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novabill 
LSU Fan
Crossville, TN
Member since Sep 2005
3940 posts
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| re: Proposed Law Would Force Churches to Host Gay Weddings (Posted on 4/24/12 at 10:28 am to M Le Rip)
quote:
Therefore, if the church wants to discriminate against gays, it will have to act like a church and not a business.
How so? What makes a church not a church but a business?
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M Le Rip
Member since Mar 2012
954 posts
| re: Proposed Law Would Force Churches to Host Gay Weddings (Posted on 4/24/12 at 10:29 am to novabill)
quote:
How so? What makes a church not a church but a business?
I'm not teaching first grade here, brother. You can figure it out. 
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Patrick O Rly 
New Orleans Saints Fan
y u do dis?
Member since Aug 2011
25637 posts
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| re: Proposed Law Would Force Churches to Host Gay Weddings (Posted on 4/24/12 at 10:29 am to NaturalBeam)
I just don't understand why a gay couple would want to get married in a church that holds their marriage as unholy in the first place. Even if you could get married at any church, why would you get married at ANY church?
This post was edited on 4/24 at 10:31 am
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redandright
Member since Jun 2011
1609 posts
| re: Proposed Law Would Force Churches to Host Gay Weddings (Posted on 4/24/12 at 10:37 am to GumboPot)
inb4toddy
I really don't think you want to use that to id the link
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NaturalBeam
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Member since Sep 2007
12313 posts
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| re: Proposed Law Would Force Churches to Host Gay Weddings (Posted on 4/24/12 at 10:39 am to M Le Rip)
quote:
Therefore, if the church wants to discriminate against gays, it will have to act like a church and not a business.
Are you suggesting that by renting out its facilities, a Church is no longer acting within the purview of a Church? 
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Antonio Moss
LSU Fan
Baton Rouge
Member since Mar 2006
25300 posts
| re: Proposed Law Would Force Churches to Host Gay Weddings (Posted on 4/24/12 at 10:40 am to NaturalBeam)
quote:
but to say this is not related to the 1st Amendment is clearly not the case
If the Church is in the business of leasing its facilities out to groups for non-religious events, then it is quite easy to argue that this practice has no affect on one's right of free expression.
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Antonio Moss
LSU Fan
Baton Rouge
Member since Mar 2006
25300 posts
| re: Proposed Law Would Force Churches to Host Gay Weddings (Posted on 4/24/12 at 10:42 am to NaturalBeam)
quote:
Are you suggesting that by renting out its facilities, a Church is no longer acting within the purview of a Church?
If it is leasing its facilities out to a non-Church group for non-Church function, then yes.
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NaturalBeam
LSU Fan
Member since Sep 2007
12313 posts
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| re: Proposed Law Would Force Churches to Host Gay Weddings (Posted on 4/24/12 at 10:42 am to Antonio Moss)
I thought we were talking about weddings
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Antonio Moss
LSU Fan
Baton Rouge
Member since Mar 2006
25300 posts
| re: Proposed Law Would Force Churches to Host Gay Weddings (Posted on 4/24/12 at 10:46 am to NaturalBeam)
quote:
I thought we were talking about weddings
quote:
“against a gay couple who want to rent the building for a party.”
Piss-poor journalism. The only people that mention weddings are the writer and the guy from Westboro.
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M Le Rip
Member since Mar 2012
954 posts
| re: Proposed Law Would Force Churches to Host Gay Weddings (Posted on 4/24/12 at 10:49 am to NaturalBeam)
quote:
Are you suggesting that by renting out its facilities, a Church is no longer acting within the purview of a Church?
I'm suggesting nothing, brother. I'm saying what I'm saying very clearly.
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NaturalBeam
LSU Fan
Member since Sep 2007
12313 posts
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| re: Proposed Law Would Force Churches to Host Gay Weddings (Posted on 4/24/12 at 10:51 am to Antonio Moss)
quote:
Piss-poor journalism. The only people that mention weddings are the writer and the guy from Westboro.
Yeah, after clicking on the link for the first time I see that - seems like gays could rent the facilities for party use - no big deal
Now, if the try to throw a couple of quick "I do's" in there between party songs, that could be a problem 
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TK421
LSU Fan
Baton Rouge
Member since Oct 2011
5133 posts
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| re: Proposed Law Would Force Churches to Host Gay Weddings (Posted on 4/24/12 at 10:51 am to Antonio Moss)
quote:
If the Church is in the business of leasing its facilities out to groups for non-religious events
You're suggesting that the Church is renting out the property in an attempt to make money rather than cover the costs associated with the building being used. Do you know how much it costs to provide air conditioning in an auditorium?
