The White House Proposal: Increase spending, not cut it. - Page 3 - TigerDroppings.com

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moneyg
LSU Fan
Member since Jun 2006
17915 posts

re: The White House Proposal: Increase spending, not cut it.


quote:

He is negotiating, no?

There are 2 main players here, Obama and Boehner. They will get this deal done. I feel pretty confident in that.



What is the ratio of cuts to taxes in this proposal Dean? That isn't a rhetorical question. Are you willing to answer?






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buddhavista
Member since Jul 2012
3543 posts

re: The White House Proposal: Increase spending, not cut it.


quote:

They will get this deal done. I feel pretty confident in that.

I'm not

But i do agree this is just negotiating. I am not sure this was a good faith offer though.






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wickowick
LSU Fan
Head of Island
Member since Dec 2006
20056 posts
 Online 

re: The White House Proposal: Increase spending, not cut it.


quote:

Perhaps negotiate in good faith, maybe fricking act like a leader, drag both Ds and Rs into the White House and hammer out some basic guidelines for the fututre. No what we get is a lead from behind dip shite hauling arse to Hawaii and saying frick off bitched I won.


The fact is, he doesn't want cuts. I don't know if it is because he will lose support from his voters or because he wants to run the country into financial collapse, but his actions show that he has no intent of making any meaningful cuts...






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Jbird
Iowa Fan
In Odramaville with EthanL
Member since Oct 2012
13854 posts

re: The White House Proposal: Increase spending, not cut it.


quote:

but his actions show that he has no intent of making any meaningful cuts


Too bad because he could go down as a very successful President if he tackled spending and debt, unfortunately he is a classic tax and spend liberal I am afraid.






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wickowick
LSU Fan
Head of Island
Member since Dec 2006
20056 posts
 Online 

re: The White House Proposal: Increase spending, not cut it.


quote:

Too bad because he could go down as a very successful President if he tackled spending and debt, unfortunately he is a classic tax and spend liberal I am afraid.


Anyone can look good with no budget...






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DEANintheYAY
Cal State Fullerton Fan
LEFT COAST
Member since Jan 2008
30299 posts

re: The White House Proposal: Increase spending, not cut it.


quote:

What is the ratio of cuts to taxes in this proposal Dean? That isn't a rhetorical question. Are you willing to answer?



The answer is the current ratio is not close to what was discussed prior, but I don't believe what was put forth today is what will be settled on. This will result in the Republicans giving in on BTC for upper income residents and some tax reform and Democrats giving in on cuts to entitlement programs. There will also be a debt ceiling component to the deal to avoid another stand off.






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moneyg
LSU Fan
Member since Jun 2006
17915 posts

re: The White House Proposal: Increase spending, not cut it.


quote:

But i do agree this is just negotiating. I am not sure this was a good faith offer though.



Not sure?

This at best is a non-offer...and at worst the actual plan from the president.

What you are seeing is that Obama CLEARLY wants more tax increases than what he campaigned on.






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DEANintheYAY
Cal State Fullerton Fan
LEFT COAST
Member since Jan 2008
30299 posts

re: The White House Proposal: Increase spending, not cut it.


OR...

From the hated one...wonk blog.

We’re seeing two things here. One is that the negotiations aren’t going well. When one side begins leaking the other side’s proposals, that’s typically a bad sign. The other is that Republicans are frustrated at the new Obama they’re facing: The Obama who refuses to negotiate with himself.

That’s what you’re really seeing in this “proposal.” Previously, Obama’s pattern had been to offer plans that roughly tracked where he thought the compromise should end up. The White House’s belief was that by being solicitous in their policy proposals, they would win goodwill on the other side, and even if they didn’t, the media would side with them, realizing they’d sought compromise and been rebuffed. They don’t believe that anymore.

Perhaps the key lesson the White House took from the last couple of years is this: Don’t negotiate with yourself. If Republicans want to cut Medicare, let them propose the cuts. If they want to raise revenue through tax reform, let them identify the deductions. If they want deeper cuts in discretionary spending, let them settle on a number. And, above all, if they don’t like the White House’s preferred policies, let them propose their own. That way, if the White House eventually does give in and agree to some of their demands, Republicans will feel like they got one over on the president. A compromise isn’t measured by what you offer, it’s measured by what the other side feels they made you concede.

The GOP is right: This isn’t a serious proposal. But it’s not evidence that Obama isn’t serious. He’s very serious about not negotiating with himself, and his opening bid proves it. Now that they’ve leaked his initial offer, the next question is obvious: What’s their offer?



This post was edited on 11/29 at 5:54 pm


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buddhavista
Member since Jul 2012
3543 posts

re: The White House Proposal: Increase spending, not cut it.


quote:

Not sure?


well the details on the offer were pretty sparse.
quote:

This at best is a non-offer...and at worst the actual plan from the president.

out of curiosity, do you consider ryan's budget, which the house passed, a non-offer?
quote:

What you are seeing is that Obama CLEARLY wants more tax increases than what he campaigned on.

