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Posted on 4/9/12 at 6:50 am to OBUDan
The thing tou're not considering is Wren was handcuffed financially. The Braves could not add more than a couple million in payroll which means they'd have to trade someone with some salary. He tried to trade Jurrjens but couldn't get the value he wanted for him coming off a knee injury. And he almost traded Prado, which shows what kind of position he was put in.
Those who think Wren was merely content to stand back and not add a bat are misinformed. He played the hand he was dealt. He made a good deal to get Juan Francisco and has made some other good deals too. I don't think Wren is the problem.
Those who think Wren was merely content to stand back and not add a bat are misinformed. He played the hand he was dealt. He made a good deal to get Juan Francisco and has made some other good deals too. I don't think Wren is the problem.
Posted on 4/9/12 at 7:26 am to FredSecunda
I acknowledged that Liberty has something to do with it.
I'm just not sure Wren knows what the right moves to make are.
I'm just not sure Wren knows what the right moves to make are.
Posted on 4/9/12 at 8:19 am to OBUDan
What move would you have liked to see him make? Surely not the Adam Jones deal.
As for Pence, we probably could have gotten him but we chose to pursue Bourn instead. The Bourn deal was a great one for the Braves as it provided us with our first true leadoff hitter since Furcal and we didn't have to give up any of our top prospects. Though we could have used Pence, there was no room for him and Bourn without taking Prado's spot, and that just doesn't make sense.
As for Pence, we probably could have gotten him but we chose to pursue Bourn instead. The Bourn deal was a great one for the Braves as it provided us with our first true leadoff hitter since Furcal and we didn't have to give up any of our top prospects. Though we could have used Pence, there was no room for him and Bourn without taking Prado's spot, and that just doesn't make sense.
Posted on 4/9/12 at 8:55 am to LSUsmartass
quote:
I get labeled as being a Fredi lover when I just don't blame him one way or the other when he isn't given any pieces to a fricked up puzzle
You act like the Braves don't have any talent in the field at the moment. Upgrading to Bourn in CF filled a bigger black hole than upgrading to Pence in Left over Prado. If Chipper wasn't on the team, then yeah it would be a very nice addition because Prado would move to 3rd. You'd still have a black hole in CF though.
Not to mention you would have given up Mike Minor plus other pieces. They probably would have had to trade Prado if they acquired Pence. Chipper wasn't going anywhere, and Prado wasn't going to ride the pine until Chipper got hurt. That's opening up some pretty big holes in your line up. No CF, no 3B, and no middle of the rotation starter.
Not so sure about your WS team.
Posted on 4/9/12 at 9:47 am to FredSecunda
quote:
What move would you have liked to see him make? Surely not the Adam Jones deal.
I do like Adam Jones a good bit, and he's a very good player entering his prime. If the rumors of what they were asking were true, then no, not the Adam Jones deal.
My argument last year was that they should get Beltran. Last year's team was very good, and needed a spark. The pitching failing down the stretch may have prohibited a deep playoff run, but you just never know what Beltran could have provided.
Most people thought what we "needed" was a CF. It makes sense logistically as Schafer/Constanza were far and away our weakest players (which is saying a lot cause Prado and JHey were struggling), but Michael Bourn (who is a good player) wasn't going to transform our offense and didn't. In fact, Bourn went .278/.321/.352 over the backhalf, a decent enough line, but everyone kept saying, "if we just get a table setter, our offense will rock n' roll."
Compare that to what Beltran did in San Fran: .323/.369/.551 with 7 homers. His OPS+ was 156, almost TWICE as much as what Bourn produced for Atlanta.
I'm not ripping on Bourn, the fact is he just didn't improve the offense. He wasn't what we needed, but Wren misevaluated. We needed a hitter, a guy who could produce runs, especially with Heyward floundering, Prado being stagnant and then eventually Uggla and McCann petering out by season's end. If you look back over July/August, Dan Uggla basically was our offense. He went on a torrid run. Chipper was solid, but then got hurt. So you need a guy in there that's a threat... that scares pitchers, and Beltran is that.
Now, the arguments against the move were a) Cost and b) Who plays CF? I'll tackle B first... You can try Beltran or Heyward there. Heyward is probably the best option, because he is so rangy. Beltran has lost a lot of his formerly elite range, but he could probably play CF in a pinch.
Now in terms of cost, that's another matter. We got Bourn relatively on the cheap, but when you really think about it there's a REASON for that. very rarely do organizations make completely bone headed trades that don't return fairly equal value. Bourn came cheap because Bourn isn't worth as much as Beltran, isn't as good as Beltran and didn't perform as well as Beltran.
So essentially this is what I mean when I say I'm not sure I trust Wren to evaluate our actual needs.
As for Pence, he's a good player, but considering the cost, and the fact that he probably couldn't even play CF in a pinch, it just wasn't worth it. Beltran is a considerably better bat than Pence, IMO (historically). Of course, Pence went on a tear in Philly, so there's that.
Anyway, sorry for the essay.
Posted on 4/9/12 at 9:53 am to volfan30
quote:
now that this team is starting to hit the ball
Posted on 4/9/12 at 9:55 am to LSUsmartass
quote:
the root of the problem
Is Liberty Media.
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