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AlaTiger 
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| re: So it turns out being gay is not in the DNA (Posted on 12/13/12 at 2:42 pm to cwill)
quote:
WTF are you talking about? Did you read the article and all of the posts? It's heritable and related to epigentics...do you know what any of that is? Is it ironically described in the Bible? Idiot.
I read the article before it was even posted here. Then, I read the comments as well. A lot of bickering going back and forth between those saying that it is basically genetic and those saying it is not. The one certain thing is that Science cannot find an absolute genetic link to homosexuality.
It bothers me not at all that you think I'm an idiot because I think that religion actually explains things about the human condition. Your perspective is only as large as your bias anyway, so why would it bother me?
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AlaTiger
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| re: So it turns out being gay is not in the DNA (Posted on 12/13/12 at 2:44 pm to Tom288)
quote:
Based on your comprehension skills I bet you read that article and it convinced you that being gay is a choice.
That actually is not what I think at all. I actually think that those who are gay are ingrained in the practice and disposition and cannot possibly free themselves from it no matter how hard they try. In a sense, they are slaves to it and it has mastered them.
That's what the Bible says, anyway. So, why would I just think it is a choice?
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SleauxPlay
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| re: So it turns out being gay is not in the DNA (Posted on 12/13/12 at 2:44 pm to AlaTiger)
quote:
I read the article before it was even posted here. Then, I read the comments as well. A lot of bickering going back and forth between those saying that it is basically genetic and those saying it is not. The one certain thing is that Science cannot find an absolute genetic link to homosexuality.
You mean, kind of like this thread, where scientists argue with people who don't understand what epigenetics is?
quote:
It bothers me not at all that you think I'm an idiot because I think that religion actually explains things about the human condition. Your perspective is only as large as your bias anyway, so why would it bother me?
You're free to believe whatever you'd like. That doesn't negate the fact that you have no idea what you're talking about with regard to this specific issue.
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OleWar
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| re: So it turns out being gay is not in the DNA (Posted on 12/13/12 at 2:46 pm to AlaTiger)
This is why infant baptism is important, so that it can get rid of that original sin which may manifest itself in the epigenetic result of homosexuality.
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AlaTiger
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| re: So it turns out being gay is not in the DNA (Posted on 12/13/12 at 2:52 pm to SleauxPlay)
quote:
You're free to believe whatever you'd like. That doesn't negate the fact that you have no idea what you're talking about with regard to this specific issue.
Specifically, I am talking about Science NOT being able to find a genetic link to Homosexuality even though they have spent the last two decades feverishly searching for it. As a Theist, I think it is altogether possible that indwelling Sin that goes far beyond our conscious choices is at work here.
Since we live in a country that promotes Freedom of Religion in our founding documents - in the FIRST Amendment, actually, it seems that the possibility that Religion has something to say to the human condition is something that should be considered. It has been long accepted that Religion speaks to issues of morality - why could it not also speak to issues of immorality? Why would the causes of immorality be discarded?
I think that Sin is far more than a choice - it is actually an impulse that might be corraled, but it cannot be escaped completely no matter how hard someone tries.
That is why Jesus came actually. We are celebrating that in a little under 2 weeks, if you haven't noticed.
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cwill 
New Orleans Saints Fan
Member since Jan 2005
18885 posts
| re: So it turns out being gay is not in the DNA (Posted on 12/13/12 at 2:55 pm to AlaTiger)
quote:
I read the article before it was even posted here. Then, I read the comments as well. A lot of bickering going back and forth between those saying that it is basically genetic and those saying it is not. The one certain thing is that Science cannot find an absolute genetic link to homosexuality.
Clearly you lack the ability to understand what you read and have applied your own fallacious, biblically inspired reading....as you are a true religious fantasist, I don't doubt that any facts presented to you will never change your mind.
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mmcgrath
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2165 posts
| re: So it turns out being gay is not in the DNA (Posted on 12/13/12 at 2:56 pm to OleWar)
quote:
This is why infant baptism is important, so that it can get rid of that original sin which may manifest itself in the epigenetic result of homosexuality.
Good one! 
