothing negative about a new power plant being built.

Of course you don't.

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So you have an argument to what i said?
So an area needs more power support and you think the idea of building a new power plant is bad? what's your alternative? Are you upset about the pollution that flys out the smokestacks at these big plants? Just an fyi if you didn't know, it's usually steam you see billowing out, not pollution.

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2200 sq ft house.
The lowest my bill will ever be will be $11 because that is what Cleco charges for fees. The highest my summer bills got was $140s with solar. Without solar it was $270s.

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Wow, that is high.

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Oh it has? how come i can't have a phone that last more than 24 hours. Why can't we come anymore close to understanding how to store energy? Until we come out with a new technology to store energy, we will be in the stone age when it comes to battery tech. We've done little to nothing in two years compared to where we need to be.

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Not everything that exist is made available to the public. There is battery tech right now that could make the power companies obsolete but its not going to happen anytime soon. Current energy is on-demand and not efficient but if we were to incorporate storage and capture all that excess energy created then we would see change.

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There's just not a lot of info out there on battery tech. Who's working on it?

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I know Elon Musk is


ETA: Here is the LINK. If anyone can make batteries for your home work it is this dude.

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Solar does suck. How can you defend something that is not economically feasible without HUGE subsidies.

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Another O&G clown.

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Solar cant compete with regular, open market electricity.

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It already is. California for example does not have a state tax credit. The people who do solar in CA are only getting their own federal tax dollars credited. They aren't taking from you.

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I too see nothing wrong with building another power plant.

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Of course you don't.

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Why use Chinese built solar panels.

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So you think the only solar panels are made in China? Do you realize some of the best selling and best made, that also sell very well are made in the good ole USofA?

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California is a train wreck.

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Kinda of agree there but you think that's because of solar?

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I bet electricity is expensive in Hawaii. But you chose to live there.

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Solar pays for itself in every state, some quicker than others. Education helps, spouting something you heard from someone else makes you look foolish.

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I started asking all the right questions.

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Would you mind sharing just a few of those questions?

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Yes, but over time they start to break down.

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Is that not abundantly clear that they degrade over time? The warranties on good panels (frick Chinese made) are 25 years and guarantee 25 years at 80%, usually as high as 90-95% over the first 10.

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Then one has to have them clean often. That is one of the catches they hit you with on service calls.

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Sounds like you talked to someone really shady.

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Battery back up systems, over time the batteries will have o be changed out. Big bucks for that. Kind of looking at replacing them about every 5-6 years.

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Many batteries are up to 10 years now. But yes, battery tech has some ways to go, but as Placebeaux writes above, there is unreal tech out there. If you care to look, look into liquid sulfur, look into liquid metal there's a TED talk about it. There's stuff out there now that is able to blow the doors off.

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Read the fine print on the contracts.

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I would hope you do. Leases can be a bad deal, some are good.

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They are only covered X amount of time. Not 25 years.

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Again, sounds like you talked to an asshat and took his "presentation" to mean all are the same. The warranties are 25 years on panels and most inverters. The labor will be 10 years. Companies will charge $50-75 to come out. Panels usually don't fail if you use good ones. Inverters can fail so let's say 10 inverters go out after the initial 10 year labor warranty, then you pay $750 in 25 years for some work. And most people don't have 10 inverters go out.

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Over all, yes, I'm all for solar power, but it still has a long way to go before I would install it on my house. And yes, I'm all for the tax breaks people get for installing them. Those tax breaks are good. They are NOT any monies going out of anybody's pocket. It's a credit, nothing more, nothing less.

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Only thing I don't agree with is the "long way to go" but the rest of your post gives me great hope for you