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I guess I'm confused why the hit on Giovanni Bernard wasn't a penalty
Posted on 1/11/16 at 1:39 pm
Posted on 1/11/16 at 1:39 pm
So if the fact that he isn't considered defenseless takes away the targeting penalty, which is stupid, but why does that take away from the fact that the steeler player who delivered the hit left his feet, lead with the crown of his helmet, and delivered a hit to gios helmet. Isn't that penalty? Isn't delivering a forceful hit with the crown of your helmet supposed to be a penalty?
This post was edited on 1/11/16 at 1:39 pm
14
Posted on 1/11/16 at 1:39 pm to WestCoastAg
Yeah it was still helmet to helmet
Should have been a penalty
Should have been a penalty
Posted on 1/11/16 at 1:44 pm to WestCoastAg
quote:
Isn't that penalty?
No. There is no helmet to helmet when a guy is a runner.
Posted on 1/11/16 at 1:44 pm to WestCoastAg
NFL rules in general are confusing as hell. In that situation gio was more defenseless than Bryant was earlier in the game. Gio never saw shazier. Bryant saw the hit coming and lowered his head.
Posted on 1/11/16 at 1:45 pm to Hester Carries
i thought the penalty was only non enforceable when inside the tackle box. i could be wrong, but my understanding was the rule of leading with the crown of the helmet can be applied to runners
Posted on 1/11/16 at 1:48 pm to WestCoastAg
I agree. Logically it makes no sense. He wasn't any more or less defensive than a WR who gets hit in the head as soon as he catches the ball. Bernard caught the ball and was hit in the head as soon as he turn around.
It seems as if the rule excludes running backs from protection. Any blow to the QB's head is automatically penalty, even if completely unintentional. Also, unless he is in the act of throwing, how can a QB be considered any less "defenseless" than a RB when the QB has the ball?
Basically, QBs are protected from just about all contact. WRs are protected from high speed collisions. RB's are shite out of luck
It seems as if the rule excludes running backs from protection. Any blow to the QB's head is automatically penalty, even if completely unintentional. Also, unless he is in the act of throwing, how can a QB be considered any less "defenseless" than a RB when the QB has the ball?
Basically, QBs are protected from just about all contact. WRs are protected from high speed collisions. RB's are shite out of luck
Posted on 1/11/16 at 1:48 pm to WestCoastAg
quote:
targeting penalty
Targeting also doesn't exist in the NFL.
I"m pretty sure that if you're the runner then helmet-to-helmet isn't a penalty, but I'm not 100 percent sure there.
You just have to realize that not all hits are going to be penalized or fined.
Posted on 1/11/16 at 1:49 pm to WestCoastAg
It reminded me of the helmet to helmet hit on Pierre Thomas in the 2011 San Fran playoff game that knocked him out early on. No flag there either.
Posted on 1/11/16 at 1:50 pm to TunaTigers
quote:
Gio never saw shazier.
That's false. He caught the ball, got both his feet set and facing forward before he got hit
Posted on 1/11/16 at 1:50 pm to Hester Carries
quote:
There is no helmet to helmet when a guy is a runner.
I feel as though they've made the rules of possession too convoluted. Back when it was "two feet down and a football move" there was certainly debate about what constituted a "football move." But now they've added this whole new qualifier of "becoming a runner" which is far more confusing.
I believe the "rules expert" Mike Carey said something to the effect that Bernard turned up field and could see the whole field, followed immediately by Phil Simms saying Bernard never saw Shazier coming, which was clearly true.
Posted on 1/11/16 at 1:51 pm to Wayne Campbell
is this not the rule? or this rule no longer in play?
quote:
ARTICLE 8. INITIATING CONTACT WITH THE CROWN OF THE HELMET. It is a foul if a runner or tackler initiates forcible contact by delivering a blow with the top/crown of his helmet against an opponent when both players are clearly outside the tackle box (an area extending from tackle to tackle and from three yards beyond the line of scrimmage to the offensive team’s end line). Incidental contact by the helmet of a runner or tackler against an opponent shall not be a foul.
Posted on 1/11/16 at 1:52 pm to Brettesaurus Rex
quote:
his feet set and facing forward before he got hit
Just because he was facing forward doesn't mean he saw Shazier. He made absolutely no move to protect himself. If he had seen Shazier he would have moved to protect himself, which you see receivers do all the time, usually drawing a penalty. Hell, it happened earlier in the same game.
This post was edited on 1/11/16 at 1:54 pm
Posted on 1/11/16 at 2:06 pm to Wayne Campbell
Why wasnt it a fumble is the question.
Posted on 1/11/16 at 2:13 pm to WestCoastAg
quote:I thought it was a legal hit at first, but I believe your assessment is spot on.
So if the fact that he isn't considered defenseless takes away the targeting penalty, which is stupid, but why does that take away from the fact that the steeler player who delivered the hit left his feet, lead with the crown of his helmet, and delivered a hit to gios helmet. Isn't that penalty? Isn't delivering a forceful hit with the crown of your helmet supposed to be a penalty?
Bernard wasn't defenseless, he had taken a couple of steps, so the defenseless receiver rule didn't apply, but I do believe the crown of the helmet rule should have applied.
Posted on 1/11/16 at 2:16 pm to tigersint
quote:
Why wasnt it a fumble is the question.
It was reviewed and called a fumble
Posted on 1/11/16 at 2:24 pm to WestCoastAg
quote:
Incidental contact by the helmet of a runner or tackler against an opponent shall not be a foul.
Bernard was literally sliding sideways when he was hit.
Posted on 1/11/16 at 2:27 pm to WestCoastAg
Because it was a hit by the Steelers. Steelers have done it to the Bengals for years unpenalized. Hines Ward on Keith Rivers and Garvin on Kevin Huber.
LINK
Maybe Joey Porter was standing on the field between the ref and the hit.
LINK
Maybe Joey Porter was standing on the field between the ref and the hit.
Posted on 1/11/16 at 2:30 pm to Alt26
quote:
Basically, QBs are protected from just about all contact. WRs are protected from high speed collisions. RB's are shite out of luck
yeah ... that just about sums it up.
Posted on 1/11/16 at 2:32 pm to philabuck
and the steeler defender left his feet and led with the crown of his helmet
Posted on 1/11/16 at 2:38 pm to WestCoastAg
quote:
Incidental contact by the helmet of a runner or tackler against an opponent shall not be a foul.
I think they use this as a crutch for RBs all the time. They just aren't conditioned to call that type of penalty on a RB because half the time it could go the other way when RBs lower their head to "truck" someone. It doesn't have to be helmet-to-helmet to be a foul; you can lead with your helmet and hit someone in the stomach and that is a foul by the letter of the law.
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