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re: Why Can't the United States Assemble a Championship Soccer Team?
Posted on 2/3/13 at 11:46 am to Dandy Lion
Posted on 2/3/13 at 11:46 am to Dandy Lion
quote:
like Crouch?
i'm talking about a top dribbler/passer. a ronaldo at 6-9
crouch is also slow and weak as frick
quote:
at best, one in twenty (maybe more) would result in a Yaya Touré. At best.
quite possibly, but it's not like we don't have ample quantity (theoretically) to throw out there. take out the basketball freaks and go for players who fit in the traditional soccer frame (5-8 to 6-4). i don't think you all realize just how many super athletes we have playing other sports in america in this range with better athleticism than all but a handful of soccer players
i'm not saying american soccer will ever get them, or that we need them to win. i'm saying that the idea of a "lebron" in soccer is always going to be there. that's why these debates become so common. we get to see these freaks in other sports and wonder what an American team of 11 of those guys (with the adequate level of top class skill) would do to the world
in a hypothetical world where all of our top guys played soccer, there is no reasoning that would limit a guy in the mold of lebron/kobe/tmac from eventually developing into a striker with world class skill (and freakish natural ability). they wouldn't all develop, but there is no reason why a few wouldn't emerge
1
Posted on 2/3/13 at 11:46 am to Dandy Lion
Big time hit or miss. Athletes with freak physical attributes often get left behind in soccer because they tend to rely on strength, speed and size more than technical proficiency and tactical knowledge.
Posted on 2/3/13 at 11:46 am to LSUSOBEAST1
quote:Beast gets it.
Athletes with freak physical attributes often get left behind in soccer because they tend to rely on strength, speed and size more than technical proficiency and tactical knowledge.
Posted on 2/3/13 at 11:47 am to LSUSOBEAST1
quote:
None, really, unless our developmental system changed.
that's assumed
give a lebron a ronaldo skillset and imagine what could happen. that's the concept that's being discussed
Posted on 2/3/13 at 11:50 am to SlowFlowPro
quote:this assumes WAAAAAAY too much. I assume you´re referring to Cristianito. Beast so eloquently pointed out a big item here. Even though you´ve got alot, I mean alot, of thickheads in professional soccer, they are Einstein like in comparison to the mental capacity of the stars whom you refer to. They couldn´t hack the technical and tactical requirements for 90 minutes, hell, 20.
give a lebron a ronaldo skillset
Posted on 2/3/13 at 11:50 am to LSUSOBEAST1
quote:
Athletes with freak physical attributes often get left behind in soccer because they tend to rely on strength, speed and size more than technical proficiency and tactical knowledge.
this applies in all sports, yet we will have super freak athletes who develop skills and tactics for their own sport
again, look at lebron. he'd be a borderline all-star if he lacked his awesome skillset and just played defense and rebounded. but he worked hard to develop his skills and a basketball mindset and he's the biggest thing since jordan
same with kobe
there are also TMacs, who didn't work
or in the NFL you have a calvin johnson who has worked hard to develop his skills, compared to a randy moss who didn't
all of your arguments are already established in other sports, and yet guys still emerge
Posted on 2/3/13 at 11:53 am to Dandy Lion
quote:
this assumes WAAAAAAY too much
we have so many freaks i'd imagine one day one would develop a ronaldo skillset
quote:
Even though you´ve got alot, I mean alot, of thickheads in professional soccer, they are Einstein like in comparison to the mental capacity of the stars whom you refer to. They couldn´t hack the technical and tactical requirements for 90 minutes, hell, 20.
what? guys like kobe and lebron could dominate in almost any sport they wanted to. it just happened to be basketball
america has a good number of these guys
but what we have in absolute abundance are the guys at the level below this. i mean an absolute embarassment of riches of potential guys who are more athletic than a ronaldo. assuming we could ever develop a legit training system, at some point a ronaldo would emerge from that group. if we had 10x the number of super athletes than portugal, and our developmental system was on par wth portugal's, we'd logically produce 10x the number of quality players
Posted on 2/3/13 at 11:59 am to SlowFlowPro
You have to realize that despite the athletic ability the REST of the world possesses, there is only one Cristiano. It isn't a coincidence.
Posted on 2/3/13 at 11:59 am to SlowFlowPro
more athletic. maybe. I still think they´d have fits with the ball, and probably wouldn´t have the stick to itness needed to succeed (basketball development needs much less time than soccer IMO, given their/the athletic ability or capacity, of course).
I don´t think the game would as they say here, slow down enough for them, especially in La Liga or Serie A, and the technical portion would make these players you assume would pop out like muffins from an oven, be a needle in a haystack. One in a million. Seriously.
I don´t think the game would as they say here, slow down enough for them, especially in La Liga or Serie A, and the technical portion would make these players you assume would pop out like muffins from an oven, be a needle in a haystack. One in a million. Seriously.
