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badlands
Florida Fan
Member since Apr 2008
1176 posts

re: What do the 'poor', owe society?


great quote





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mograyback
Missouri Fan
Member since Jul 2011
7102 posts

re: What do the 'poor', owe society?


quote:

orporations...PRODUCE. If they don't...they go away


Or get bailed out..






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mograyback
Missouri Fan
Member since Jul 2011
7102 posts

re: What do the 'poor', owe society?


quote:

"If a man has done his best, what else is there?" -- G. Patton, Jr.

Only problem with that quote is a potential misunderstanding of what it means to do your best.

Is doing your best only related to how hard you work? What effort you're putting into some linear task?

Or does it equate awareness? I think we have lots of people that are willing to grind it out but aren't willing to educate themselves and think about the things they learn.







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NC_Tigah
LSU Fan
Member since Sep 2003
48228 posts

re: What do the 'poor', owe society?


quote:

I'd still love someone to explain to me how it's okay for a businessman to write off a bottle of wine, yet complain about someone using a food stamp.
You're referring to the businessman who has bought both the wine . . . and the other guy's food stamp?

What's the question?






This post was edited on 11/25 at 9:42 am


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Turbeauxdog
LSU Fan
Member since Aug 2004
5622 posts

re: What do the 'poor', owe society?


quote:

Is the fact that we pay more in corporate welfare than social welfare programs figure into your opinion?


So I read your link, the two examples of the largest expenditures are farm subsidies and green energy grants.

At the same time you seem to be criticizing conservatives for asking for welfare reform. You imply that the OP is a hypocrite for not being as critical toward corporate subsidies.

However, I haven't seen a single conservative on this board that isn't critical of farm subsidies and green energy grants.

Basically, your point is invalid, and it would be great if you ceases trying to make it.

Thanks.






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RuLSU
Rutgers Fan
New Jersey
Member since Nov 2007
920 posts

re: What do the 'poor', owe society?


To the OP : I don't mean to be a grammar Nazi, but the word is farce.

Farse

quote:

We have to puit an end to such foolish myths!

How are the botton 20% of society to find jobs when over 12% of the functional population is unemployed?


How are the 20% with IQ's below 85 suppose to get an education that prepares them for the 21st century?

Stop believing in myths and rededicate the funds used to train, retrain, habilitate, rehabilitate form and reform the lumpen masses to a more efficient and practical use.

Yeah, you pretty much nailed it.

From an economic standpoint, increased spending on training and adult educational programs are actually a worthy expense.






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CITWTT
LSU Fan
baton rouge
Member since Sep 2005
31278 posts
 Online 

re: What do the 'poor', owe society?


I will not talk about you numbers, but is there a return on them to the nations benefit? WTF is the benefit of being declare indigigent and able to suck 64K as a single mother of two daddy babies? A family of four is able to get 92K of benefits. Today over 100 million people are on Uncle Sams tit, and you are worried about what is keeping so many people EMPLOYED you MISERY(Show me) hick.





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reverendotis
LSU Fan
Rick's shitty thread expert
Member since Nov 2007
1268 posts

re: What do the 'poor', owe society?


I looked at some of the links you posted.

This one gives the numbers from 2006!

Those should still be good numbers to use to make a point about 2012, I mean nothing has happened in this country since then, oh wait...

Here are 2012 numbers from a website dedicated to actual numbers and not a blog written by the "author of an eco-thriller, part of a trilogy on global warming"

quote:

Healthcare - $846 billion
Welfare - $452 billion


The article you linked asserted expenditures of $59 billion on social welfare programs. $1.3 trillion is a far cry from $59 billion, but what do I know, I don't "understand finance."

HACK!







