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Message
re: Patrick Peterson on the first long TD pass
Posted on 11/29/10 at 12:31 pm to LSUdm21
Posted on 11/29/10 at 12:31 pm to LSUdm21
quote:
False. It wasn't a zone man coverage. It was a depth coverage.
In that coverage, Peterson's #1 responsibility is to play underneath and not allow that pass to be completed at that depth (it was only 10-12 yards downfield).
He peeled off on the short route too early and it cost them when Hatcher took the bad angle. Hatcher's play was much worse but Peterson made a mistake as well.
1
Posted on 11/29/10 at 12:32 pm to moneyg
This post is giving me a headache 
Posted on 11/29/10 at 12:34 pm to jwill37
quote:
I love the guys that come on here and say oh we were in a zone read ot Tampa 2 blah blah blah like they know what the hell they're talking about.
But it was Cover 2. It had to be. That is the only explanation as to why he jumped the flat route.
He shouldn't have done that anyway, because even in Cover 2 you drop as far as slot guy goes. Arkansas was in trips, and the 2 outer receivers went vertical. He has to drop as far as the slot the guy goes, otherwise you have 1 safety trying to cover 2 guys.
Posted on 11/29/10 at 1:00 pm to LSUdm21
quote:
LSUdm21
You obviously have no clue how cover schemes work.
First of all, it was a great throw against a poor coverage scheme for that play. Watch the replay, they are in trips left, tight end on the right, and motion the RB to the Left side. We have Hatcher who does have deep halves(more like deep thirds bc the overload on the short side of the field), Peterson has flats if the 2 reciever runs an out in that zone(which he doesn't, he ran a straight fly), Kelvin has curl to flats(which he covered, following the slot to the flats).
When Peterson read pass, his assignment was to stay in 1s pocket and read 2. If 2 runs flats, Peterson has him, if not, stay in hip of 1 and have safety help from Hatcher over the top. Peterson jumped the route that was in flats, Kelvin's zone, since the 2 ran up. This left Hatcher out to dry, having to cover both verts which is impossible, as we found out, if a good throw is made.
Another thing that no one has pointed out yet is what happened on the other side of the ball. There was a tight end and that was it. The Rb had motioned to the left. The corner has man on the tight end due to the Fs, reid, being lined up on the trips side tackle and having deep halves(really just deep middle, bc the tight end should be easily covered in man by the corner, and just has to watch for a deep crossing route). The tight end actually stayed in to block, as did the Rb. Ideally, reid would have noticed no reason to cover anything inside of the hashes, and given hatcher some help so that he could be the one step closer that he needed to make up for Petersons mistake.
Finally, this was a scouted play. They left eight men in to block four. They knew this was a formation that would give them a chance at catching Peterson being over agressive. The formation and play call worked perfectly and it is either the luckiest call ever, with routes that make no since, or Chavis got outcoached here.
I have been proud of our D most of the season and in no way am trying to put down Peterson. I am worried that all of these mistakes were made on this one play, especially since this is all basic zone that even I learned in high school. But I also understand that the game is played at a speed that most of us wouldn't even be able to fathom. Just to finish, Hatcher was the least at fault out of all of the DBs. He came within two feet of saving a touchdown that Peterson had given up.
Posted on 11/29/10 at 1:04 pm to Tiger Ryno
quote:
Patrick Peterson is the most overrated player I've ever seen at LSU. He is very good, but he was billed as teh best in the nation. He simply did not make enough big plays as a defensive player to warrant such credit. He didn't do anything in our biggest games against the best opponents.
Posted on 11/29/10 at 1:13 pm to geauxaddai
gauxaddai, I actually said what you wrote after seeing that comment. For the guy who made that comment,
PP intercepted the last play of the game against Ole Miss, played as well as you could against JJ against Alabama (if you rewatch the game, PP was right with him for most of those receptions, good routs and throws beat good coverage every time), he shut down both JJ and AJGreen last year, he had 2 of the most amazing INT's i have ever seen against Miss. State and ULM this year. Your comment was probably one of the dumbest comments I have ever seen.
