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re: How many RB's in the NFL are better (more talented) than Leonard Fournette?

Posted on 2/16/17 at 10:49 am to
Posted by BigBrod81
Houma
Member since Sep 2010
18962 posts
Posted on 2/16/17 at 10:49 am to
quote:

There's actually 6 guys in the box, but 7 is still not "stacking" the box.


There's 7 in the box idiot. 4 down linemen, 2 LBs & a CB who is playing as a rover player being that there is no receiver on the right side of the offensive formation. Then there is also another defender screaming towards the line of scrimmage shortly afterwards.

quote:

I mean good Lord man, what's he supposed to do on running plays? Let's just call it 11 in the box and say Alabama put 11 in the box and that's why they always stop Fournette


Are you frickin retarded? Seriously, that safety who comes into the box is completely selling out against the run. Had that been a play action pass, he is way out of position for his single high safety responsibilities but what do you know about that? The reason the safety could be so aggressive is that LSU refused to give them a reason to not be so aggressive against the run by constantly testing Bama downfield.

I'm just making all this stuff up though. Wait....

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So what happened? Why was one Heisman candidate able to run the ball so easily and the other able to get nothing done?

In short, Alabama’s defensive front absolutely overpowered the LSU blocking, and LSU seemed to run right into the buzz saw willingly.


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One of the biggest issues LSU had in this game is that quarterback Brandon Harris never did anything to make them respect the pass and back off the line.


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Alabama simply won at the point of attack consistently all game long.


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Alabama was able to win at the point of attack seemingly at will.


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Often controlling two gaps, the Tide defenders had the measure of the LSU blockers and were merely reading the run play. They’d only destroy the block when the it came close enough to them, almost baiting Fournette in by showing him a clean path through the line before slamming the door shut on him as he arrived.


quote:

It's the same scheme that churned out yards on the ground against just about everyone over the years. So Alabama's front 7 was better than LSU's offensive line.


Yes yet Alabama always had 2 weeks to prepare being both teams had bye weeks before the matchup. Saban dissected the simple LSU ground game & had his players ready with a good game plan.


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Alabama weren’t trying to penetrate, but to seal up the line of scrimmage. This is why he routinely arrived at the line to be met not necessarily by Alabama defenders, but by a wall of blockers and a solid mass of bodies. On many of these plays the runs were walled off, spilling Fournette to waiting perimeter defenders who did an admirable job of bringing him to the ground one-on-one.


quote:

As much as other teams would like to copy this blueprint, the necessary components for succeeding in this game plan are players with the ability and dominance of this Crimson Tide front. Strategically, it can certainly be said that the best way to defend against Fournette may be to try and block up the line, rather than penetrate and risk creating gaps. However, there aren’t many teams out there that could succeed two-gapping against a team like LSU.


This was PFF's breakdown for the 2015 game but you can rinse & repeat for the 2014 & 2016 games because LSU did nothing differently offensively in none of the matchups.

2015 PFF Breakdown LSU vs Alabama

quote:

It's very likely that he is picked by a team that will be at a disadvantage up front more often than not, except now there are even better athletes trying to stop him.


You mean like Todd Gurley? Because the Rams offensive line & they had terrible QB play was absolutely pathetic this year, does that make Todd Gurley less of a back? Hell no.

quote:

What do you think is going to happen in the NFL? It's very likely that he is picked by a team that will be at a disadvantage up front more often than not, except now there are even better athletes trying to stop him. God help him if he goes to a team like the Jets with no passing game



He is going to be like every other running back with poor QB & a poor offensive line, struggle. You keep mentioning supposedly negatives towards Fournette yet these are franchise issues that don't take away from Fournette's talent.
Posted by BigBrod81
Houma
Member since Sep 2010
18962 posts
Posted on 2/16/17 at 11:03 am to
quote:

He's 6 yards off the los, he's not in the box


Good god you are dumb.
Posted by Riseupfromtherubble
You'll Never Walk Alone
Member since Jun 2011
38370 posts
Posted on 2/16/17 at 11:03 am to
quote:

Are you frickin retarded? Seriously, that safety who comes into the box is completely selling out against the run.


