| Posted by | Message |
TxTiger82 
LSU Fan
Madison, WI
Member since Sep 2004
21551 posts
| re: Liberal Revisionist History myths (Posted on 11/20/12 at 1:52 pm to davesdawgs)
quote:
The War of Northern Aggression was about economics.
The economics of slavery.
|
| Back to top | |
TxTiger82
LSU Fan
Madison, WI
Member since Sep 2004
21551 posts
| re: Liberal Revisionist History myths (Posted on 11/20/12 at 1:53 pm to accnodefense)
The ironic part about the OP is most of his "facts" are in fact revisionism. 
|
| Back to top | |
CarrolltonTiger
LSU Fan
New Orleans
Member since Aug 2005
44016 posts
| re: Liberal Revisionist History myths (Posted on 11/20/12 at 1:54 pm to RollTide1987)
quote:
Inefficient?
Yes, inefficient, that is why it was dying out when it competed with free labor. The only reason slavery existed was a labor shortage.
Something can be large and still inefficient.
In the border states like Maryland and kentucky the greatest profit from slavery was selling those slaves to the Deep south. It was a continual process of shrinking in the face of free labor. The real question was how to unload the investment.
|
| Back to top | |
Patrick O Rly 
New Orleans Saints Fan
y u do dis?
Member since Aug 2011
25644 posts
| re: Liberal Revisionist History myths (Posted on 11/20/12 at 1:57 pm to RollTide1987)
quote:
No excuse at all.
No excuse, just the reality of the time.
|
| Back to top | |
lordguill 
LA-Lafayette Fan
Member since Dec 2005
16670 posts
| re: Liberal Revisionist History myths (Posted on 11/20/12 at 2:00 pm to CarrolltonTiger)
quote:
The great patriots in New England had threatened secession in 1812, when the war with the British was against their regional financial interest.
It's amazing how little the Hartford Convention gets mentioned. New England was dangerously close to seceding.
|
| Back to top | |
RollTide1987 
Alabama Fan
Senoia, Georgia
Member since Nov 2009
17691 posts
| re: Liberal Revisionist History myths (Posted on 11/20/12 at 2:16 pm to CarrolltonTiger)
quote:
Yes, inefficient, that is why it was dying out when it competed with free labor. The only reason slavery existed was a labor shortage.
It wasn't dying out at all. In fact, by 1860, the institution was booming.
In 1849, slaves were pumping out 106 million lbs. of tobacco a year. By 1859, that figure had gone up to 347 million lbs.
They were producing $60 million worth of sugar in 1849. That number was $180 million in 1859.
They were pumping out 2.5 million bales of cotton a year in 1849, by 1859 that number had increased to 4.5 million bales.
The average price of a slave was also at an all-time high by 1859-60. While your average slave went for around $600 at market in 1845, the price had increased to around $1,400 in 1860. If slavery were a dying institution as you say, that price would have gone down instead of up.
In 1850 the South was bringing in just under $100 million a year in cotton exports. Ten years later...that number was north of $200 million.
So yeah....hardly a dying institution.
|
| Back to top | |
RollTide1987
Alabama Fan
Senoia, Georgia
Member since Nov 2009
17691 posts
| re: Liberal Revisionist History myths (Posted on 11/20/12 at 2:21 pm to lordguill)
quote:
It's amazing how little the Hartford Convention gets mentioned. New England was dangerously close to seceding.
And it was so unpopular with the rest of the United States that it completely killed the Federalist Party.
|
| Back to top | |
Roaad
LSU Fan
Bushrod Owns
Member since Aug 2006
50444 posts
 Online
| re: Liberal Revisionist History myths (Posted on 11/20/12 at 2:23 pm to accnodefense)
quote:
Revisionist History Myth #2: The civil war was about slavery.