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Antonio Moss
LSU Fan
Baton Rouge
Member since Mar 2006
25300 posts
| re: Proposed Law Would Force Churches to Host Gay Weddings (Posted on 4/24/12 at 10:52 am to NaturalBeam)
quote:
Now, if the try to throw a couple of quick "I do's" in there between party songs, that could be a problem
Like I posted earlier, I believe this could easily be avoided by narrowly defined language in the lease agreement.
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Antonio Moss
LSU Fan
Baton Rouge
Member since Mar 2006
25300 posts
| re: Proposed Law Would Force Churches to Host Gay Weddings (Posted on 4/24/12 at 10:53 am to TK421)
quote:
You're suggesting that the Church is renting out the property in an attempt to make money rather than cover the costs associated with the building being used.
That's one in the same.
quote:
Do you know how much it costs to provide air conditioning in an auditorium?
Yeah, expensive.
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NaturalBeam
LSU Fan
Member since Sep 2007
12313 posts
Online
| re: Proposed Law Would Force Churches to Host Gay Weddings (Posted on 4/24/12 at 10:55 am to TK421)
quote:
You're suggesting that the Church is renting out the property in an attempt to make money rather than cover the costs associated with the building being used. Do you know how much it costs to provide air conditioning in an auditorium?
Yeah, but that doesn't really matter - "in the business of" just means you are either doing it for money or you aren't - it isn't defined by the profit margin.
If Churches rent out facilities (and I would imagine this is only for facilities, not inside the actual church) for a non-religious party (again, it seems like a wedding would be exempt), then they really have no religious basis for saying gays can't participate.
Of course, I'm with the overall theme of the thread that any place, church or not, should be able to "discriminate" against anyone they well damn please, but oh well
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M Le Rip
Member since Mar 2012
954 posts
| re: Proposed Law Would Force Churches to Host Gay Weddings (Posted on 4/24/12 at 10:55 am to Antonio Moss)
quote:
quote:
Do you know how much it costs to provide air conditioning in an auditorium?
Yeah, expensive.
Why doesn't the offering plate cover this?
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TK421
LSU Fan
Baton Rouge
Member since Oct 2011
5133 posts
Online
| re: Proposed Law Would Force Churches to Host Gay Weddings (Posted on 4/24/12 at 10:55 am to Antonio Moss)
quote:
That's one in the same.
No it's not. That is why churches are considered tax exempt. That is why they get leverage over who gets to use their facilities.
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TK421
LSU Fan
Baton Rouge
Member since Oct 2011
5133 posts
Online
| re: Proposed Law Would Force Churches to Host Gay Weddings (Posted on 4/24/12 at 10:57 am to NaturalBeam)
quote:
If Churches rent out facilities (and I would imagine this is only for facilities, not inside the actual church) for a non-religious party (again, it seems like a wedding would be exempt), then they really have no religious basis for saying gays can't participate.
So, should the same church be forced into letting people serve alcohol at these non-religious parties? Where does the government intrusion end?
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L.A.
New Orleans Saints Fan
Los Angeles
Member since Aug 2003
34692 posts
| re: Proposed Law Would Force Churches to Host Gay Weddings (Posted on 4/24/12 at 10:57 am to TK421)
quote:
You're suggesting that the Church is renting out the property in an attempt to make money rather than cover the costs associated with the building being used. Do you know how much it costs to provide air conditioning in an auditorium?
It's not just air conditioning. The church also has to provide staff to be there during the event in case something goes wrong, plus they have to pay a janitor to come in afterward to clean the building.
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M Le Rip
Member since Mar 2012
954 posts
| re: Proposed Law Would Force Churches to Host Gay Weddings (Posted on 4/24/12 at 10:58 am to TK421)
quote:
So, should the same church be forced into letting people serve alcohol at these non-religious parties? Where does the government intrusion end?
It ends where government intrusion ends for everybody else. If a church is going to rent out their facilities like everybody else, then they should play by the same rules as everybody else. They should probably pay taxes like everybody else, too.
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