Why are you bringing up high school and college? There's a lot less talent so good players have a greater impact. Kareem was also probably a foot taller than most of the players he played against in high school.

quote:
Jordan never had a great supporting cast but he made average players champions.

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Posted by Baloo

Formerly MDGeaux

Member since Sep 2003

49645 posts

Posted on 5/4/17 at 4:04 pm to pvilleguru

On a longer and longer timeline, all that is left of a player is his statistical record. The stories become legends and get discarded, and when we evaluate older players, we use stats. It's honestly the only way. None of us saw, say, Three Finger Brown throw a baseball.

But context is super important. Numbers don't always mean the same thing, and without context, they are virtually meaningless. You need to know a player relative to his league and the style of play or even his home arena (like the narrow boards at the Garden or the huge Polo Grounds).

But I tend to favor black/grey ink stats. How many times did you lead the league in something. How many times were you top 10. How did you, relative to your peers? That cuts down a lot a noise regarding fluctuating scoring averages.

Championships are like extra credit.

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Posted by GumBro Jackson

Raleigh

Member since Mar 2011

3115 posts

Posted on 5/4/17 at 4:06 pm to pvilleguru

I think some of it depends on sport. IMO championships are more important in some sports than others. For instance in baseball championships are less important b/c there are so many other teammates and one person can only do so much. You could be by far the greatest pitcher of all time, but you only play once every three or four games and I would not have a problem with the GOAT having zero or one championship if all the stats, longevity, etc were there.

In basketball it is more important b/c there are only five guys on the court at once and you have more ability to control the outcome.

In individual sports (I'm thinking tennis and golf) championships are much more important still b/c you are the only one out there.

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Posted by mizzoubuckeyeiowa

Member since Nov 2015

35626 posts

Posted on 5/4/17 at 4:12 pm to pvilleguru

Oh yeah...world beaters...

Jack Haley
Will Perdue
Bill Cartwright
Stacy King
Bill Wennington
Corie Blount
Bison Dele

Those were his centers during the age of centers in the league. Awesome guys to go against Shaq.