Hey Lombardi, why the hell wouldn't he? Fournette has the ball and is at the line of scrimmage before you even see the safety. What is he supposed to do there coach? Sit and wait for a Fournette like an auburn or ole miss safety?

quote:

He is going to be like every other running back with poor QB & a poor offensive line, struggle

Not true. Peterson, Forte, Charles, McCoy, Lynch, Martin, Foster have all had successful seasons on teams with dumpy quarterbacks and average lines. Gurley had a phenomenal rookie season under those circumstances too
This post was edited on 2/16/17 at 11:06 am
Posted by Riseupfromtherubble
You'll Never Walk Alone
Member since Jun 2011
38370 posts
Posted on 2/16/17 at 11:05 am to
Okay champ. 6 yards off the los is the box now. No wonder Fournette didn't have anywhere to go, there were 7 players in the box. Oh the horror
Posted by TigerBait1127
Houston
Member since Jun 2005
47336 posts
Posted on 2/16/17 at 11:17 am to
quote:

In the end he's not going to be there at 11 and the saints are trading up for him, so it's all moot relative to the saints. He'll probably end up a jag or jet



I don't want the Saints to draft him even if he is there at 11.
Posted by BigBrod81
Houma
Member since Sep 2010
18962 posts
Posted on 2/16/17 at 11:22 am to
quote:

Okay champ. 6 yards off the los is the box now. No wonder Fournette didn't have anywhere to go, there were 7 players in the box. Oh the horror


Its not like Alabama wasn't overloading the side they anticipated the Tigers to run to on every play either. They knew where the runs were going based off formation & personnel groupings. There were no disguises, no misdirection, no play action, no zone read. Just line up & run out of predictable formations which Saban had his players well prepared for. Sorry that is too difficult for you to comprehend.
This post was edited on 2/16/17 at 2:13 pm
Posted by TigerBait1127
Houston
Member since Jun 2005
47336 posts
Posted on 2/16/17 at 11:25 am to
quote:

Not true. Peterson, Forte, Charles, McCoy, Lynch, Martin, Foster have all had successful seasons on teams with dumpy quarterbacks and average lines. Gurley had a phenomenal rookie season under those circumstances too



What seasons? Not saying there aren't exceptions to the rule, but they are going to be pretty rare

B/c I watched Adrian Peterson get absolutely destroyed this year before his injury due to his offensive line. He was completely ineffective

In 2015 they had a pretty good run blocking group and you saw the results in AP's numbers. In 2016, their line went to crap and so did his play

Gurley is actually a pretty good comparison to LF7 in terms of home run threat and breaking tackles. He got stuffed a lot, but gained his yards on big runs. And then looked at what a great talent like him faced this season
This post was edited on 2/16/17 at 11:41 am
Posted by bamabenny
Member since Nov 2009
14640 posts
Posted on 2/16/17 at 1:30 pm to
2012 Jamaal Charles comes to mind
Posted by Rohan Gravy
New Orleans
Member since Jan 2017
18001 posts
Posted on 2/16/17 at 3:21 pm to
BigBrod81 ....thank you for being here...
I appreciate your knowledge and input !!!
Posted by BigBrod81
Houma
Member since Sep 2010
18962 posts
Posted on 2/16/17 at 5:07 pm to
quote:

Hey Lombardi, why the hell wouldn't he? Fournette has the ball and is at the line of scrimmage before you even see the safety. What is he supposed to do there coach? Sit and wait for a Fournette like an auburn or ole miss safety?


Do you even know what the responsibility is for the safety in a single high look? It's obvious that you do not. The safety there is supposed to support the corner covering the receiver who is running the deepest route. He is ALWAYS supposed to stay as deep as the deepest receiver. Had that been an actual play action pass called, those corners expecting help would have had none leading for the potential of a big passing play downfield.



That play from the last matchup shows just how much the Tide were selling out every match up to stop Fournette. Look at both Reuben Foster & Shaun Hamilton. They bite hard on the run fake, taking them completely out of their pass coverage responsibilities. Even with Josh Boutte getting blown up by Da'ron Payne, had LSU had a TE lined up tight to the left end of the formation running a seam route, Etling would have been able to throw to the TE instantly because he would have been wide arse open screaming down the left seam. Instead you have 2 WRs flanked out wide to the left, running deeper routes. With the immediate pressure Etling gets flushed & has to throw the ball away. It's a wasted play when the Tigers had a golden opportunity to get points before the half. Again, lack of offensive creativity at it's finest.
This post was edited on 2/18/17 at 5:40 pm
Posted by keakar
Member since Jan 2017
29886 posts
Posted on 2/16/17 at 5:20 pm to
every single one since he hasn't proven he can be any good yet

