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kingbob 
LSU Fan
St. Amant, LA
Member since Nov 2010
9215 posts
| re: " I don't care what anyone does as long as it doesn't affect me" (Posted on 3/19/13 at 4:37 pm to DawgfaninCa)
quote:
We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness.--That to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed,
It seems you missed this part. 
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H-Town Tiger 
Virginia Tech Fan
DIANELANEPANETRANE
Member since Nov 2003
41144 posts
 Online
| re: " I don't care what anyone does as long as it doesn't affect me" (Posted on 3/19/13 at 4:44 pm to DawgfaninCa)
quote:
It seems to me if you don't believe in a creator then you don't believe you have unalienable rights endowed upon you by your creator.
That means you believe the only rights you have are endowed upon you by man and any right endowed upon you by man can be taken away from you by man.
This faulty logic. Natural rights are rights you are born with, whether you believe you were created by a devine power or the result of natural evolution, you are born free, only the contraints of man can deny you those rights.
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tigersaint26
LSU Fan
In front of my computer
Member since Sep 2005
1024 posts
| re: " I don't care what anyone does as long as it doesn't affect me" (Posted on 3/19/13 at 5:42 pm to H-Town Tiger)
So there is a Creator: check
He says it is not right to be gay: check
PS: being gay is not natural evolution, that would be deevolution since they can't mate and have offspring with each other.
This post was edited on 3/19 at 5:48 pm
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Revelator
Member since Nov 2008
9561 posts
Online
| re: " I don't care what anyone does as long as it doesn't affect me" (Posted on 3/19/13 at 6:42 pm to DawgfaninCa)
quote:
I don't know what country you live in but it can't be the USA because the USA's Declaration of Independence declares the individual's unalienable rights are endowed to them by their creator. It says nothing about the individual having "natural" rights. It seems to me if you don't believe in a creator then you don't believe you have unalienable rights endowed upon you by your creator. That means you believe the only rights you have are endowed upon you by man and any right endowed upon you by man can be taken away from you by man.
I might put this on a t-shirt Dawg!
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Antonio Moss
LSU Fan
Baton Rouge
Member since Mar 2006
25531 posts
| re: " I don't care what anyone does as long as it doesn't affect me" (Posted on 3/19/13 at 6:46 pm to Revelator)
quote:
It says nothing about the individual having "natural" rights
Wow. Really?
I would tell you to keep reading, but it's in the first fricking paragraph.
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cwill 
New Orleans Saints Fan
Member since Jan 2005
19216 posts
| re: " I don't care what anyone does as long as it doesn't affect me" (Posted on 3/19/13 at 6:53 pm to Revelator)
quote:
I might put this on a t-shirt Dawg!
I think in Dawg you've found your intellectual equal.
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Tom288 
Florida Fan
Member since Apr 2009
16856 posts
| re: " I don't care what anyone does as long as it doesn't affect me" (Posted on 3/19/13 at 9:16 pm to Revelator)
quote:
Is it the failure or organized religion that so few attain to be morally above average?
Actually, a person's moral maturity ripens in spite of organized religion, not because of it.
quote:
How can a society continue to prosper if there is no standards or common acceptance of what is good and what is bad?
There are. But to go with your point, who decides what these common standards are? For that matter, what are these common standards and why are/were they chosen?
If you want stagnation then you'll hope for just such a society, where morality and ethics are bound to some non-existent "objective" code that actually differs from person to person. A society only prospers when it's able to actively engage serious moral questions without restriction or limitation. If you want to see society decline, then leave it as it is, shackled to an archaic, arbitrary system that should have been thrown out centuries ago.
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DawgfaninCa 
Georgia Fan
San Francisco, California
Member since Sep 2012
1698 posts
| re: " I don't care what anyone does as long as it doesn't affect me" (Posted on 3/19/13 at 11:20 pm to Antonio Moss)
quote:
Wow. Really?
I would tell you to keep reading, but it's in the first fricking paragraph.
quote:
When in the Course of human events, it becomes necessary for one people to dissolve the political bands which have connected them with another, and to assume among the powers of the earth, the separate and equal station to which the Laws of Nature and of Nature's God entitle them, a decent respect to the opinions of mankind requires that they should declare the causes which impel them to the separation.
That passage refers to a GROUP OF PEOPLE having the right to separate themselves and form their own country.
It says nothing about the individual having "natural" rights.
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DawgfaninCa
Georgia Fan
San Francisco, California
Member since Sep 2012
1698 posts
| re: " I don't care what anyone does as long as it doesn't affect me" (Posted on 3/19/13 at 11:27 pm to kingbob)
quote:
We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness.--That to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed,[/quote]
[quote]It seems you missed this part.
I didn't miss that.
It's irrelevant to who gives you your unalienable rights.
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DawgfaninCa
Georgia Fan
San Francisco, California
Member since Sep 2012
1698 posts
| re: " I don't care what anyone does as long as it doesn't affect me" (Posted on 3/19/13 at 11:29 pm to H-Town Tiger)
quote:
This faulty logic. Natural rights are rights you are born with, whether you believe you were created by a devine power or the result of natural evolution, you are born free, only the contraints of man can deny you those rights.
Who says you are born free with natural rights?
