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Message
re: Kompany says it
Posted on 4/12/15 at 12:22 pm to WarSlamEagle
Posted on 4/12/15 at 12:22 pm to WarSlamEagle
quote:
so what are y'all arguing about again
I said I didn't want to get into an economics policy discussion! Its so easy to go on tangents on a message board.
0
Posted on 4/12/15 at 2:53 pm to crazy4lsu
quote:
Fiorentina and Napoli are separate organizations that are basically new clubs that took the names of the old clubs, as is Rangers. The others I would actually have to investigate on a case by case basis.
So in other words, none of them have gone away.
quote:
Regardless, you are pretending there isn't a problem of clubs not being able to remain solvent, which is the major driver behind FFP, not the spending of PSG and Man City.
It's not a problem. If owners run their teams into the ground they lose their investment money and the team, at worst, gets relegated.
Teams have always lived on the edge and guess what, teams actually going away forever is extremely rare. Why is it important that the clubs are profitable? It's not like there has ever been a shortage of people willing to buy a club and pump money into it.
This post was edited on 4/12/15 at 2:59 pm
Posted on 4/12/15 at 3:19 pm to Draconian Sanctions
quote:
It's not a problem. If owners run their teams into the ground they lose their investment money and the team, at worst, gets relegated.
yea frick the fans and all who support the club
Posted on 4/12/15 at 3:25 pm to StraightCashHomey21
quote:
yea frick the fans and all who support the club
If clubs actually were disappearing them I could see your point, but that just doesn't happen. At worst, the club gets relegated.
Posted on 4/12/15 at 3:35 pm to Draconian Sanctions
quote:
At worst, the club gets relegated.
do you understand how bad that can cripple a club
just look at Leeds and Portsmouth
Southampton went down with bad finances but took a different approach to bounce back and its clearly fricking working.
Posted on 4/12/15 at 3:40 pm to StraightCashHomey21
quote:
do you understand how bad that can cripple a club
BVB, Napoli, and Fiorentina are just fine. Rangers got promoted back to back years and can still make it 3 in a row.
Do you really mean to tell me that if ManU were to go into administration and get bumped down to Conference North that the club wouldn't come right back up in successive years just based on fan base and name alone? In that scenario the Glazers would be out how much money? Not exactly letting them off light.
quote:
just look at Leeds and Portsmouth
Yeah, look at them. Because of FFP they are stuck.
quote:
Southampton went down with bad finances but took a different approach to bounce back and its clearly fricking working.
Yeah it's working so well. They've done absolutely everything right and they still can't crack the top 4.
This post was edited on 4/12/15 at 3:42 pm
Posted on 4/12/15 at 4:55 pm to Draconian Sanctions
quote:
BVB, Napoli, and Fiorentina are just fine. Rangers got promoted back to back years and can still make it 3 in a row.
BVB, Napoli and Rangers are massive clubs
quote:
Do you really mean to tell me that if ManU were to go into administration and get bumped down to Conference North that the club wouldn't come right back up in successive years just based on fan base and name alone? In that scenario the Glazers would be out how much money? Not exactly letting them off light.
That would never happen bc the club does not operate at a loss.
quote:
Yeah, look at them. Because of FFP they are stuck.
lol wut
quote:
Yeah it's working so well. They've done absolutely everything right and they still can't crack the top 4.
Are you crazy? Southampton was in League One not too long ago. Its clearly working and at an alarming rate.
This post was edited on 4/12/15 at 4:56 pm
Posted on 4/12/15 at 7:05 pm to Draconian Sanctions
quote:
So in other words, none of them have gone away.
Well, they literally are separate organizations that are the spiritual successors of the old clubs.
quote:
It's not a problem. If owners run their teams into the ground they lose their investment money and the team, at worst, gets relegated.
Mother of frick you are obtuse. There are numerous things that can and have happened to clubs. Let me explain this again. In the last twenty years (which happens to be the advent of the transfer market as we know it today) there have been at least 100 clubs that have gone into administration or bankruptcy. That is at least 15% of all of Europe's 655 clubs that have experienced insolvency. As a result of that, the clubs themselves, not anyone else, pushed for things like this. FFP would not have happened if it weren't for the clubs themselves. The fricking CFO of the Bundesliga had this to say in front of the European Commission.
quote:
we learn by experience all over the world [that] most club executives tend to operate riskily, tend to overestimate their chances in the Championship. This may result in disproportionate spending relative to the income some clubs generate... club executives have somehow to be protected from themselves
Despite the fairy tale that you believed in, European soccer was never more "capitalistic" than American sports leagues. Soccer teams only gained the equivalent of free agency in 1995. That free agency led to a new era of wheeling and dealing, which is the direct cause of the profligate spending of numerous clubs. The reality was that City and other clubs had a very small window in which to act, and in that time they were extremely successful. We won't ever see a time like the late 90's into the early 2010s with clubs spending as they were. It will all be much more pragmatic. It has to be.
quote:
Why is it important that the clubs are profitable? It's not like there has ever been a shortage of people willing to buy a club and pump money into it.
You've clearly never seen a club go into administration and struggle to find a fit and proper owner.
I won't say that FFP is the correct set of rules, but I will say that something needed to happen, as given the real economic realities of Europe, the spending was unsustainable.
Posted on 4/13/15 at 2:22 am to crazy4lsu
quote:
You've clearly never seen a club go into administration and struggle to find a fit and proper owner.
and he claims to be a Rangers fan
quote:
I won't say that FFP is the correct set of rules, but I will say that something needed to happen, as given the real economic realities of Europe, the spending was unsustainable.