speculation is odds are good he can be a top 10 caliber RB if that is your question
Posted by Rohan Gravy
New Orleans
Member since Jan 2017
18001 posts
Posted on 2/16/17 at 6:17 pm to
Ok Keakar...I like it! everybody has an opinion...and your's is as good as mine or anyone else's :)
But check out BigBrod81 comments....
This guy is extremely knowledgeable about football....
I'm just a fan ....but I'm enjoying the education!
Posted by TurkeysAndBees
Member since Jan 2017
651 posts
Posted on 2/16/17 at 6:57 pm to
quote:

every single one since he hasn't proven he can be any good yet


This.
This post was edited on 2/16/17 at 6:59 pm
Posted by 1BamaRTR
In Your Head Blvd
Member since Apr 2015
22514 posts
Posted on 2/16/17 at 7:21 pm to
quote:

This guy is extremely knowledgeable about football....

Doesn't matter. The point is LF hasn't played a snap yet in the NFL. No matter whatever numbers or highlights are brought up. It's ok to speculate how good he might be, but to say 100% that he will be the next AP or close to that is premature. And that goes for all the players in this draft.
Posted by BLUEBEARD
BERMUDA TRIANGLE
Member since Aug 2014
547 posts
Posted on 2/16/17 at 8:05 pm to
None better. LF7 will likely be first in rookie yardage
Posted by Rohan Gravy
New Orleans
Member since Jan 2017
18001 posts
Posted on 2/16/17 at 9:44 pm to
Is it true that LF7 hasn't played a snap in the NFL?
Are you sure about that?
I agree!!!:) :)
:)
I repeat ....BigBrod81 is The Man!
Posted by Rohan Gravy
New Orleans
Member since Jan 2017
18001 posts
Posted on 2/16/17 at 9:48 pm to
I just down voted myself!
Posted by Riseupfromtherubble
You'll Never Walk Alone
Member since Jun 2011
38370 posts
Posted on 2/16/17 at 10:48 pm to
quote:

Do you even know what the responsibility is for the safety in a single high look? It's obvious that you do not. The safety there is supposed to support the corner covering the receiver who is running the deepest route. He is ALWAYS supposed to stay as deep as the deepest receiver


Just stop. You're trying to sound like you have a clue and digging yourself into a deeper hole. When a running back is carrying the ball and crossing the line of scrimmage, and the receivers are blocking, his job is to tackle the ball carrier. Seriously, reread what you just typed

And your alter/little brother is terrible
This post was edited on 2/16/17 at 10:49 pm
Posted by BigBrod81
Houma
Member since Sep 2010
18962 posts
Posted on 2/16/17 at 11:30 pm to
quote:

. You're trying to sound like you have a clue and digging yourself into a deeper hole.


You should look in the mirror.

quote:

When a running back is carrying the ball and crossing the line of scrimmage


Again, that safety in the cover one look is supposed to be the final line of defense against a deep route or a run that breaks loose to the second level. A cover one safety normally lines up 15 yards off the line of scrimmage. There is no way that defender was 15 yards downfield as well as pack peddling to be in position against a deep pass. Keep trying though.

quote:

the receivers are blocking


You need glasses because the 3 WRs in the bunch formation to the left side are not blocking off the snap of the ball. Secondly, that safety is shadowing the offensive formation to the right where it was designed to go. He wasn't playing the far side hash where the receivers are lined up. The safety, just like all the other defenders read run to the right presnap.

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his job is to tackle the ball carrier.


His job as a free safety in that coverage look is to stay as deep as the deepest receiver. Its not his responsibility in that coverage to attack the line of scrimmage like a strong safety in that situation.

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In today’s installment of the “NFL 101” series, former NFL defensive back Matt Bowen breaks down the basics of Cover 1 to give you a better understanding of the game.


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A defense that is dependent on solid technique in the secondary, Cover 1 allows teams to create eight-man fronts (strong safety drops into the box) with the protection of the free safety over the top.


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This gives the defense two levels of “help” in Cover 1 (free safety over the top, Mike ‘backer underneath). And because of the initial alignment (outside shade), every defender (versus standard receiver splits) is taught to use their help inside.


LINK

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And your alter/little brother is terrible




Sorry but I don't know this guy. Unlike people from Alabama everyone in Louisiana isn't each other's next of kin.






This post was edited on 2/16/17 at 11:54 pm
Posted by burke985
UGANDA
Member since Aug 2011
24597 posts
Posted on 2/17/17 at 7:51 am to
quote:

DeMarco Murray


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