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Started By
Message
The problem is PAYTON
Posted on 9/27/16 at 8:24 pm
Posted on 9/27/16 at 8:24 pm
Payton has been riding the Brees train for a long long time.
Without Brees he is an avg offensive coordinator. Period.
He CANNOT evaluate talent. Period.
He is as clueless about defense as I am on latest womens fashion. He is employing a bunch of useless sidekicks that only he can vouch for. He makes such bad free agency decisions he has become the gold standard for epic failure.
YOU CAN NOT BUILD A TEAM WITH OTHER TEAMS FAILURES. PERIOD. You build with the draft.Coach up young talent and ride them until they ask for big money and then let them go!Let some idiot give it to them at which point their incentive to work hard just evaporated.
You have to be able to evaluate talent, just as a gemologist must be able to determine precious stone from dirt, you have to KNOW what you LOOKING FOR TO BEGIN with.
He has proven hundreds and hundreds of times that he does not know how to evaluate anything other than how to party down between games.
Without Brees he is an avg offensive coordinator. Period.
He CANNOT evaluate talent. Period.
He is as clueless about defense as I am on latest womens fashion. He is employing a bunch of useless sidekicks that only he can vouch for. He makes such bad free agency decisions he has become the gold standard for epic failure.
YOU CAN NOT BUILD A TEAM WITH OTHER TEAMS FAILURES. PERIOD. You build with the draft.Coach up young talent and ride them until they ask for big money and then let them go!Let some idiot give it to them at which point their incentive to work hard just evaporated.
You have to be able to evaluate talent, just as a gemologist must be able to determine precious stone from dirt, you have to KNOW what you LOOKING FOR TO BEGIN with.
He has proven hundreds and hundreds of times that he does not know how to evaluate anything other than how to party down between games.
9
Posted on 9/27/16 at 8:28 pm to Tyson53
Da winner!!!!!!!!! But he has been a problem for a very long time.
Posted on 9/27/16 at 8:35 pm to Tyson53
Oh great, saints talk has now become the tiger rant
Posted on 9/27/16 at 8:45 pm to Tyson53
i wish i could give more than one upvote.........
Posted on 9/27/16 at 8:55 pm to Tyson53
quote:
YOU CAN NOT BUILD A TEAM WITH OTHER TEAMS FAILURES. PERIOD. You build with the draft.Coach up young talent and ride them until they ask for big money and then let them go!
You build through the draft and free agency. Teams have success with both, we've failed at both. Hopefully Ireland helped turn it around.
All free agents that helped us win a super bowl:
Greer
Vilma
Sharper
Moore
Shockey
Fujita
Hargrove
McCray
Goodwin
Shanle
Gay
Posted on 9/27/16 at 9:14 pm to TigerBait1127
touche' good points. payton is a loser now though.Winners dont cheat on a wife and kids or do drugs past 30.
This post was edited on 9/27/16 at 9:15 pm
Posted on 9/27/16 at 9:16 pm to Tyson53
quote:
Payton has been riding the Brees train for a long long time. Without Brees he is an avg offensive coordinator. Period. He CANNOT evaluate talent. Period. He is as clueless about defense as I am on latest womens fashion. He is employing a bunch of useless sidekicks that only he can vouch for. He makes such bad free agency decisions he has become the gold standard for epic failure. YOU CAN NOT BUILD A TEAM WITH OTHER TEAMS FAILURES. PERIOD. You build with the draft.Coach up young talent and ride them until they ask for big money and then let them go!Let some idiot give it to them at which point their incentive to work hard just evaporated. You have to be able to evaluate talent, just as a gemologist must be able to determine precious stone from dirt, you have to KNOW what you LOOKING FOR TO BEGIN with. He has proven hundreds and hundreds of times that he does not know how to evaluate anything other than how to party down between games.
What you described sounds like a Loomis issue
Posted on 9/27/16 at 9:18 pm to Tyson53
quote:
Winners dont cheat on a wife and kids or do drugs past 30.