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AlaTiger
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| re: So it turns out being gay is not in the DNA (Posted on 12/13/12 at 3:02 pm to cwill)
quote:
Clearly you lack the ability to understand what you read and have applied your own fallacious, biblically inspired reading....as you are a true religious fantasist, I don't doubt that any facts presented to you will never change your mind.
Turn that around and it applies to you as well. But, you aren't even a Scientific "fantasist" because the facts of Science - or the lack thereof - do not seem to influence your thinking at all. You have already made up your mind whether you have hard evidence for it or not.
I am simply positing that Religion might have something to say about the human condition, about sexuality, about morality, and immorality. That is not really a radical view at all, but in your anti-religion bias, it seems very radical to you.
I am waiting for you to present FACTS that state that homosexuality is genetically passed down and is irrevocable. Please show me where you have conclusively proven that.
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GeauxTigerTM
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Member since Sep 2006
9393 posts
| re: So it turns out being gay is not in the DNA (Posted on 12/13/12 at 3:05 pm to AlaTiger)
quote:
I am simply positing that Religion might have something to say about the human condition, about sexuality, about morality, and immorality.
It can SAY whatever it wants. Unless it can be tested in some way, I'm not sure it matters. Or than your speculation...how do you test for original sin being a potential cause for homosexuality? Is this only Christianity that has something to say on the human condition, or are all faiths equally valid when talking about such issues?
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AlaTiger
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| re: So it turns out being gay is not in the DNA (Posted on 12/13/12 at 3:06 pm to OleWar)
quote:
OleWar So it turns out being gay is not in the DNA This is why infant baptism is important, so that it can get rid of that original sin which may manifest itself in the epigenetic result of homosexuality.
That is what Catholicism teaches, at least in regard to Sin, which it states that homosexuality is, but it is not what the Bible teaches. Only in Christ is the curse of original sin taken away.
Here is my point: There are A LOT of people who believe that Religion speaks to this issue. SCIENCE has no evidence to state that Homosexuality is genetic. That does not mean, however, that it is just a choice. If the truth is somewhere in between, which this article seems to state, at least in saying that SOMETHING is happening that falls short of a genetic cause but is stronger than just a person's choice and is possibly irrefutable, then that would actually FIT what the Bible says about it.
Even when the Bible possibly agrees with Science, the Scientist Bigots still blast it as stupid and idiotic. 
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AlaTiger
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| re: So it turns out being gay is not in the DNA (Posted on 12/13/12 at 3:11 pm to GeauxTigerTM)
quote:
It can SAY whatever it wants. Unless it can be tested in some way, I'm not sure it matters. Or than your speculation...how do you test for original sin being a potential cause for homosexuality? Is this only Christianity that has something to say on the human condition, or are all faiths equally valid when talking about such issues?
Of course, every religion has something to say about the human condition - even Science - obviously. Religion always has an anthropological component to it.
As far as testing goes, it appears that a great deal of testing is taking place. For a couple of decades now, geneticists have been mapping the Human Genome and have been trying to figure this out. They cannot find a conclusive genetic cause for homosexuality no matter where they look. But, they are finding that there might be a cause that falls short of a conclusive genetic cause but that is stronger than someone just deciding to be gay. So, the epi- theory is being floated. Like all theories, it will be tested and retested. It might be true and it might not. But, it might also fit pretty well with how the Bible explains it and it seems that that possibility would drive a lot of people crazy as they continue to froth at the mouth at how stupid Christianity is in every respect.
This post was edited on 12/13 at 3:12 pm
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SleauxPlay
LSU Fan
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| re: So it turns out being gay is not in the DNA (Posted on 12/13/12 at 3:25 pm to AlaTiger)
quote:
Specifically, I am talking about Science NOT being able to find a genetic link to Homosexuality
Remember 3 minutes ago when we discussed how you didn't know what you were talking about?
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cwill
New Orleans Saints Fan
Member since Jan 2005
18885 posts
| re: So it turns out being gay is not in the DNA (Posted on 12/13/12 at 3:32 pm to AlaTiger)
quote:
Turn that around and it applies to you as well. But, you aren't even a Scientific "fantasist" because the facts of Science - or the lack thereof - do not seem to influence your thinking at all. You have already made up your mind whether you have hard evidence for it or not.
