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rsande2 
LSU Fan
Member since Jan 2006
3423 posts
| re: Hobby Lobby gives Obamacare the finger (Posted on 12/28/12 at 3:18 pm to Lsut81)
quote:
I 100% support Hobby Lobby
quote:
I think I may go shop there just to show my support.
+1
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Jbird 
Iowa Fan
Odramaville with EthanL
Member since Oct 2012
4951 posts
| re: Hobby Lobby gives Obamacare the finger (Posted on 12/28/12 at 3:18 pm to Rex)
quote:
I like Hobby Lobby... I go there often. I won't hold this against them
Closest place to buy doghead material in your Prius? 
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Joshjrn
LSU Fan
Baton Rouge
Member since Dec 2008
4179 posts
| re: Hobby Lobby gives Obamacare the finger (Posted on 12/28/12 at 3:20 pm to Rex)
quote:
Their objection to not having to pay for such coverage is akin to a pacifist refusing to pay taxes because he views killing by soldiers immoral.
Actually not a terrible analogy. Likely the first and last time I'll ever say that to you, Rex 
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TenTex
LSU Fan
Member since Jan 2008
13971 posts
| re: Hobby Lobby gives Obamacare the finger (Posted on 12/28/12 at 3:26 pm to Lsut81)
Shouldn't their employees have the right to choose? Sounds like Hobby Lobby is restricting the freedom of choice for their employees.
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Jbird
Iowa Fan
Odramaville with EthanL
Member since Oct 2012
4951 posts
| re: Hobby Lobby gives Obamacare the finger (Posted on 12/28/12 at 3:27 pm to TenTex)
[quote]Sounds like Hobby Lobby is restricting the freedom of choice for their employees.[/quote
MEH if you need it that bad move on down the road, or frick up enough to get fired then Odrama will hook you up on the drugs your whore arse needs.
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C
LSU Fan
The Woodlands, TX
Member since Dec 2007
17403 posts
 Online
| re: Hobby Lobby gives Obamacare the finger (Posted on 12/28/12 at 3:29 pm to TenTex)
Name a company that doesn't have negotiated coverage plans.
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tiger1014
LSU Fan
Member since Jan 2011
9031 posts
Online
| re: Hobby Lobby gives Obamacare the finger (Posted on 12/28/12 at 3:44 pm to Lsut81)
I just don't understand their logic. They're a business. They're not a religious institution.
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Diamondawg 
Mississippi St. Fan
Mississippi
Member since Oct 2006
8268 posts
| re: Hobby Lobby gives Obamacare the finger (Posted on 12/28/12 at 3:47 pm to C)
quote:
Name a company that doesn't have negotiated coverage plans.
All of them once Obamacare kicks in. That's what this is about.
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Godfather1
LSU Fan
Home Sweet Home SE Louisiana
Member since Oct 2006
26238 posts
| re: Hobby Lobby gives Obamacare the finger (Posted on 12/28/12 at 3:53 pm to TenTex)
quote:
Shouldn't their employees have the right to choose? Sounds like Hobby Lobby is restricting the freedom of choice for their employees.
No, they're not.
You don't seem to understand how it works. If they don't like the policy, nobody is forcing them to work there. By the same token, Hobby Lobby doesn't owe them a job. That's why it's called at-will employment.
This post was edited on 12/28 at 3:55 pm
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Taxing Authority
LSU Fan
Houston
Member since Feb 2010
16738 posts
| re: Hobby Lobby gives Obamacare the finger (Posted on 12/28/12 at 3:54 pm to buddhavista)
quote:
I would be curious if people would support an atheist who was against breeding not covering pregnancy services.
I support HL's position. And the hypothetical atheist's position.
The idea that government should have the power to force one to purchase an unwanted product is the problem here.
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Chimlim
LSU Fan
Baton Rouge, LA
Member since Jul 2005
10349 posts
Online
| re: Hobby Lobby gives Obamacare the finger (Posted on 12/28/12 at 3:56 pm to TenTex)
quote:
Shouldn't their employees have the right to choose? Sounds like Hobby Lobby is restricting the freedom of choice for their employees.