This post was edited on 2/3/13 at 12:02 pm
Posted on 2/3/13 at 12:01 pm to LSUSOBEAST1
quote:
You have to realize that despite the athletic ability the REST of the world possesses
it's nowhere near our athletic ability (at least in nations that have the infrastructure to develop athletes in general)
quote:
there is only one Cristiano. It isn't a coincidence.
obviously. he's the best player in the world so he's the standard
Posted on 2/3/13 at 12:06 pm to Dandy Lion
quote:
basketball development needs much less time than soccer IMO,
not for full development. basketball just allows for certain guys who haven't developed to contribute, which is the difference
lebron wasn't the full package until he was 24-25 or so, which falls in line with soccer development
quote:
I don´t think the game would as they say here, slow down enough for them,
why? i'll jump to another sport, but if players can handle the complexity of football, they can handle the complexity of soccer. football is a LOT more mentally intense than any other sport
quote:
and the technical portion would make these players you assume would pop out like muffins from an oven, be a needle in a haystack
it's always a needle in a haystack
adding tens of thousands of elite athletes means more needles to be found on top of the ones we're already producing
again, i'm not saying that had lebron played soccer seriously from age 6 on he'd be the best in the world.
i AM saying that if (1) America had a good technical development system (say on par with holland, italy, or portugal) and (2) soccer got the best of the best ahead of baketball, football, and baseball, we would have some freakish guys playing at very high technical levels. it may not be lebron james or calvin johnson, but it would be somebody currently playing another sport
quote:
One in a million. Seriously.
we have more millions than anybody else
This post was edited on 2/3/13 at 12:06 pm
Posted on 2/3/13 at 12:08 pm to SlowFlowPro
So basketball players are freak athletes because they are tall? They are freaks of nature, but not freak athletes (they are, but not just based upon their size). Out of the big 4 sports, its by far the easiest to teach and play (I played bball, soccer and football).
What soccer players can do with their feet is absokutely unreal. The amount of time and work it takes to be a half competent player is quite a good bit.
Basketball players and soccer players are on an equal field when it comes to athleticism. As is football (I guess baseball can go there too)
What soccer players can do with their feet is absokutely unreal. The amount of time and work it takes to be a half competent player is quite a good bit.
Basketball players and soccer players are on an equal field when it comes to athleticism. As is football (I guess baseball can go there too)
Posted on 2/3/13 at 12:08 pm to SlowFlowPro
I didn´t mention football. I avoided it, because at first, I was in agreement with this line of thought. Then again, let´s all remember that in American football, you play for three to five seconds, then regroup and plan again. Also, you have ONE job, which varies at times in complexity.
Meh. Seriously, meh.
Meh. Seriously, meh.
This post was edited on 2/3/13 at 12:11 pm
Posted on 2/3/13 at 12:11 pm to Dandy Lion
When you get to the professional level in football, the tactical game is absolutely amazing.
Football was usually more mentally challenging for over soccer, probably because I only played football in my latter HS years (played soccer my whole life)
Football was usually more mentally challenging for over soccer, probably because I only played football in my latter HS years (played soccer my whole life)
Posted on 2/3/13 at 12:11 pm to bluebarracuda
quote:
So basketball players are freak athletes because they are tall?
no. they're the most explosive athletes playing american sports, typically. speed/quickness/explosion
the true freak of freaks are the 6-6+ guys who have the athletic ability of NFL CBs, though
quote:
What soccer players can do with their feet is absokutely unreal. The amount of time and work it takes to be a half competent player is quite a good bit.
how hard do you think it is for a 6-6+ guy to develop a handle comparable to players half a foot shorter?
that's not exactly easy either
quote:
Basketball players and soccer players are on an equal field when it comes to athleticism
so if we had a combine of explosive ability, you'd expect soccer players to be comparable?
Posted on 2/3/13 at 12:11 pm to SlowFlowPro
quote:
top dribbler
quote:
6-9
I don't care how athletic you are. 6'9" is far too tall to be an effective dribbler in a game that is played at the feet.
Lionel Messi is a much better dribbler than Ronaldo, anyway.
Posted on 2/3/13 at 12:12 pm to SlowFlowPro
Am I the only one that thinks a 6'9 270lb striker wouldn't exactly the most nimble or lightest on his feet. Not to mention the fitness required to play 90'+...
Posted on 2/3/13 at 12:13 pm to Dandy Lion
quote:
Then again, let´s all remember that in American football, you play for three to five seconds, then regroup and plan again
yes there is an aerobic/anaerobic difference. i'm not denying that. the biggest difference would be in strength. that's why when i talked about lebron i talked about his height only, b/c he would be more like 220 and not 260
Posted on 2/3/13 at 12:13 pm to SlowFlowPro
quote:I agree, but I believe your premise was that the US of A would have 27 super studs that would regularly shite stomp the rest of the world. At least this was the opinion of the moronic OP, was it not?
we would have some freakish guys playing at very high technical levels
Posted on 2/3/13 at 12:14 pm to bluebarracuda
quote:You played soccer in America. BIG DIFFERENCE.
Football was usually more mentally challenging for over soccer, probably because I only played football in my latter HS years (played soccer my whole life)
Also, let´s look at this in depth.
Mentally, a QB would grasp it, no doubt. Safeties, ditto.
Linemen, especially OL, probably would grasp it, but they certainly have no business on a football pitch. Strike a shitload of people from the potential list.
WRs, doubtful, CBs, doubtful.
Some LBs, no doubt.
RBs, doubtful.
That´s it.
This post was edited on 2/3/13 at 12:18 pm
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