That Favre guy was a winner on the field.
Almost every great coach these days is a complete a-hole, which is partly why they are successful. I couldn't care less what they do behind closed doors. And I'd also imagine, if the rumors are even true, that a large number of former players and coaches have struggled with pain pill addictions.
He needs to be willing to give up his friends and his defense. Calling him an above average OC is ridiculous with what our offense has been able to accomplish, regardless of QB.
Bringing in Allen last year as co-DC (which is what he was in reality), was just idiotic when you had a guy like Dick Lebeau out there. He needs to clean staff outside of the offensive coaches.
Posted on 9/27/16 at 9:23 pm to TigerBait1127
And how long ago was that???
Let it go you need blue chip talent in 2016 and Payton fails to get that. OP is 100% right
Let it go you need blue chip talent in 2016 and Payton fails to get that. OP is 100% right
Posted on 9/27/16 at 9:23 pm to Bayou
quote:
What you described sounds like a Loomis issue
While we don't know exactly what their huge fight was about last year, I don't think it is fair to put the blame solely on either one's shoulders.
They both like to trade up in the draft, which is a failure to adjust to the new rookie contract structure. They both wanted Byrd apparently without even consulting Rob Ryan his freaking DC (may have been a good thing if Ryan wanted SJB).
They both went for the home runs (Byrd, Spiller, Browner, etc) instead of keeping locker room vets for cheaper (Sproles, Jenkins, and Harper).
They've both completely ignored the biggest need on offense for the past 5-8 years which was Center then Guard. So we ended up having to trade our best asset, Graham, to fill a need that could have been done with a few 3rd-6th picks (and it was a good trade, but shouldn't have been necessary).
It seems to have gotten better with Ireland. This team has good young talent. A lot more than after the 2014 implosion and rebuild. Offense looks elite, especially when Armstead is healthy. Defense needs to get healthy.
Posted on 9/27/16 at 9:27 pm to Brandincookem
quote:
And how long ago was that???
I think you can count.
quote:
Let it go you need blue chip talent in 2016 and Payton fails to get that. OP is 100% right
So we shouldn't spend cap space in FA and just build through the draft?
Name 1 team that is successful without knocking FAs out the park too?
New England - mastered it
Cardinals - built via both FA and draft
Denver - killed it with both. That Peyton Manning guy was kind of big, along with the additions of Ware and Talib outside of the draft
quote:
OP is 100% right
Nah, and he admitted it.
Thanks though
Posted on 9/27/16 at 11:26 pm to Tyson53
I will agree to that
Posted on 9/28/16 at 12:01 am to Tyson53
quote:
Payton has been riding the Brees train for a long long time. Without Brees he is an avg offensive coordinator. Period. He CANNOT evaluate talent. Period.
He is a horrible horrible coach.
quote:
YOU CAN NOT BUILD A TEAM WITH OTHER TEAM'S FAILURES
Spot on brother!
quote:
The last 3 years that camp was at the country club
0-4, 0-4 bet my arse we are 0-4 again.
quote:
But, but. but he won a super bowl 7 years ago
He gotta fricking GO!!
Break out the paper bags folks. Payton brought back the AINT'S
I'll have my paper bag on Oct 16th with "Payton brought back the AINT'S"
This post was edited on 9/28/16 at 12:02 am
Posted on 9/28/16 at 12:17 am to Tyson53
quote:
payton is a loser now though.Winners dont cheat on a wife and kids or do drugs past 30.
quote:
Tyson53
Are you retarded son? NONE of that has anything to do with football. Period.
Posted on 9/28/16 at 2:52 am to Tyson53
quote:
Payton has been riding the Vitt, McMahon, Johnson, Carmichael train for a long long time
Posted on 9/28/16 at 2:54 am to Breesus
Carmichael is fine. Those other stooges can frick off
Posted on 9/28/16 at 5:22 am to TigerBait1127
People loved the Byrd signing at the time. Loved It! K. Allen and D. Breaux we're working pretty good until injuries took over. Spiller seemed like a good signing as a Sproles replacement. We still don't know what happened there. Everyone loved getting Unger and Anthony last year. People liked the Rankins pick, and Kikaha. Williams and Swann were good picks if not for injuries. M. Thomas and Bell were good picks this year.
