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Message
This draft was a make-up for last year's debacle
Posted on 5/3/15 at 5:09 pm
Posted on 5/3/15 at 5:09 pm
In reflecting over this past draft, and being one of many surprised that we kept all our picks (the only trade being a small trade up into the 5th round); one thing stands out - this was an attempt to right the wrong that was the 2014 Draft.
Last year we entered the draft thinking we were one player away from a super bowl - a wide receiver. We drafted Cooks, and I'm still excited to see what he will bring after a rookie season cut short by injury. But after that pick, things went south.
The jury is out on SJB, but the selection of two corners in 2015 makes one wonder just how big a fail selecting SJB was. Training camp cannot get here soon enough for us to find out.
Fortte and Rooks were huge misses. Powell and Sunseri are essentially special team players and while both contributed, they were still puzzling picks.
This draft made up for last year, and we drafted smart, tough players who were not only ready to come in and play but also contribute positively to the locker room. For the most part, all are known as high character players and leaders.
The Saints got better this weekend, and while there weren't make splashes or "sexy" picks, we selected players that give us a chance to win now and for the future.
Draft Grade: Incomplete. Just like all the grades should be.
Last year we entered the draft thinking we were one player away from a super bowl - a wide receiver. We drafted Cooks, and I'm still excited to see what he will bring after a rookie season cut short by injury. But after that pick, things went south.
The jury is out on SJB, but the selection of two corners in 2015 makes one wonder just how big a fail selecting SJB was. Training camp cannot get here soon enough for us to find out.
Fortte and Rooks were huge misses. Powell and Sunseri are essentially special team players and while both contributed, they were still puzzling picks.
This draft made up for last year, and we drafted smart, tough players who were not only ready to come in and play but also contribute positively to the locker room. For the most part, all are known as high character players and leaders.
The Saints got better this weekend, and while there weren't make splashes or "sexy" picks, we selected players that give us a chance to win now and for the future.
Draft Grade: Incomplete. Just like all the grades should be.
This post was edited on 5/3/15 at 11:27 pm
6
Posted on 5/3/15 at 5:15 pm to LSUZombie
How do you know this makes up for 2014. Weren't people happy with last year's draft at this point?
Posted on 5/3/15 at 5:16 pm to LSUZombie
quote:
Draft Grade: Incomplete. Just like all the grades should be.
I agree here. This draft has a shitload of potential and could be a huge turning point for our organization. If everyone pans out (mostly just Peat, Anthony, Kikaha, and Williams) this will be a huge success.
Hopefully we keep drafting like this. Stockpile offensive line and defensive talent. So that way Grayson or whoever will have a beastly offensive line and a dominant defense behind him once Brees is gone.
But as of right now, we have no idea if we just hit a home run or if it was a giant shite storm again. But i do like the way we are drafting now.
This post was edited on 5/3/15 at 5:18 pm
Posted on 5/3/15 at 5:19 pm to Jake88
quote:
How do you know this makes up for 2014. Weren't people happy with last year's draft at this point?
I don't know better than anyone else. All I can go on is that we selected players who were productive in college while also being leaders on the field.
And I think most were happy with last year's draft because, like myself and many others, we genuinely believed this team was super bowl bound. We were all very wrong, and having such a poor class certainly hindered us
Posted on 5/3/15 at 5:58 pm to LSUZombie
I agree with most of what you said. I am happy with every pick we took. If I could change anything, I would just take DVP at 13 instead of Peat BUT I understand the necessity of the Peat pick and I have come to terms with it, it was probably the best choice in the end.
You did not touch one one other thing - Grayson. While the other 8 picks were necessary depth/future contributors, this pick is a little different. We have potentially just chosen the future of this franchise. Monumental. Really happy. Let's get it
You did not touch one one other thing - Grayson. While the other 8 picks were necessary depth/future contributors, this pick is a little different. We have potentially just chosen the future of this franchise. Monumental. Really happy. Let's get it
Posted on 5/3/15 at 5:59 pm to LSUZombie
quote:
Powell and Sunseri are essentially special team players and while both contributed, they were still puzzling picks.
I'm not sure I ever saw Powell step foot on the field. Sunsieri was a get. Kid just knows how to play.
Posted on 5/3/15 at 7:03 pm to REG861
Powell had a few plays last year. After his injuries, he basically had a redshirt season. I'm hoping he gets some PT this year and lives up to his potential. If that's the case, we got a steal.
Posted on 5/3/15 at 7:25 pm to LSUZombie
Debacle? Why does everyone continue to overreact like this? Here's the facts.
