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Message
Spinoff: if Bonds doesn't get busted, is he unanimously into the HOF?
Posted on 2/13/14 at 3:01 pm
Posted on 2/13/14 at 3:01 pm
To be clear, this is not an argument about whether he would have similar numbers without steroids. I'm asking if you completely remove the steroid era stigma, would his numbers be enough?
All-time records:
7x MVP, including 4 straight
762 HRs
73 HRs in a season
2558 walks
688 intentional walks
13-consecutive seasons with 30+ HRs
.863 slugging in a season
5 seasons with 30 HRs and 30 SBs
Also:
14x All-star
8x Gold Glove
12x Silver Slugger
Only player in history with more times on base than at bats - 376 to 373 respectively in 2004.
Career .298 hitter, greatest LF of all-time, on of the best hitters and players of all time.
So, with no steroid controversy, does he get in unanimously or not? I believe it is fair to ask because Bonds was a better everyday player than Maddux was a pitcher, and he certainly was better than Cal Ripken Jr., and they received 97.2% and 98.5% of the vote respectively.
All-time records:
7x MVP, including 4 straight
762 HRs
73 HRs in a season
2558 walks
688 intentional walks
13-consecutive seasons with 30+ HRs
.863 slugging in a season
5 seasons with 30 HRs and 30 SBs
Also:
14x All-star
8x Gold Glove
12x Silver Slugger
Only player in history with more times on base than at bats - 376 to 373 respectively in 2004.
Career .298 hitter, greatest LF of all-time, on of the best hitters and players of all time.
So, with no steroid controversy, does he get in unanimously or not? I believe it is fair to ask because Bonds was a better everyday player than Maddux was a pitcher, and he certainly was better than Cal Ripken Jr., and they received 97.2% and 98.5% of the vote respectively.
Posted on 2/13/14 at 3:03 pm to slackster
probably would get a higher % than those two. who knows about unanimous. probably not.
Posted on 2/13/14 at 3:03 pm to slackster
nope
there will always be at least one voter that will make sure a unanimous vote never happens
there will always be at least one voter that will make sure a unanimous vote never happens
Posted on 2/13/14 at 3:07 pm to slackster
No, because he was an a-hole and some of the writers would hold that against him
Posted on 2/13/14 at 3:08 pm to Dr RC
How do they make sure it's only one guy?
What if everybody thought they were going to be "that guy", and they all ended up leaving him off their ballots?
What if everybody thought they were going to be "that guy", and they all ended up leaving him off their ballots?
Posted on 2/13/14 at 3:13 pm to Kafka
quote:
How do they make sure it's only one guy?
they dont need to make sure of anything
there are enough voters that the odds are extremely high there will always be at least one MLB HOF voter who believes nobody should be unanimous first ballot and will leave a player off their ballot if they think he has a shot at it.
also, as others have said, Bonds was an incredible prick during his career so that alone would get him snubbed by several voters.
This post was edited on 2/13/14 at 3:14 pm
Posted on 2/13/14 at 3:17 pm to SPEEDY
quote:Correct
No, because he was an a-hole and some of the writers would hold that against him
Posted on 2/13/14 at 3:17 pm to Dr RC
But suppose it's a living saint who hits 800 home runs and 4500 hits playing 3000 games in a row
They want to make sure nobody is unanimous -- what do they do? Do they hold a meeting? Send out emails?
They want to make sure nobody is unanimous -- what do they do? Do they hold a meeting? Send out emails?
Posted on 2/13/14 at 3:19 pm to Kafka
no. im sure 90% of the rational voters know there is always that 10% who will do something stupid. i doubt they discuss it.
Posted on 2/13/14 at 3:20 pm to slackster
2001-2004 Barry Bonds is the best stretch of any athlete I will ever see in my lifetime.
His OBP was .609 one year. That does not even make sense.
His OBP was .609 one year. That does not even make sense.
Posted on 2/13/14 at 3:20 pm to Kafka
quote:
How do they make sure it's only one guy?
They go by "meanness seniority".
If Bonds made one of the voters cry before, they go to him first and give him the option of dropping the "no" vote. If he declines, they go down the chain through the voters that Bonds made red in the face, stutter with frustration, etc.
In the event of multiple people in a certain bracket, the most senior voter in the group gets first crack.
Posted on 2/13/14 at 3:20 pm to dj30
quote:
Greatest player ever.
not named Ken Griffey
Posted on 2/13/14 at 3:20 pm to slackster
No some jackass would vote no just to make themselves feel important
Posted on 2/13/14 at 3:21 pm to Dr RC
Keeping him off out of spite or to keep anyone from being unanimous are two of the biggest knocks against the MLB HOF.
Some people will say if Ruth and Cobb weren't unanimous, then no one will be. However, I'm of the belief that both of those guys would have been unanimous if they put up the same numbers today. I believe history has proven how incredible they were, and that wasn't necessarily the case in 1936. No one knew some of those numbers would stand the test of time. Hell, they were only 17 years into the live ball era when they were elected.
Some people will say if Ruth and Cobb weren't unanimous, then no one will be. However, I'm of the belief that both of those guys would have been unanimous if they put up the same numbers today. I believe history has proven how incredible they were, and that wasn't necessarily the case in 1936. No one knew some of those numbers would stand the test of time. Hell, they were only 17 years into the live ball era when they were elected.
This post was edited on 2/13/14 at 3:22 pm
Posted on 2/13/14 at 3:23 pm to sunnydaze
quote:
not named Ken Griffey
Posted on 2/13/14 at 3:23 pm to slackster
I don't care one way or the other about any of the steroid crowd.
Posted on 2/13/14 at 3:26 pm to Kafka
quote:
But suppose it's a living saint who hits 800 home runs and 4500 hits playing 3000 games in a row
They want to make sure nobody is unanimous -- what do they do? Do they hold a meeting? Send out emails?
again
why are you making this more complicated than it needs to be?
there is no organized effort to make sure nobody gets in unanimously.
why would voters even need to talk to each other when its usually pretty obvious which players are for sure getting into the hall in their first year of eligibility?
the average sports writer is already a cantankerous old fart.
baseball focused writers are even worse as they feel they are somehow preserving the game.
with the amount of old farts voting, the odds are simply too high that there is always going to be some old curmudgeon who wants to make sure a person does not get a unanimous vote. It might be b/c they think the player was a dick. It might be b/c they think his stats are inflated by where he played. It might be (most likely) that he simply thinks that since greats like Babe Ruth and Willie Mays didn't get unanimously voted in that nobody should.
All you need to know is its pretty obvious who will make it in the HOF their first year and b/c of that its easy for the very small minority of voters who don't want anyone to get a unanimous first ballot to know who and when to leave players off their ballot.
This post was edited on 2/13/14 at 3:27 pm
Posted on 2/13/14 at 3:39 pm to SPEEDY
quote:
No, because he was an a-hole and some of the writers would hold that against him
yep.
is there a more petty group of human beings than baseball writers?
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