Not judging in hindsight, most people liked these moves at the time. People always fail to take that into consideration when making a thread about how much the owner, GM and coach and players suck.
Not judging in hindsight, most people liked these moves at the time. People always fail to take that into consideration when making a thread about how much the owner, GM and coach and players suck.
Posted on 9/28/16 at 6:51 am to Tyson53
Benson/Loomis/Payton
Each has a problem that makes success on the field more difficult.
The three Amigos are the current leaders and those responsible for where we are at and where we are going.
Each has a problem that makes success on the field more difficult.
The three Amigos are the current leaders and those responsible for where we are at and where we are going.
Posted on 9/28/16 at 6:54 am to Tyson53
quote:
touche' good points. payton is a loser now though.Winners dont cheat on a wife and kids or do drugs past 30.
I'm gonna allow it.
It's not the reason he's a bad coach, but it's a sign or symptom of it.
It's a situation that happens all the time with celebrities and high profile people like athletes, singers, actors, etc.. They start out young and hungry and very likable. But at some point after they experience success, they start drinking their own Kool-Aid. They become different people. The nice guy becomes an a-hole and gets completely out of touch with the people who helped get them there.
An analogy I make is U2 or Tom Brady. U2 was a likable, hungry band who made good music and people liked them because they had character. They were underdogs And then The Joshua Tree came out and then Bono turned into a giant douche obsessed with satisfying his out-of-control Ego. He became a cross between John Lennon and Jesus Christ and people started to hate him. Same with Brady. He was the underdog 6th round draft pick that looked like a goober in his underwear at the combine and took a picture of Joe Montana when he was a kid. And then he became the biggest football player on Earth and a lot of people who loved him now can't stand the guy.
Sean Payton is a lot like that. He doesn't need to be a great coach because he's already been to the top of the mountain and now you should just bow down when I pass because I'm Sean frickING Payton.
Posted on 9/28/16 at 7:27 am to Suntiger
quote:
People loved the Byrd signing at the time.
Yea, I did love the Byrd signing. Then again, I figured we did our due diligence, asked our defensive coordinator's opinion on the player, and were positive he was healthy. You don't give an injured FA the most money at his position.
quote:
K. Allen and D. Breaux we're working pretty good until injuries took over.
He may work out just fine, but he was also the secondary coach last season that got absolutely crushed. The single high safety needs to freakin go.
quote:
Spiller seemed like a good signing as a Sproles replacement. We still don't know what happened there
Issue is that we made the mistake with Sproles and once again signed a player to a big contract when he was still injured.
quote:
Everyone loved getting Unger and Anthony last year.
It was a fantastic trade imo. That issue I have is the fact that we needed to trade for a center in the first place when it was an issue for years. We lost games because of our failure to address it.
quote:
People liked the Rankins pick, and Kikaha. Williams and Swann were good picks if not for injuries.
I liked all those picks. I like Ireland. Unfortunately, Kikaha's risk happened. I hope he can bounce back. Williams and Swann were just freak incidents
quote:
M. Thomas and Bell were good picks this year.
I agree.
quote:
Not judging in hindsight, most people liked these moves at the time.
And we're not paid millions of dollars for accountability either.
You can't be signing injured players. You can't sign a safety to the highest contract for his position without talking to your DC. You can't force him to play that player 35 yards off the LoS.
quote:
People always fail to take that into consideration when making a thread about how much the owner, GM and coach and players suck.
Well I'm pretty positive towards all of them, and I like the change made with Ireland.
That doesn't change the mistakes. We were too late to adapt to the new rookie contract deals and didn't value picks enough. We seem to be heading in the right direction now.
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