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90proofprofessional
LSU Fan
Member since Mar 2004
7941 posts

re: What do the 'poor', owe society?


quote:

Except for the actual link I posted on the first page.. But here is another one just in case. LINK /
And I was ready for the medicaid argument, surprised you didn't tack on SS too. This link should help clear it up for you

good thing you "were ready" for the medicaid (and SS) argument. too bad you do next to nothing to rebut it. none of your links effectively back your assertion about the size of corp welfare relative to the size of social spending. none of those programs approach even the size of just medicaid by themselves. you don't even need to mention other social welfare programs to disprove your claim.

although you haven't tried to make it, the "$9tril in cheap loans" argument might be an effective one, if it weren't so obviously, purposefully misleading.

bottom line: corp welfare is a problem. and it's a problem that is dwarfed by our social spending. also dwarfed by any tax cuts you cry about for corps are the ones given to the middle&lower classes by W.

everyone knows corp welfare is a huge problem, and many here will happily denounce it- you don't need to lie to overstate the size of the problem. just because it's not remotely as big as our social spending doesn't mean conservatives think it's ok.






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mograyback
Missouri Fan
Member since Jul 2011
7102 posts

re: What do the 'poor', owe society?


quote:

You're referring to the businessman who has bought both the wine . . . and the other guy's food stamp?


What? I'm referring to the businessman who get's to write off the bottle of wine, therefore NOT paying for it.

Really? That dense?






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Zach
LSU Fan
Member since May 2005
61024 posts

re: What do the 'poor', owe society?


An aside... I see you're a Missouri fan. Congrats on your football team's outstanding season.





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mograyback
Missouri Fan
Member since Jul 2011
7102 posts

re: What do the 'poor', owe society?


quote:


good thing you "were ready" for the medicaid (and SS) argument. too bad you do next to nothing to rebut it. none of your links effectively back your assertion about the size of corp welfare relative to the size of social spending. none of those programs approach even the size of just medicaid by themselves. you don't even need to mention other social welfare programs to disprove your claim.

although you haven't tried to make it, the "$9tril in cheap loans" argument might be an effective one, if it weren't so obviously, purposefully misleading.

bottom line: corp welfare is a problem. and it's a problem that is dwarfed by our social spending. also dwarfed by any tax cuts you cry about for corps are the ones given to the middle&lower classes by W.

everyone knows corp welfare is a huge problem, and many here will happily denounce it- you don't need to lie to overstate the size of the problem. just because it's not remotely as big as our social spending doesn't mean conservatives think it's ok.


Is it that hard to capitalize the first letter of a sentence? And is it that hard to write out words completely? I feel like I'm reading a teenagers text message.

quote:

everyone knows corp welfare is a huge problem


In a couple days of bringing up this topic, multiple people didn't even know what a subsidy was, they thought it was a tax deduction. So I'm not buying this awareness you speak of.

Honestly sir, you're writing pattern (which I can tell is your speech pattern) is that of a very average intellect and modest education. I don't mean to be rude because you are right in a way, but you're also wrong.

PS. There was more than just the cheap loans portion. So on top of the 100 billion given annually to the corporate interests you have tax preferences, often called “tax expenditures,” are the functional equivalent of direct outlays. Failing to tax is not the same as spending, since all income does not belong to the government. However, when the government provides a narrow exemption from general tax obligations it essentially is writing a check. While appropriations have some level of transparency, tax preferences often are obscurely drafted and dropped into larger bills, hidden from public view. Taxpayers then are unaware that they are being looted.

You also have regulations which act as another common form of corporate welfare. Federal rules limit competition, provide competitive advantage, and reduce consumer power.

Then there is trade protection. Tariffs and quotas act as direct subsidies for domestic industries at consumer expense. These rules spread distortions widely throughout the economy, costing billions of dollars. For instance, raising the price of steel harms the auto industry, both raising prices and reducing competitiveness.

There is a lot more than just the 100 billion, yes social welfare insanely high, but this attitude (as you've displayed here) that corporate welfare it's merely a freckle on the face of the problem is just downright ridiculous. This isn't necessarily about attacking corporate welfare and choosing sides, I agree social welfare is out of control. I'm just making an observation that 99% (probably more like 100%) of people that bitch about lazy people relying on the government do not even consider what is going happening on the corporate side.