Sounds like you have a similar stance like Gary Neville. He has said City should be able to spend but everything has to be in reason and that FFP should be not as strict for clubs who actually invested in other areas like City did. If the investment is genuine or just ways to get around FFP only time will tell. But the creating clubs around the world is just being used as a write off by the parent company.
PSG on the other hand said we don't give a frick and will still do what we want. If PSG really wanted to they have so many advantages they could have one of the best academies in the world.
If City as a club start bring in major profits by all means spend it. Thing is they don't and have revenue that is not genuine. The telling thing is how little Nike pays City a year. Thats how much they see City's value as a brand and its potential to sell shirts.
Arsenal 2019 £34 Million Puma
Man United 2025 £70 Million Adidas
Man City 2019 £12 Million Nike
Liverpool 2018 £25 Million Warrior
Chelsea 2023 £30 Million Adidas
Tottenham 2018 £10 Million Under Armour
Now shirt sponsor deal per year.
Arsenal £30 Million
Man United £45 Million
Liverpool £20 Million
Chelsea £44 Million
Man City £40 Million
no way City is worth more than Liverpool and Arsenal and sells more shirts.
This post was edited on 4/13/15 at 8:09 am
Posted on 4/13/15 at 7:42 am to StraightCashHomey21
quote:
PSG on the other hand said we don't give a frick and will still do what we want. If PSG really wanted to they have so many advantages they could have one of the best academies in the world.
French football is different because of their academy system. French teams sign the academy products from Clairefontaine and other schools around the country, in addition to the players they already have in their academy. PSG is well-positioned and are more brazen than City. They've also spent better. They didn't spend 20 plus mil on squad players.
Posted on 4/13/15 at 7:53 am to crazy4lsu
quote:
They've also spent better. They didn't spend 20 plus mil on squad players.
They at least decided to buy some good young players
Posted on 4/13/15 at 8:05 am to StraightCashHomey21
Man City is just robbing Peter to pay Paul with that sponsor money. It is coming from the same coffers basically.
Posted on 4/13/15 at 8:14 am to crazy4lsu
quote:One of these is not like the others...
Ferguson, Wenger, Mourinho
Posted on 4/13/15 at 8:29 am to The Mick
quote:
One of these is not like the others...
Which one?
Posted on 4/13/15 at 10:17 am to crazy4lsu
Speaking of Youth set ups
Chelsea U-19's are in the UEFA Youth League Final right now winning 2-1.
They got there by thumping Roma who had beat City before hand.
Chelsea U-19's are in the UEFA Youth League Final right now winning 2-1.
They got there by thumping Roma who had beat City before hand.
Posted on 4/13/15 at 10:50 am to crazy4lsu
quote:
French football is different because of their academy system. French teams sign the academy products from Clairefontaine and other schools around the country, in addition to the players they already have in their academy. PSG is well-positioned and are more brazen than City. They've also spent better. They didn't spend 20 plus mil on squad players.
I don't know much about their overall academy but PSG seem to have some quality youth products ready for big time football. Rabiot looks like a future star, so does the kid Kingsley Coman they lost to Juve, etc etc
Posted on 4/13/15 at 11:01 am to StraightCashHomey21
quote:
Speaking of Youth set ups
Chelsea U-19's are in the UEFA Youth League Final right now winning 2-1.
They got there by thumping Roma who had beat City before hand.
Chelsea has this winger, Isaiah Brown. I think they mentioned he was purchased from West Brom's academy.
Didn't seem he was supposed to be the main star prodigy but he's the one Roma had no answer for. He was a like a pacey, quick dribbling Fellaini against Roma's backline that looked like schoolkids trying to deal with him.
Chelsea's goals came on GK errors but they dominated chances and almost every single one came from that kid running by or simply bulling over a few defenders.
Not sure how it will translate to the next level but it was impressive nonetheless.
Posted on 4/13/15 at 12:43 pm to wm72
quote:
Chelsea has this winger, Isaiah Brown. I think they mentioned he was purchased from West Brom's academy.
Brown is good but their stars are Loftus Cheek and Lewis Baker(on loan to MK Dons) are the real studs.
Posted on 4/13/15 at 1:04 pm to StraightCashHomey21
Izzy and Solanke are dang good up top. Solanke scored in every round of the competition. Boga, Baker and RLC are fun to watch in midfield. Kasey Palmer might be the most fun to watch. When he scores, it's always a golazo. RLC is the most solid IMO. He has the chance to be a dominant presence in midfield. I'm hoping based on Mou's recent comments that he really does get a chance next year in cup games and as a sub. However, when Boga/Izzy are on, they're nearly unstoppable.
Bertrand Traore has really impressed on loan. He's played centrally some and has a decent return. Chalobah has looked okay when I've watched him, but I doubt he gets a chance. Same with Kalas.
Bertrand Traore has really impressed on loan. He's played centrally some and has a decent return. Chalobah has looked okay when I've watched him, but I doubt he gets a chance. Same with Kalas.
Posted on 4/13/15 at 1:21 pm to StraightCashHomey21
quote:
quote:
Chelsea has this winger, Isaiah Brown. I think they mentioned he was purchased from West Brom's academy.
Brown is good but their stars are Loftus Cheek and Lewis Baker(on loan to MK Dons) are the real studs.
Yeah, I just watched the Chelsea-Roma match.
Announcers talked about Loftus Cheek a lot but the Brown kid was by far the standout for Chelsea, and difference in the match, but some of that may just be that he so drastically outmatched the Roma LB and CBs physically.
The youth matches are odd in that way. Often the real future stars aren't the ones with biggest impact.
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