Well, I don't believe that to be true. Here is a graphic from obama's website that says 1.9T in new taxes.


But it wouldn't surprise me if true. It is negotiating, you start out ridiculous and move to the middle.

I think the bigger issue is not the 1.6T in tax increases, but instead the lack of spending cuts.






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MFn GIMP
LSU Fan
Owensboro, Kentucky
Member since Feb 2011
8301 posts

re: The White House Proposal: Increase spending, not cut it.


quote:

and some $400 billion in savings over 10 years from Medicare and other entitlement programs. , to be worked out next year, with no guarantees.


FIFY yep, let's hop on that train. Promised entitlement cuts (not reform which is desperately needed) for tax increases now. That has never failed us before.






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LSUgusto
Member since May 2005
16203 posts

re: The White House Proposal: Increase spending, not cut it.


quote:

I am not sure this was a good faith offer though
You don't think a proposal that increases spending and eliminates the debt ceiling is a good faith offer of fiscal responsibility??? How dare you!!!






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accnodefense
Kennesaw St. Fan
Member since Dec 2010
2104 posts

re: The White House Proposal: Increase spending, not cut it.


$40 billion a year is a fricking drop in the bucket

Plus there is no guarantee that the $40 billion would ever materialize






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Ace Midnight
LSU Fan
Ball, LA - Home, Sweet Home
Member since Dec 2006
26254 posts

re: The White House Proposal: Increase spending, not cut it.


quote:

FIFY yep, let's hop on that train. Promised entitlement cuts (not reform which is desperately needed) for tax increases now. That has never failed us before.




Except every time.

I love the WH offer to make cuts that are already a fait accompli, and declare Medicare "cuts", that won't really happen - because they will just be incorporated into Obamacare expenses.

But they definitely want those BTCs over. No Medicare reform - no SS reform - no tax code reform (heck Congress is so incompetent they've had to patch AMT every few years instead of just f*cking indexing the thing to inflation and make the issue go away), nothing but cuts to defense and higher marginal tax rates. Even though I knew this would happen, I'm somewhat taken aback (although it is not very surprising) at the audacity of they way they're going about it.









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mtntiger
LSU Fan
Asheville, NC
Member since Oct 2003
8720 posts

re: The White House Proposal: Increase spending, not cut it.


Good Lord, that graphic is so much crap! Obama's smallest deficit since taking office was like 1.1 trillion dollars, and somehow he thinks he's only responsible for 1.46 trillion?

The guy's a damn mathematical savant.






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KeyserSoze999
LSU Fan
Member since Dec 2009
3285 posts

re: The White House Proposal: Increase spending, not cut it.


quote:

at the audacity of they way they're going about it



you aint seen nothing, wait till we get closer, boehner will start showing up all glassy eyed with KY jell in hand, carrying a gimp suit.






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kywildcatfanone
Kentucky Fan
Wildcat Country!
Member since Oct 2012
14279 posts

re: The White House Proposal: Increase spending, not cut it.


Who didn't see this coming...





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LSURussian
LSU Fan
Baton Rouge
Member since Feb 2005
76243 posts

re: The White House Proposal: Increase spending, not cut it.


quote:

$400 billion in savings

quote:

So he is offering up cuts

Please don't tell me you're so stupid you think "savings" said by a Democrat equals "cuts." Savings means slower growth in spending increases, not cuts.






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Ace Midnight
LSU Fan
Ball, LA - Home, Sweet Home
Member since Dec 2006
26254 posts

re: The White House Proposal: Increase spending, not cut it.


quote:

Please don't tell me you're so stupid you think "savings" said by a Democrat equals "cuts." Savings means slower growth in spending increases, not cuts.


It goes like this - if the budget for Agency "A" for FY 2014 is $4.55 billion, then if it "only" goes up to $4.68 billion, instead of the originally projected $4.7 billion in 2015 - that's a cut. If it is capped at $4.55 billion it's a "draconian" cut (unless it is in defense spending - that's perfectly fine, "peace dividend", whatever).



This post was edited on 11/30 at 7:18 am


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Newbomb Turk
Navy Fan
perfectanschlagen
Member since May 2008
9961 posts

re: The White House Proposal: Increase spending, not cut it.


quote:

Surely this is from The Onion.



Well, to be fair, the Onion does have MUCH more credibility than anything put out by NBC.






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chadau79
Auburn Fan
Member since Sep 2009
2383 posts

re: The White House Proposal: Increase spending, not cut it.


Wait until the REAL fiscal cliff comes. The real problem is when Welfare, food stamps, and other entitlements grow to reach 60-70% of Americans and the National Debt swells to a number where we can no longer pay the interest on the debt and pay the entitlements. War will come. It will either be mass chaos when the checks stop cold turkey and riots ensue, or when China comes to collect on the defaulted loans.





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