We got a potential stud WR in the first. Definitely on track.
We got what we knew was a project CB in the second. This pick will determine if this was a good draft or just a meh one.
We got a guy that looked very promising in the offseason and preseason in the fourth but flamed out because of work ethic. So we took a shot here and it didn't pan out. But it was a fourth not a first, second, or even a third. The physical evaluation was spot on though.
We got two core special teams players in the fifth. That's exactly what you are looking for in that round (or quality backups on the lines; those guys rarely play special teams). Sunseri actually looks like a potentially great backup, which is what you hope they become but can't be sure. Powell actually started getting snaps towards the end as well and shows some promise.
And then we took a guy to compete for a backup tackle spot in the sixth. These guys have no special teams value so it's win the backup job or go home. Not a big loss here. There are tons of 6th and 7th rounders every year (as well as 5th rounders) that don't make teams. We were spoiled by a few gems into thinking every late pick should make the team.
And I strongly disagree with the notion many thought we were one player away (or if we were that it was a wr).
Many people felt CB was a huge hole but we thought between Bailey, Robinson, and White that one of them would step up.
And we all knew our LBs were weak but we were hoping that Byrd, Vaccaro, and Lewis plus our line would mask that some. I was still slamming my fist for a cover LB though.
And then there was the question of backup LT that we hoped wouldn't come into play but did. And let's not forget the hole at C we thought could have been filled by Goodwin or Lelito.
So no we were far from one player away and WR was one of our better spots. We had a lot of guys we were hoping on and they all let us down.
We got a potential stud WR in the first. Definitely on track.
We got what we knew was a project CB in the second. This pick will determine if this was a good draft or just a meh one.
We got a guy that looked very promising in the offseason and preseason in the fourth but flamed out because of work ethic. So we took a shot here and it didn't pan out. But it was a fourth not a first, second, or even a third. The physical evaluation was spot on though.
We got two core special teams players in the fifth. That's exactly what you are looking for in that round (or quality backups on the lines; those guys rarely play special teams). Sunseri actually looks like a potentially great backup, which is what you hope they become but can't be sure. Powell actually started getting snaps towards the end as well and shows some promise.
And then we took a guy to compete for a backup tackle spot in the sixth. These guys have no special teams value so it's win the backup job or go home. Not a big loss here. There are tons of 6th and 7th rounders every year (as well as 5th rounders) that don't make teams. We were spoiled by a few gems into thinking every late pick should make the team.
And I strongly disagree with the notion many thought we were one player away (or if we were that it was a wr).
Many people felt CB was a huge hole but we thought between Bailey, Robinson, and White that one of them would step up.
And we all knew our LBs were weak but we were hoping that Byrd, Vaccaro, and Lewis plus our line would mask that some. I was still slamming my fist for a cover LB though.
And then there was the question of backup LT that we hoped wouldn't come into play but did. And let's not forget the hole at C we thought could have been filled by Goodwin or Lelito.
So no we were far from one player away and WR was one of our better spots. We had a lot of guys we were hoping on and they all let us down.
This post was edited on 5/3/15 at 7:30 pm
Posted on 5/3/15 at 7:30 pm to bonethug0108
Your post just ruined all my optimism for next year 
Posted on 5/3/15 at 7:56 pm to Rand AlThor
How so? 
The guys brought in this year (Spencer aside) are vastly different than the ones last year. We were bringing guys in near the end of their careers as potential starters or relied on unproven players.
This year we brought in legit guys that have played at high levels. Ellerbe and Specncer are the biggest question marks and neither is primed for more than a rotational role.
And this draft was pretty different from last year outside of Cooks. We relied on size and production over combine warriors.
The guys brought in this year (Spencer aside) are vastly different than the ones last year. We were bringing guys in near the end of their careers as potential starters or relied on unproven players.
This year we brought in legit guys that have played at high levels. Ellerbe and Specncer are the biggest question marks and neither is primed for more than a rotational role.
And this draft was pretty different from last year outside of Cooks. We relied on size and production over combine warriors.
Posted on 5/3/15 at 8:11 pm to bonethug0108
I guess just because last year I (like everyone else) was highly optimistic going into the season. We were a very good team in 2013 and we upgraded the neediest position (safety), without losing (what we perceived as) much at all. You pointing the fact that it was completely stupid to have that level of optimism out made me feel like the optimism I was gaining for 2015 is just going to provide the same level of disappointment.