Umm no.
The employees have the freedom to buy their own health coverage. They are not contractually obligated to sign onto Hobby Lobby's insurance.
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Taxing Authority
LSU Fan
Houston
Member since Feb 2010
16738 posts
| re: Hobby Lobby gives Obamacare the finger (Posted on 12/28/12 at 3:57 pm to Rex)
quote:
Their objection to not having to pay for such coverage is akin to a pacifist refusing to pay taxes because he views killing by soldiers immoral.
Pacifism isn't covered by the first amendment.
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Taxing Authority
LSU Fan
Houston
Member since Feb 2010
16738 posts
| re: Hobby Lobby gives Obamacare the finger (Posted on 12/28/12 at 4:00 pm to TenTex)
quote:
Shouldn't their employees have the right to choose?
Shouldn't the employer have the right to choose? What makes one more important than the other?
quote:
Sounds like Hobby Lobby is restricting the freedom of choice for their employees.
Guess what? That's the result of letting "someone else" pay for your care. They get to make the choices. If employees don't like the rules laid down by the providor, they should strive for independence.
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Joshjrn
LSU Fan
Baton Rouge
Member since Dec 2008
4179 posts
| re: Hobby Lobby gives Obamacare the finger (Posted on 12/28/12 at 4:14 pm to Taxing Authority)
quote:
Pacifism isn't covered by the first amendment.
You say that as though some major religions don't have pacifism, Just War, etc. as major tenets of belief.
This post was edited on 12/28 at 4:31 pm
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Taxing Authority
LSU Fan
Houston
Member since Feb 2010
16738 posts
| re: Hobby Lobby gives Obamacare the finger (Posted on 12/28/12 at 4:41 pm to Joshjrn)
quote:
You say that as though some major religions don't have pacifism
Aye. A fair point.
But it should be noted we do not make pacifists fight in the army. IOW we don't force them to participate in the activity.
Someone paying taxes does not participate in any given activity. Tax dollars (with the exception of MEDI/SSI) aren't dedicated. Income taxes are fungible. Meaning... the pacifist cannot detect where their particular dollars are being spent by the government. That is not true for an individual making a purchase of a specific product or service on behalf of another individual.
Further, tax revenues are removed from the individual. After paying the IRS, the pacifist is no longer in control of that money. And the individual hold NO decisionary power over how that money is spent. The individual taxpayer is not directing the money to war material. The government is doing that. As such the pacifist bears no responsibility for how his tax dollars are spent.
This is not the case with a private purchase of a product. HL has control over how it's own money spent, and have the duty to act within the directive of it's religion, values, or whims. Because they write the checks directly --they the active participant and are accountable for the results. It's HL's money --NOT THE GOVERNMENT's, NOR EMPLOYEE's.
That is the mistake HL's opponents are making. They are claiming right to decide where HL's money is spent. It is a claim of another's property without title.
Bottom line... individuals should have the most possible control over their own spending as possible. We can argue that taxes go against that. But even if so... one wrong does not justify another.
This post was edited on 12/28 at 4:50 pm
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Joshjrn
LSU Fan
Baton Rouge
Member since Dec 2008
4179 posts
| re: Hobby Lobby gives Obamacare the finger (Posted on 12/28/12 at 4:50 pm to Taxing Authority)
quote:
Bottom line... individuals should have the most possible control over their own spending as possible. We can argue that taxes go against that. But even if so... one wrong does not justify another.
Don't confuse my acknowledgement of Rex's analogy with agreeing with his position. I was intrigued by the possibility of conservatives supporting HL's stand, yet would shout down anyone who made a similar argument as pertaining to "defense" (read: war) spending on the same grounds.
I'm a hardcore libertarian. You'll never see me arguing for more governmental power
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G Love
LSU Fan
Denver, CO.
Member since Jan 2011
417 posts
| re: Hobby Lobby gives Obamacare the finger (Posted on 12/28/12 at 5:00 pm to Joshjrn)
Good. We can use the 1.3million a day. Help pay for the corporate welfare and all.
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