That is a fact, not a myth.
|
| Back to top | |
RollTide1987
Alabama Fan
Senoia, Georgia
Member since Nov 2009
17691 posts
| re: Liberal Revisionist History myths (Posted on 11/20/12 at 2:23 pm to Patrick O Rly)
quote:
No excuse, just the reality of the time.
It's a good thing we had a civil war then, isn't it?
|
| Back to top | |
Roaad
LSU Fan
Bushrod Owns
Member since Aug 2006
50444 posts
Online
| re: Liberal Revisionist History myths (Posted on 11/20/12 at 2:25 pm to CarrolltonTiger)
quote:
The only reason slavery existed was a labor shortage.
A free labor shortage.
The South was full of poor Scottish immigrants that would have done the work. They just would have demanded a wage of some sort.
|
| Back to top | |
CarrolltonTiger
LSU Fan
New Orleans
Member since Aug 2005
44016 posts
| re: Liberal Revisionist History myths (Posted on 11/20/12 at 2:26 pm to RollTide1987)
quote:
It wasn't dying out at all. In fact, by 1860, the institution was booming.
No it wasn't.
quote:
The average price of a slave was also at an all-time high by 1859-60.
Inflation and a ban on importation, that is why so many were being sold south, they couldn't compete with free labor and their value was in the shrinking plantation lands not in the lands developing with free labor.
|
| Back to top | |
kingbob
LSU Fan
St. Amant, LA
Member since Nov 2010
9005 posts
Online
| re: Liberal Revisionist History myths (Posted on 11/20/12 at 2:28 pm to CarrolltonTiger)
At that time, the Irish had all but replaced slaves for canal projects in New Orleans. The slaves were too valuable. As the massive waves of immigrants continued to arrive, slavery would have died off as the labor shortage was brought to an end.
|
| Back to top | |
Roaad
LSU Fan
Bushrod Owns
Member since Aug 2006
50444 posts
Online
| re: Liberal Revisionist History myths (Posted on 11/20/12 at 2:29 pm to CarrolltonTiger)
quote:
No it wasn't.
Fact.
Slavery was on it's last legs.
quote:
Inflation and a ban on importation
yup
Trans-Atlantic slave trade was banned in 1808. Or was it 06?
|
| Back to top | |
Blue Velvet 
Colorado State Fan
Venice, LA
Member since Nov 2009
12739 posts
| re: Liberal Revisionist History myths (Posted on 11/20/12 at 2:29 pm to RollTide1987)
quote:
It's a good thing we had a civil war then, isn't it?
Seek help.
|
| Back to top | |
Roaad
LSU Fan
Bushrod Owns
Member since Aug 2006
50444 posts
Online
| re: Liberal Revisionist History myths (Posted on 11/20/12 at 2:30 pm to kingbob)
quote:
At that time, the Irish had all but replaced slaves for canal projects in New Orleans. The slaves were too valuable. As the massive waves of immigrants continued to arrive, slavery would have died off as the labor shortage was brought to an end.
Correct, and from an emotionally detached perspective, that may have been the better course of action.
However, the moral imperative was too great
|
| Back to top | |
RollTide1987
Alabama Fan
Senoia, Georgia
Member since Nov 2009
17691 posts
| re: Liberal Revisionist History myths (Posted on 11/20/12 at 2:37 pm to CarrolltonTiger)
quote:
No it wasn't.
Yes, it was. There was a cotton boom going on at the time. It had started in 1840 and, by 1860, the South was producing half of the world's cotton.
In 1860, almost one-third of all Southern families owned slaves. In Mississippi and South Carolina it approached one half. The total number of slave owners was 385,000 (including, in Louisiana, some free Negroes). As for the number of slaves owned by each master, 88% held fewer than twenty, and nearly 50% held fewer than five.
For comparison's sake, let it be noted that in the 1950s, only 2% of American families owned corporation stocks equal in value to the 1860 value of a single slave. Thus, slave ownership was much more widespread in the South than corporate investment was in 1950s America.