Such a silly argument...science is the process of looking for truth...in science statements aren't self-proving...I don't expect science to "know" everything, I expect it to look for, make mistakes, correct itself over time through experimentation and observation. Science does not equate to religion no matter how much people like you try.
quote:
I am simply positing that Religion might have something to say about the human condition, about sexuality, about morality, and immorality. That is not really a radical view at all, but in your anti-religion bias, it seems very radical to you.
Philosophically the bible has a lot to say.....however, the article which is the subject of this thread is not a philosophical piece nor does it lend credence to some pseudo-science/religious posit that it's original sin.
quote:
I am waiting for you to present FACTS that state that homosexuality is genetically passed down and is irrevocable. Please show me where you have conclusively proven that.
Typical in the absence of facts it must be a god.
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AlaTiger
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| re: So it turns out being gay is not in the DNA (Posted on 12/13/12 at 3:32 pm to SleauxPlay)
quote:
Remember 3 minutes ago when we discussed how you didn't know what you were talking about?
No, I've forgotten because I am stupid.
Science has provided us conclusive proof that Homosexuality is genetic and inviolable?
Please enlighten me. It seems that would dramatically alter the debate quite a bit. I wonder why this news has not been shouted from the rooftops? Probably because people don't care much about the issue, I guess.
But, do go on . . .
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cwill
New Orleans Saints Fan
Member since Jan 2005
18885 posts
| re: So it turns out being gay is not in the DNA (Posted on 12/13/12 at 3:33 pm to AlaTiger)
quote:
If the truth is somewhere in between, which this article seems to state,
Yeah, that's not what the article states.
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GeauxTigerTM
LSU Fan
Member since Sep 2006
9393 posts
| re: So it turns out being gay is not in the DNA (Posted on 12/13/12 at 3:35 pm to AlaTiger)
quote:
Of course, every religion has something to say about the human condition - even Science - obviously.
I'm gonna' stop here to ask...did you just suggest with this line that science is a religion?
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Scruffy 
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| re: So it turns out being gay is not in the DNA (Posted on 12/13/12 at 3:37 pm to GeauxTigerTM)
quote:
did you just suggest with this line that science is a religion?
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AlaTiger
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| re: So it turns out being gay is not in the DNA (Posted on 12/13/12 at 3:39 pm to cwill)
quote:
Such a silly argument...science is the process of looking for truth...in science statements aren't self-proving...I don't expect science to "know" everything, I expect it to look for, make mistakes, correct itself over time through experimentation and observation. Science does not equate to religion no matter how much people like you try.
That is a good explanation of Science. Yet, when Science cannot prove that Homosexuality is genetic, you discount every other possibility as the blathering of idiots. As for Science not equating to religion, I think that your deficiency is that you are ignorant as to how religion works.
As for the article and philosophy, I am not saying that article is promoting a Biblical view on purpose. I am saying that IF the Science ends up showing that Homosexuality is not genetic, but that it IS something more than a simple choice that someone can make, that that view would actually FIT with what the Bible proposes. It would fit with the Biblical concept of the power of Original Sin found in Romans 6-8. Not genetic like hair color, but more than a simple choice that someone can make - something that people are born into and have no real control over on their own.
Science can only tell us what IS through observation. It can't really get into metaphysical causes and meanings. The Science here should not be in opposition to Religion. Why are you pitting the two against each other in this case unless you are just working from an unproven bias?
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AlaTiger
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| re: So it turns out being gay is not in the DNA (Posted on 12/13/12 at 3:41 pm to GeauxTigerTM)
quote:
I'm gonna' stop here to ask...did you just suggest with this line that science is a religion?
Of course. For some people, it functions the same way that religion does. It attempts to answer all the big questions that religion attempts to answer.
Perhaps your deficit is in not understanding religion very well.
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HailHailtoMichigan! 
Michigan Fan
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Member since Mar 2012
5176 posts
| re: So it turns out being gay is not in the DNA (Posted on 12/13/12 at 3:43 pm to AlaTiger)
quote:
did you just suggest with this line that science is a religion?
quote:
Of course.
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