PP intercepted the last play of the game against Ole Miss, played as well as you could against JJ against Alabama (if you rewatch the game, PP was right with him for most of those receptions, good routs and throws beat good coverage every time), he shut down both JJ and AJGreen last year, he had 2 of the most amazing INT's i have ever seen against Miss. State and ULM this year. Your comment was probably one of the dumbest comments I have ever seen.
Posted on 11/29/10 at 1:29 pm to Tiger Ryno
quote:
Patrick Peterson is the most overrated player I've ever seen at LSU. He is very good, but he was billed as teh best in the nation. He simply did not make enough big plays as a defensive player to warrant such credit. He didn't do anything in our biggest games against the best opponents.
I like PP just as much as most everyone else but I do have to agree somewhat with what you're saying and what another poster said here as well. However, I wouldn't say that he is overrated...he is clearly head and shoulders above others in the SEC and he is a damn good football player.
I do agree that he didn't really show up in our biggest games. Now that could also be attributed to those teams scheming around him also. Which would limit his production.
Can't lay everything from the Ark game at his feet. But, he could have made better decisions and the entire defense should be taken back to basics for tackling drills. That TD at the end of the half was completely inexcusable and should never have happened. There were many running plays where the DE's shot up the field and Davis would cut inside...burning them every single time. No LB filling the gap and he would tear off 7+ yds each time.
This felt a lot like the Auburn game...no adjustments and the defense was burned for 3-4 big plays.
Posted on 11/29/10 at 1:29 pm to LSUtiger17
quote:
I love the guys that come on here and say oh we were in a zone read ot Tampa 2 blah blah blah like they know what the hell they're talking about.
quote:
You obviously have no clue how cover schemes work.
I love the guys that come on here and tell the guys that come on here telling everyone they don't know what the hell they're talking about that they don't know what the hell they're talking about...
Posted on 11/29/10 at 1:31 pm to billyholawboy
quote:
watched that play a few times and noticed he jumped the short route pretty early.
.
This post was edited on 11/29/10 at 1:34 pm
Posted on 11/29/10 at 1:41 pm to WildTchoupitoulas
quote:
I love the guys that come on here and tell the guys that come on here telling everyone they don't know what the hell they're talking about that they don't know what the hell they're talking about...
What in my post is incorrect?
Posted on 11/29/10 at 1:43 pm to WildTchoupitoulas
I have to admit. That was funny. 
Posted on 11/29/10 at 1:44 pm to Tiger Ryno
You have lost your freaking mind. Watch on Sundays pal.
Posted on 11/29/10 at 1:54 pm to LSUdm21
quote:
It was a zone coverage. PP7 had short, Shep was dropping back to take intermediate and Hatcher was suppose to have deep. He took a HORRIBLE angle on that play.
The fail was all on Hatcher, just as it was right before the half when he took out Claiborne. Two horrible plays. The double-move on fourth and short that beat T-Rex, on the other hand, was just an outstanding play by Mallett and Adams. The first two td's were nice completions that Hatcher turned into touchdowns. Taylor was sorely missed in that game.
Posted on 11/29/10 at 1:58 pm to NorfolkTiger
It is a Coaches (NOT RANTARDS) selection as an All American. Did he make some mistakes, yeah, but so does Revis, Greer and other elite CB's. Only thing is when DB makes an error everyone in world sees it
Posted on 11/29/10 at 2:02 pm to NorfolkTiger
Hatcher is lucky to make across a busy street, without getting hit; taking deep angles, that keep him in the street longer ,instead of straight across and short.But the 14 pts the DB's cost were mainly thinking problems are lack there of, they just couldn' t process and conclude to play for, the wrap up tackles, instead of going for the ball, or the flying hit.Experience teaches, I hope
Posted on 11/29/10 at 2:08 pm to LSUtiger17
quote:
You obviously have no clue how cover schemes work.
First of all, it was a great throw against a poor coverage scheme for that play. Watch the replay, they are in trips left, tight end on the right, and motion the RB to the Left side. We have Hatcher who does have deep halves(more like deep thirds bc the overload on the short side of the field), Peterson has flats if the 2 reciever runs an out in that zone(which he doesn't, he ran a straight fly), Kelvin has curl to flats(which he covered, following the slot to the flats).