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TrueTiger
LSU Fan
Chicken's most valuable
Member since Sep 2004
8870 posts

re: What do the 'poor', owe society?


quote:

therefore NOT paying for it.



There was a trade, money for wine. So you can't say he didn't pay for it. Sure he may have deducted later it in order to keep more of the money he earned but the wine was still bought.

I'm not a fan of the federal tax system with its complex rules. It's a stack of phone books in size that changes every year. No one person could possibly know all of it. The tax code is a legal trap that the government can use to snare any one of us. It is there not for revenue purposes, but for power purposes. There are simpler and more efficient ways to increase revenue other than the current bureaucratic heavy tax code run by a non-elected group.






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SoulGlo
LSU Fan
Shinin' Through
Member since Dec 2011
3207 posts

re: What do the 'poor', owe society?


quote:

In your view of the do you ever consider the billions of dollars in subsidies given annually to corporations? (This doesn't even count tax breaks and write offs)

Is the fact that we pay more in corporate welfare than social welfare programs figure into your opinion?
LINK

Do you ever ponder the difference between a businessman writing off his fancy dinner as a 'corporate expense' while complaining about those lazy poor people using food stamps?








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mograyback
Missouri Fan
Member since Jul 2011
7102 posts

re: What do the 'poor', owe society?


quote:

An aside... I see you're a Missouri fan. Congrats on your football team's outstanding season.



How is it being Gumps little brother for life?

Glad you could contribute something of substance and didn't have to stoop down to making a football joke to degrade me... oh wait.






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Zach
LSU Fan
Member since May 2005
61024 posts

re: What do the 'poor', owe society?


quote:

How is it being Gumps little brother for life?

A lot better than being TAMU's Bitch.






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mograyback
Missouri Fan
Member since Jul 2011
7102 posts

re: What do the 'poor', owe society?


quote:


There was a trade, money for wine. So you can't say he didn't pay for it. Sure he may have deducted later it in order to keep more of the money he earned but the wine was still bought.



Is this real life?

Are you being serious right now?

quote:

Sure he may have deducted later it in order to keep more of the money he earned but the wine was still bought.


(Smacking hand on forehead).

Bought by who? Not by him, because he wrote it off. "Sure he may have deducted it later" (notice how I corrected your backwoods english, yet I'm supposed to take you serious). How could you even contradict yourself like that?

Food stamps get paid for too, by tax dollars, with your logic I can say "but it was still bought".







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mograyback
Missouri Fan
Member since Jul 2011
7102 posts

re: What do the 'poor', owe society?


quote:


A lot better than being TAMU's Bitch.


Yes, beating them 2 of the last 3 years at their stadium, and 5 of the last 7 times while knocking out two of their coaches in the last decade makes us their bitch. They have the best player in college sports right now and we're reeling with injuries, but yeah.. I guess we're their bitch.

Go warm up some nachos and stay in the football section, thanks bud.






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lsu480
Arizona State Fan
Downtown Scottsdale
Member since Oct 2007
61759 posts

re: What do the 'poor', owe society?


quote:

Do you ever ponder the difference between a businessman writing off his fancy dinner as a 'corporate expense' while complaining about those lazy poor people using food stamps?



There is no difference....the business man is paying for both meals.






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Zach
LSU Fan
Member since May 2005
61024 posts

re: What do the 'poor', owe society?


quote:

Yes, beating them 2 of the last 3 years at their stadium, and 5 of the last 7 times while knocking out two of their coaches in the last decade makes us their bitch. They have the best player in college sports right now and we're reeling with injuries, but yeah.. I guess we're their bitch.


Actually, I think Mizzou will bring a lot to the SEC in terms of basketball. But you will never compete in FB. So get used to it.






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