You?
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DawgfaninCa
Georgia Fan
San Francisco, California
Member since Sep 2012
1698 posts
| re: " I don't care what anyone does as long as it doesn't affect me" (Posted on 3/19/13 at 11:34 pm to Tom288)
quote:
Actually, some people's amoral immaturity ripens in spite of organized religion, not because of it.
FIFY
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DawgfaninCa
Georgia Fan
San Francisco, California
Member since Sep 2012
1698 posts
| re: " I don't care what anyone does as long as it doesn't affect me" (Posted on 3/19/13 at 11:48 pm to Tom288)
quote:
There are. But to go with your point, who decides what these common standards are?
In California, the people did when they passed Proposition 8.
quote:
For that matter, what are these common standards and why are/were they chosen?
My signature answers that question.
quote:
If you want stagnation then you'll hope for just such a society, where morality and ethics are bound to some non-existent "objective" code that actually differs from person to person.
Go out and murder someone then turn yourself in and we'll see if some "objective" code doesn't exist and if it differs from person to person.
quote:
A society only prospers when it's able to actively engage serious moral questions without restriction or limitation.
Some serious moral questions have been answered a long time ago and don't need to be revisited without restriction or limitation.
quote:
If you want to see society decline, then leave it as it is, shackled to an archaic, arbitrary system that should have been thrown out centuries ago.
Which archaic, arbitrary system are you talking about?
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SidewalkDawg
Georgia Fan
North Georgia
Member since Nov 2012
230 posts
| re: " I don't care what anyone does as long as it doesn't affect me" (Posted on 3/20/13 at 12:39 am to DawgfaninCa)
quote:
Nonsense. A positive biological father/mother relationship is always better for the children than a positive or negative woman/woman or man/man relationship. Are you one of this people who think children should be taken anyway from a loving but poor mother and father and given to rich lesbians or homosexual men because the children's life will be "better"?
Your attempts to pass opinion as fact tells me that you are either disingenuous, or worse, a complete idiot. Good day sir.
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Blue Velvet 
Colorado State Fan
Venice, LA
Member since Nov 2009
12739 posts
| re: " I don't care what anyone does as long as it doesn't affect me" (Posted on 3/20/13 at 12:41 am to DawgfaninCa)
quote:
Most heterosexual men won't marry a woman they don't "love" just to get tax breaks because then they won't be able to marry the woman they fall in "love" with when they meet her.
Unlike homosexual couples?quote:
Nope, for heterosexual men, having to do all that ain't worth the tax breaks.
But it is for homosexuals?
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Tom288
Florida Fan
Member since Apr 2009
16856 posts
| re: " I don't care what anyone does as long as it doesn't affect me" (Posted on 3/20/13 at 2:53 am to DawgfaninCa)
quote:
FIFY
You didn't fix shit, so keep your stupid emoticon garbage out of your pathetic posts.
quote:
In California, the people did when they passed Proposition 8.
A single proposition in California encompasses the common standards of the entire society? And you may want to reconsider whose argument that example actually supports.
quote:
My signature answers that question.
Actually it says nothing relating to the question, so feel free to expound.
quote:
Go out and murder someone then turn yourself in and we'll see if some "objective" code doesn't exist and if it differs from person to person.
True objective morality would state that killing another person is always wrong, but that's not the case, is it? There is no leeway when it comes to objective codes or values.
quote:
Some serious moral questions have been answered a long time ago and don't need to be revisited without restriction or limitation.
Such as?
quote:
Which archaic, arbitrary system are you talking about?
Christianity...the Bible...considering I was responding to Revelator that should have been pretty obvious.
And just so you know, your emoticons make you look like an ass. And that's before we even get to the substance of your posts.
This post was edited on 3/20 at 2:55 am
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CollegeFBRules
LSU Fan
Member since Oct 2008
18284 posts
Online
| re: " I don't care what anyone does as long as it doesn't affect me" (Posted on 3/20/13 at 2:55 am to Tom288)
I quit paying attention to this thread a week ago...what's been happening in here? 
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Tom288
Florida Fan
Member since Apr 2009
16856 posts
| re: " I don't care what anyone does as long as it doesn't affect me" (Posted on 3/20/13 at 2:58 am to CollegeFBRules)
No idea. Just joined it and, as a responsible poster, I haven't bothered catching up on the entire thing before commenting.
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CollegeFBRules
LSU Fan
Member since Oct 2008
18284 posts
Online
| re: " I don't care what anyone does as long as it doesn't affect me" (Posted on 3/20/13 at 3:07 am to Tom288)
270+ posts, you'd be an idiot to do anything other than jump right in.
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Tom288
Florida Fan
Member since Apr 2009
16856 posts
| re: " I don't care what anyone does as long as it doesn't affect me" (Posted on 3/20/13 at 3:12 am to CollegeFBRules)
Quite right.
On a side note, I've recently discovered that you go through a lot more scotch when it's in a flask than when it's in a glass...
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CollegeFBRules
LSU Fan
Member since Oct 2008
18284 posts
Online
| re: " I don't care what anyone does as long as it doesn't affect me" (Posted on 3/20/13 at 3:23 am to Tom288)
So you're saying all your posts are being made with a sound mind and clear thought?
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