When Peterson read pass, his assignment was to stay in 1s pocket and read 2. If 2 runs flats, Peterson has him, if not, stay in hip of 1 and have safety help from Hatcher over the top. Peterson jumped the route that was in flats, Kelvin's zone, since the 2 ran up. This left Hatcher out to dry, having to cover both verts which is impossible, as we found out, if a good throw is made.
Another thing that no one has pointed out yet is what happened on the other side of the ball. There was a tight end and that was it. The Rb had motioned to the left. The corner has man on the tight end due to the Fs, reid, being lined up on the trips side tackle and having deep halves(really just deep middle, bc the tight end should be easily covered in man by the corner, and just has to watch for a deep crossing route). The tight end actually stayed in to block, as did the Rb. Ideally, reid would have noticed no reason to cover anything inside of the hashes, and given hatcher some help so that he could be the one step closer that he needed to make up for Petersons mistake.
Finally, this was a scouted play. They left eight men in to block four. They knew this was a formation that would give them a chance at catching Peterson being over agressive. The formation and play call worked perfectly and it is either the luckiest call ever, with routes that make no since, or Chavis got outcoached here.
I have been proud of our D most of the season and in no way am trying to put down Peterson. I am worried that all of these mistakes were made on this one play, especially since this is all basic zone that even I learned in high school. But I also understand that the game is played at a speed that most of us wouldn't even be able to fathom. Just to finish, Hatcher was the least at fault out of all of the DBs. He came within two feet of saving a touchdown that Peterson had given up.
I'm glad you took the time to call me out only to say the EXACT same thing I said. PP7 read the short route. Kelvin was running straight back as soon as the ball was snapped. Hatcher was the help over the top and he took the most awful angle I've ever seen in my life. But thanks for "correcting" me coach.
Btw, here's the clip. Go to the 1:23 mark.
LINK
Posted on 11/29/10 at 2:18 pm to LSUdm21
You said PP had the short route. This implies that he was doing his job, which he wasn't. Also, I realize that I called the weak lb Kelvin, I meant weak lb had those assignments. Kelvin had no role in the play. Hatcher did take a bad angle, but on 3rd and 9 with the ball in the air past the 1st down marker, I can't blame him for trying to jar it loose. If he hadn't been open it would've been a non-issue.
Posted on 11/29/10 at 2:22 pm to LSUtiger17
quote:
You said PP had the short route. This implies that he was doing his job, which he wasn't. Also, I realize that I called the weak lb Kelvin, I meant weak lb had those assignments. Kelvin had no role in the play. Hatcher did take a bad angle, but on 3rd and 9 with the ball in the air past the 1st down marker, I can't blame him for trying to jar it loose. If he hadn't been open it would've been a non-issue.
Watch the video. Baker stops in the middle of the field. PP7 takes the short out, Kelvin is running at full speed about 15 yds down the middle of the field and Hatcher is coming over the top. Hatcher takes an awful angle.
eta: How do YOU know PP7 wasn't SUPPOSE to take that route?
This post was edited on 11/29/10 at 2:23 pm
Posted on 11/29/10 at 2:32 pm to LSUdm21
quote:
Baker stops in the middle of the field.
Baker probably should have continued with his man. It was stupid for him to stop at curls and not continue to flats with his man being the only one who could fill the curl zone leaving it. Watch the play, Mallet was waiting for PP to jump the short route. He never had any intention of throwing it anywhere but to 1. They ran a decoy for peterson and a fly to keep hatcher honest, and Mallet made a great throw to an instride reciever. I feel pretty confident that the play was solely for the purpose of trying to catch PP being over agressive.
quote:
How do YOU know PP7 wasn't SUPPOSE to take that route?
If it was the cover 2 that literally is universal and constant in football, he wasn't supposed to. If he was, it's a stupid scheme leaving a safety to cover two people unassisted. I feel pretty confident it was the first situation, and I know this Because I KNOW HOW COVER 2 WORKS BECAUSE I HAVE ACTUALLY STEPPED FOOT ON A FOOTBALL FIELD.
Posted on 11/29/10 at 2:47 pm to RANDY44
quote:
The fail was all on Hatcher, just as it was right before the half when he took out Claiborne.
On the first long TD the fail was Hatcher.
The second one before half was Eric Reid. For what it is worth.
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