Realistically, I like this draft but I don't think it addresses any immediate needs and I don't think this team will be world-beaters this year. We drafted a lot of great depth and future impact players but really only one guy who will start (Anthony). But it prepares us a lot for future seasons. As long as we aren't bottom dwellers I'd say it's a success.
Realistically, I like this draft but I don't think it addresses any immediate needs and I don't think this team will be world-beaters this year. We drafted a lot of great depth and future impact players but really only one guy who will start (Anthony). But it prepares us a lot for future seasons. As long as we aren't bottom dwellers I'd say it's a success.
Posted on 5/3/15 at 8:21 pm to Rand AlThor
Yes last year was a disappointment but in spite of the fact that everyone we brought in or relied on to step up failed in some way (even Cooks got injured) we were still a few plays away from 11-5. And this was with the immaturity running rampant.
This year literally the biggest and only hole we have is LG. And that's if Strief or Armstead don't kick inside. Every other spot has a legit proven player(maybe not all really great players but at least capable).
MAYBE you can add third WR but our starters are proven and we have guys that started stepping up.
Plus Spiller will bring back what we lost in Sproles (cause Cadet was not it). So third WR isn't nearly as important this year as last year. Third WR will likely be option six in the passing game(maybe even seven or eight).
This year literally the biggest and only hole we have is LG. And that's if Strief or Armstead don't kick inside. Every other spot has a legit proven player(maybe not all really great players but at least capable).
MAYBE you can add third WR but our starters are proven and we have guys that started stepping up.
Plus Spiller will bring back what we lost in Sproles (cause Cadet was not it). So third WR isn't nearly as important this year as last year. Third WR will likely be option six in the passing game(maybe even seven or eight).
This post was edited on 5/3/15 at 8:22 pm
Posted on 5/3/15 at 8:55 pm to bonethug0108
I've seen this response elsewhere and was hell bent on not responding to it, but now feel compelled to. To think last year's draft was anything but what is was, the complete reach on every player but Cooks, is a joke.
SJB in the 2nd will rank right up there as one of the biggest screw ups in the Payton era (Loomis still has Sullivan wrapped around his neck so SJB is light years away from the worse pick). You don't pick "projects" in the second damn round. The fact that he was designated "inactive" for 12 of the 16 games says all that needs to be said. Spin it anyway you want, it was a miss and I won't be surprised if he's a PS guy or cut long before the 53 is announced. Needless to say, the 4th round pick (Fortt) doesn't deserve any mention.
So, they miss on the 2nd and 4th round picks and you point out Sunseri and Powell as redeeming points; that's disingenuous in the highest degree. Did both contribute? To some extent they did. The entire draft class was so piss poor that any contribution shined through like a supernova, but it surely doesn't make up for the other idiotic picks.
As for Rooks, no big deal. Late round pick who didn't make it is no big surprise.
As we sit here right now, the only player out of that draft class that has a legitimate shot at being a real NFL starter is Cooks. That's not what drafts are suppose to produce and those types of drafts will all but guarantee 7-9 records....or worse.
The 2014 draft was bad; it happens. Don't stand on a soap box and preach success and try to chastise others who feel otherwise....it just doesn't sell.
SJB in the 2nd will rank right up there as one of the biggest screw ups in the Payton era (Loomis still has Sullivan wrapped around his neck so SJB is light years away from the worse pick). You don't pick "projects" in the second damn round. The fact that he was designated "inactive" for 12 of the 16 games says all that needs to be said. Spin it anyway you want, it was a miss and I won't be surprised if he's a PS guy or cut long before the 53 is announced. Needless to say, the 4th round pick (Fortt) doesn't deserve any mention.
So, they miss on the 2nd and 4th round picks and you point out Sunseri and Powell as redeeming points; that's disingenuous in the highest degree. Did both contribute? To some extent they did. The entire draft class was so piss poor that any contribution shined through like a supernova, but it surely doesn't make up for the other idiotic picks.
As for Rooks, no big deal. Late round pick who didn't make it is no big surprise.
As we sit here right now, the only player out of that draft class that has a legitimate shot at being a real NFL starter is Cooks. That's not what drafts are suppose to produce and those types of drafts will all but guarantee 7-9 records....or worse.
The 2014 draft was bad; it happens. Don't stand on a soap box and preach success and try to chastise others who feel otherwise....it just doesn't sell.
