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Questions regarding IRAs

Posted on 8/4/17 at 1:41 am
Posted by acadianatiger1992
Lafayette
Member since Jul 2017
32 posts
Posted on 8/4/17 at 1:41 am
My company does not offer a 401k plan so I am researching my options retirement accounts. I am currently eligible to contribute to a Roth IRA, but hope to be making over the limit in the next 5 years or so. In this case, would it make more sense to just open a traditional IRA and prevent having to transfer from one to the other? Also, what are your thoughts on using an online broker such as Wealthfront for this account?
This post was edited on 8/4/17 at 2:47 am
Posted by Croacka
Denham Springs
Member since Dec 2008
61441 posts
Posted on 8/4/17 at 6:46 am to
You won't have to transfer anything, you just won't be able to add to the balance


If you are making near the Roth limit now, it starts to make less sense to not take advantage of the pretax contributions. That's JMO, but you can argue both ways. It will depend on what tax bracket/rate your distributions will see down the road.


For online brokers, I recommend fidelity but honestly haven't researched many other options. I just know they have some great funds and fee structures.
This post was edited on 8/4/17 at 6:47 am
Posted by NYNolaguy1
Member since May 2011
20898 posts
Posted on 8/4/17 at 9:03 am to
quote:

Also, what are your thoughts on using an online broker such as Wealthfront for this account?


Vanguard index fund for the win.

You wont find lower expense ratios. Look into their retirement target funds too.
Posted by Teddy Ruxpin
Member since Oct 2006
39584 posts
Posted on 8/4/17 at 9:05 am to
quote:

My company does not offer a 401k plan


Ya...I wouldn't be cool with this at all.
Posted by UpstairsComputer
Prairieville
Member since Jan 2017
1576 posts
Posted on 8/4/17 at 9:08 am to
Google "Back Door Roth IRA". While I would expect this known workaround to be changed within five years... clearly the federal government can't get anything done, so maybe it'll still be there. Until it's not, this is your answer.

Avoid target date funds. They're stoopid.
Posted by acadianatiger1992
Lafayette
Member since Jul 2017
32 posts
Posted on 8/4/17 at 8:30 pm to
Do you mean taking advantage of the traditional IRA and claiming those funds as tax deductions? I know that I won't be over the Roth limit this year, but it's very possible that I will next year.

As far as the 401k, I am a recent grad (PETE) and just happy to have a job at all relating to my field. Not exactly in a position to be picky about benefits.
Posted by Fat Bastard
coach, investor, gambler
Member since Mar 2009
72707 posts
Posted on 8/4/17 at 8:38 pm to
quote:

Avoid target date funds. They're stoopid.




agreed. they are for the ultra lazy
Posted by Croacka
Denham Springs
Member since Dec 2008
61441 posts
Posted on 8/5/17 at 7:23 pm to
quote:

Do you mean taking advantage of the traditional IRA and claiming those funds as tax deductions?


Yes, you may be better off taking the tax deduction now if you are a high earner. A ROTH is perfect when you are starting out and in a low tax bracket. It loses appeal when you get into the higher brackets IMO.

But it's impossible to predict the future with regard to how taxes will be handled when you retire.
Posted by UpstairsComputer
Prairieville
Member since Jan 2017
1576 posts
Posted on 8/6/17 at 12:23 pm to
Not to be argumentative, but when was the last time you heard of a balanced budget coming out of Washington? We'll probably hit $20T in the next few weeks: US Debt Clock and the liberal spend spend spend attitude has taken over the republican party as well. Sorry, if you prepare and save, you'll be a "millionaire and billionaire" who needs to "pay your fair share" when you retire. Just saying, if you're 40, how big do you think that debt will be when you're 70?

Who pays for that? The computers who will be working those minimum wage jobs?
Posted by Croacka
Denham Springs
Member since Dec 2008
61441 posts
Posted on 8/6/17 at 1:46 pm to
I agree, but who's to say that they won't figure out a way to tax those Roth accounts when the time comes.
Posted by tirebiter
7K R&G chile land aka SF
Member since Oct 2006
9240 posts
Posted on 8/6/17 at 1:48 pm to
In your specific situation I would fund a Roth. You likely are not looking at significant tax savings this year in a TIRA. People can quibble over whether target retirement funds are the best option, they are far from the worst, especially given a small sum of money. If you have an HSA option with health insurance consider funding that, too. I recently looked at my wife and my tax deferred holdings and what RMDs may look like in 16 years and it is ugly and that is with Roths, HSA, etc. Sometimes it is best to pay minimal taxes early with the Roth than much more to convert later due to income stacking/marginal tax rates.
Posted by UpstairsComputer
Prairieville
Member since Jan 2017
1576 posts
Posted on 8/6/17 at 7:55 pm to
True story, I suppose. Under current rules and without grandfathering of the rules... I would think the more likely scenario is a wealth tax. If you're worth over $XXX, you get taxed an extra % per year, not necessarily on the income.

The people who are paying attention, for the most part, are the people who are preparing for the future too. Typically you don't bite the hand that feeds you. Thus, nothing happens.
Posted by player711
Member since Jun 2006
285 posts
Posted on 8/6/17 at 9:41 pm to
You can only contribute $5500 in an IRA?
Just a question - how you get wealthy off of that?