On a typical plantation (more than 20 slaves) the capital value of the slaves was greater than the capital value of the land and implements.
Slavery was profitable, although a large part of the profit was in the increased value of the slaves themselves. With only 30% of the nation's (free) population, the South had 60% of the "wealthiest men." The 1860 per capita wealth in the South was $3,978; in the North it was $2,040.
This is all information from the 1860 census.
This post was edited on 11/20 at 2:38 pm
|
| Back to top | |
EZE Tiger Fan
Member since Jul 2004
22547 posts
| re: Liberal Revisionist History myths (Posted on 11/20/12 at 2:40 pm to accnodefense)
quote:
Revisionist History Myth #1: FDR was a great president who ended the great depression with the New Deal.
Fact: FDR was a power hungry tyrant who exploded the size and scope of government and prolonged the depression with the new deal.
Woodrow Wilson, a sorry arse Repub, was just as guilty and helped lay the foundation...
quote:
Revisionist History Myth #2: The civil war was about slavery.
Fact: The civil war was about state's rights and the south seceded because they were worried about the ever growing reach of the federal government.
Slavery was one of the issues, so that became the focus as the years passed.
quote:
Revisionist History Myth #3: JFK was a liberal hero who championed liberal values.
Fact: JFK was a fiscal conservative who would not find room in the democrat party today. He advocated for deep tax cuts, something that democrats to this day do not want to hear about and downplay
This is correct.
quote:
Revisionist History Myth #4: Ronald Reagan was all for open borders and amnesty.
Fact: Reagan passed amnesty in exchange for tight border security and a closed border. But democrats with their typical Lucy & The Football ways never followed through on the border security part
Correct. There is plenty to bash RR over (war on drugs) but this isn't one of them.
quote:
Revisionist History Myth #5: Democrats passed the civil rights act.
Fact: Republicans passed the civil rights act.
Incorrect. Dems fought it, then when they realized the population backed the Repub stance, they "evolved" then voted for it. At the time, Repubs didn't have enough votes to get their way.
quote:
Revisionist History Myth #6: The Great Society was meant to help the poor and less fortunate.
Fact: LBJ passed the Great Society to keep minorities, now with full rights under the Civil Rights Act, as a permanent voting bloc of the democrat party.
Actually, this was FDR's original vision...
|
| Back to top | |
RollTide1987
Alabama Fan
Senoia, Georgia
Member since Nov 2009
17691 posts
| re: Liberal Revisionist History myths (Posted on 11/20/12 at 2:43 pm to RollTide1987)
Though I do not doubt slavery would have eventually died. It was a finite institution that had a limited profit margin. Though I personally think it would have lasted into the 20th Century, dying out completely by 1920 or so. World War I would have officially killed it.
This post was edited on 11/20 at 2:48 pm
|
| Back to top | |
RollTide1987
Alabama Fan
Senoia, Georgia
Member since Nov 2009
17691 posts
| re: Liberal Revisionist History myths (Posted on 11/20/12 at 2:46 pm to EZE Tiger Fan)
quote:
Woodrow Wilson, a sorry arse Repub, was just as guilty and helped lay the foundation...
Woodrow Wilson was a Democrat.
quote:
Incorrect. Dems fought it, then when they realized the population backed the Repub stance, they "evolved" then voted for it. At the time, Repubs didn't have enough votes to get their way.
Democrats still needed Republican votes to pass the Civil Rights Act. Had it not been for Republican support of the bill it would have never passed.
|
| Back to top | |
TrueTiger
LSU Fan
Republic of West Florida
Member since Sep 2004
2592 posts
| re: Liberal Revisionist History myths (Posted on 11/20/12 at 2:48 pm to EZE Tiger Fan)
quote:
Woodrow Wilson, a sorry arse Repub, was just as guilty and helped lay the foundation...
Check again. Woody was a Demo.
|
| Back to top | |