This post was edited on 5/3/15 at 8:58 pm
Posted on 5/3/15 at 9:06 pm to adono
I agree with most of what you said, but this is completely stupid, sorry:
The rookie hype has reached ridiculous levels. Loomis said it best in his presser yesterday: if a rookie plays at all, it is a pleasant surprise, it is NOT EXPECTED. This was ON THE GUYS BILLING before he was selected. He was not ready. The fact that he did not play last year means nothing. Calling him a bust is a complete joke. The jury is still out.
quote:
You don't pick "projects" in the second damn round.
The rookie hype has reached ridiculous levels. Loomis said it best in his presser yesterday: if a rookie plays at all, it is a pleasant surprise, it is NOT EXPECTED. This was ON THE GUYS BILLING before he was selected. He was not ready. The fact that he did not play last year means nothing. Calling him a bust is a complete joke. The jury is still out.
Posted on 5/3/15 at 9:07 pm to bonethug0108
quote:
Third WR will likely be option six in the passing game(maybe even seven or eight).
My bigger concern is at the 2nd/1st WR, not 3rd. I am concerned about Colston... and I know it has been a thing people have said for several seasons... but he is old. His speed has consistently declined. I know speed isn't his game, but it's relevant to playing the position. It's just concerning.
Posted on 5/3/15 at 9:14 pm to Rand AlThor
quote:
The fact that he did not play last year means nothing. Calling him a bust is a complete joke. The jury is still out.
We'll see. The only thing I'll point out is that SBJ was so bad when he was in that the staff had zero confidence in him....ergo, designated as inactive for 12 of the 16 games. Wasn't due being injured; it was due to inability to understand his position. That's just plain fact.
Will he shine this season? I sincerely hope he does. I bet he doesn't have a long rope.
Posted on 5/3/15 at 9:27 pm to adono
We may forget that this kid only played one (or was it two?) years at CB. It's not shocking that he didn't grasp everything about the position as well as trying to transition into the nfl. And we have taken "redshirt" players before so it's not the first time we waited on someone with potential.
People may forget that Jimmy Graham only played one year of TE before coming here and redshirtted almost his entire rookie year. Not saying SJB will be Graham but to judge a project on year one is insane.
Edit:
So a little off on Graham there. He did play in 15 games. But he was rarely used early in the year(didn't play the first game and only 5 catches in the first eight games) and finished with only 31 catches (26 over the last eight games). So he averaged about as many catches over those last eight games as Toon did over the last six last year.
People may forget that Jimmy Graham only played one year of TE before coming here and redshirtted almost his entire rookie year. Not saying SJB will be Graham but to judge a project on year one is insane.
Edit:
So a little off on Graham there. He did play in 15 games. But he was rarely used early in the year(didn't play the first game and only 5 catches in the first eight games) and finished with only 31 catches (26 over the last eight games). So he averaged about as many catches over those last eight games as Toon did over the last six last year.
This post was edited on 5/3/15 at 9:34 pm
Posted on 5/3/15 at 10:38 pm to bonethug0108
RR made a comment about SJB being raw and how big CBs take time to get technique down. These others guys like Dixon are smaller and have more experience playing cb in college and high school since SJB only played 2 years at CB. Remember, Keenan Lewis didn't do jack squat his rookie year either. Good news is, a player like SJB who takes a year or so to develop has already got that year under his belt. Hopefully he takes a step forward and can contribute. We will see.
Posted on 5/4/15 at 10:01 am to bonethug0108
quote:
Debacle? Why does everyone continue to overreact like this?
It's not an overreaction. It was a bad draft at a time where we really needed some quality depth and good players. We didn't draft smart, but it happens to teams. If we can salvage it with Cooks being a stud and SJB, Powell, and Sunseri being just contributors, we made out okay.
quote:
And I strongly disagree with the notion many thought we were one player away (or if we were that it was a wr).
You can disagree all you want. The consensus was we were returning the same defense which was ranked #3. Our offense was good until we got to the playoffs and had literally no more receivers. We all wanted a stud receiver and thought it would put this team over the top.
quote:
Many people felt CB was a huge hole but we thought between Bailey, Robinson, and White that one of them would step up.
Many people did not think this was a huge hole at all. We felt pretty confident with Lewis and Bailey as the starters and that PRob and White would continue to play well due to the pass rush we generated.
quote:
We had a lot of guys we were hoping on and they all let us down
Agree with that
Posted on 5/4/15 at 10:03 am to Rand AlThor
quote:
You did not touch one one other thing - Grayson
I'm excited about this pick for sure. For the first time we actually have a true prospect to develop, and not an UDFA or 7th round pick.
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