I would look at saving 10-20% of your income in a vehicle that grows tax free, not tax deferred.
Do you believe taxes are going up or down?
Traditional IRAs also can tax 85% of your social security as well.

How much of your retirement do you want to share with the government?

The only plans that are tax free is;
Roth IRA, Municipal Bonds, and A properly structured Cash Value life insurance.

Life insurance is not controlled by the government and there are unlimited contributions to them. If structured correctly your money is accessible in year 1, guaranteed growth, and you can take out loans as non recourse financing to buy real estate and other secure investments...

Something to consider.,,
Posted by UpstairsComputer
Prairieville
Member since Jan 2017
1576 posts
Posted on 8/7/17 at 10:43 am to
Sounds like someone works at NWM... That was a great line of questions leading to a high commission product... like it came out of some notes even...

Quick question, exactly who regulates the State Department of Insurance?

Are there any surrender penalties and for how long? How much do you have to put in up-front? Monthly? What is the internal costs associated with it? What's the COI? If you have that much money, why do you need a loan? Is it a net zero loan? What if I lose my job and can't afford the premiums, get a divorce, or the market doesn't perform like the illustration?

Asking for a friend...
Posted by tirebiter
7K R&G chile land aka SF
Member since Oct 2006
9240 posts
Posted on 8/7/17 at 1:29 pm to
quote:

I agree, but who's to say that they won't figure out a way to tax those Roth accounts when the time comes.


I don't envision that happening, then again it's the government. Even the level of wealth subject to estate tax has been increased to where it affects very few people, ie in 2017 a single person's wealth would need to exceed $5.49M and it's double for a married couple.
Posted by player711
Member since Jun 2006
285 posts
Posted on 8/9/17 at 9:17 pm to
quote:

Sounds like someone works at NWM... That was a great line of questions leading to a high commission product... like it came out of some notes even... Quick question, exactly who regulates the State Department of Insurance? Are there any surrender penalties and for how long? How much do you have to put in up-front? Monthly? What is the internal costs associated with it? What's the COI? If you have that much money, why do you need a loan? Is it a net zero loan? What if I lose my job and can't afford the premiums, get a divorce, or the market doesn't perform like the illustration? Asking for a friend...


1) I've never worked at , nor ever will work at Northwestern Mutual. Please...
2) I don't sell High Comission Insurance Products. You and I both know that those are geared towards lining the pocketbooks of insurance agents, not the consumer. I have been doing this a long time and ultimately you don't know what you don't know.
3) The State Regulates Insurance Companies
4) The cost of insurance is cheaper than any insurance or investment fund that you know of... cheaper than Vanguard for sure. I can send you an excel spreadsheet if you want.,
5) There are no surrender penalties. There are only surrender penalties with universal life, overpriced whole life, and annuities.
6) You determine how much you want to put in, if you qualify w/underwriting. The consumer is in control.
7) you don't have to take a loan, but the r a son for it is because you have a greater need for financing than you do for protection. You die once, you make larger purchases and expenses every year.
8) The loan is Simple interest and the growth is compound interest. Therefore, structured like those all are "net zero" loans. You either sell indexed universal life or know someone that does.....
9) lastly, these contracts/policies are not dependent on the market. The owner of the policy is eligible to receive dividends and there are contractual guarantees. If you lose your job, divorce, wouldn't your whole financial landscape take a hit? Nonetheless, there are several ways (5-6) to avoid making premiums if something like that happened.. that all depends and is a much deeper question...

Usually I don't spell it out on here, but hope that helps your "friend"...??
Posted by UpstairsComputer
Prairieville
Member since Jan 2017
1576 posts
Posted on 8/10/17 at 8:02 am to
Take an upvote. I appreciate the response. I'll pass that along to my friend. Sounds like defining where it may work and where it wouldn't makes all the difference.

What type of policy are you talking about if it's not whole or universal? Variable?
This post was edited on 8/10/17 at 8:10 am
Posted by player711
Member since Jun 2006
285 posts
Posted on 8/10/17 at 7:00 pm to
quote:

Take an upvote. I appreciate the response. I'll pass that along to my friend. Sounds like defining where it may work and where it wouldn't makes all the difference. What type of policy are you talking about if it's not whole or universal? Variable?


It is not a traditional whole life, where there is a lot t of fees. I am talking about putting a rider/enhancement on The policy to decrease the commission to the insurance agent and kick start the growth on the policy.
You structure it to where the goal of starting the overfunded whole life policy is for growth enough for protection. It is for tax benefits, liquidity to the money, along with having a small life insurance benefit attached to it. You are not doing it for insurance, but for accumulation and utilization of those funds growing in the policy.
Posted by UpstairsComputer
Prairieville
Member since Jan 2017
1576 posts
Posted on 8/11/17 at 10:54 am to
So what's the stated interest received?
Posted by player711
Member since Jun 2006
285 posts
Posted on 8/11/17 at 9:10 pm to
In today's low interest rate environment you will net an average of 4-5%.
The insurance company contractually guarantees a percentage and every year, not guaranteed (yet a dividend has always paid out for 100+ years) you receive profits from the insurance company called dividends.
By law, mutual insurance companies have to return profits back to their owners. Therefore, if you have a policy you are co-owner of the company.
The 4-5% over long haul is compared to 7-9% every year inside a managed brokerage account, because there is no taxes come about Hillary, and management fees/expenses/mutual fund turnover, etc...
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