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Message
Things Libertarians need to realize...
Posted on 2/12/14 at 10:55 am
Posted on 2/12/14 at 10:55 am
1) Fiscal issues matter way more than minute social issues(gay marriage etc)
2) Overreaching government(IRS, NSA) matters way more than minute social issues
3) If 1 and 2 dont get reigned in, social issues will be an afterthought, regardless
4) The Christian right is fighting the same battles on the same side as Libertarians on 1 and 2
5) Your strategies of ridicule and criticism are ineffective. They dont win others to your cause, they cause the other side to become defensive
6) Many on the Christian right are more Libertarian than you probably think. They just need to be convinced that Libertarian viewpoints can coincide with Christian beliefs. Joining in with the left to demean the Christian right doesnt help your cause
7) Discussion of ideology alone will not accomplish anything. The GOP needs more Libertarian candidates and less Libertarian peanut galleries
8) Expecting the Christian right to ignore the teachings of the Bible(whether you think they are fairy tales or not) will result in major frustration for YOU
*I am a Libertarian leaning Christian
2) Overreaching government(IRS, NSA) matters way more than minute social issues
3) If 1 and 2 dont get reigned in, social issues will be an afterthought, regardless
4) The Christian right is fighting the same battles on the same side as Libertarians on 1 and 2
5) Your strategies of ridicule and criticism are ineffective. They dont win others to your cause, they cause the other side to become defensive
6) Many on the Christian right are more Libertarian than you probably think. They just need to be convinced that Libertarian viewpoints can coincide with Christian beliefs. Joining in with the left to demean the Christian right doesnt help your cause
7) Discussion of ideology alone will not accomplish anything. The GOP needs more Libertarian candidates and less Libertarian peanut galleries
8) Expecting the Christian right to ignore the teachings of the Bible(whether you think they are fairy tales or not) will result in major frustration for YOU
*I am a Libertarian leaning Christian
This post was edited on 2/12/14 at 10:57 am
33
Posted on 2/12/14 at 10:59 am to bamafan1001
quote:
Many on the Christian right are more Libertarian than you probably think.
...Not in my experience. In fact I know some hardcore Christians that think everything should close on Sunday, by force if need be, and that alcohol should be banned in all forms on Sunday.
quote:
Fiscal issues matter way more than minute social issues(gay marriage etc)
You say that, but once I've voted in a social ignorance spewer who tries to stop alcohol legalization on Sunday or tries to ramp up the drug war I'm more than a little pissed.
Posted on 2/12/14 at 11:00 am to bamafan1001
What is ironic is when "Less Government" Republicans go to the polls to restrict who can get married. And now they don't wanna talk about "social issues" anymore. Those are the same people who gave the government that power in the first place.
True, fundamental conservatives shouldn't care who gets married.
True, fundamental conservatives shouldn't care who gets married.
Posted on 2/12/14 at 11:02 am to bamafan1001
remeber our founding fathers the ones most conservatives love to quote knew that church and state should be kep seperate.
Posted on 2/12/14 at 11:02 am to bamafan1001
quote:
1) Fiscal issues matter way more than minute social issues(gay marriage etc)
Pretty much every Libertarian I have met agrees with this. However, this has proven to not be the case.
Posted on 2/12/14 at 11:03 am to Mickey Goldmill
Those two first responses are why Libertarians will never have a legitimate seat at the table and that makes me sad.
Get over yourselves
Get over yourselves
Posted on 2/12/14 at 11:04 am to bamafan1001
quote:
5) Your strategies of ridicule and criticism are ineffective. They dont win others to your cause, they cause the other side to become defensive
I honestly think this was a major reason Ron Paul never saw any real success in his presidential campaigns. His supporters were unbearable.
quote:
Joining in with the left to demean the Christian right doesnt help your cause
But it makes them cool!
Posted on 2/12/14 at 11:04 am to MagicCityBlazer
quote:
In fact I know some hardcore Christians
Yeah, the hardcore part, yes, overall, no
Posted on 2/12/14 at 11:04 am to bamafan1001
You have a jaundiced view of libertarianism. We are not consumed with gay marriage or drug legalization. We are for freedom and that means limited govt and private property rights.
I suppose you've met some anti-Christian sorts who claim to be libertarian. But freedom means being free to worship in any way you see fit as long as it does not infringe upon my freedom.
I suppose you've met some anti-Christian sorts who claim to be libertarian. But freedom means being free to worship in any way you see fit as long as it does not infringe upon my freedom.
Posted on 2/12/14 at 11:05 am to Mickey Goldmill
quote:
True, fundamental conservatives shouldn't care who gets married.
They don't.
They also don't believe government should be able to impose itself on religious marriage. So, can you not see why they may not vote for somebody that is in favor of just blanket federal legalization of gay marriage?
Posted on 2/12/14 at 11:05 am to Mickey Goldmill
quote:
What is ironic is when "Less Government" Republicans go to the polls to restrict who can get married.
, you're missing the entire point here. That is becoming less and less as each day passes. Posted on 2/12/14 at 11:06 am to GoCrazyAuburn
quote:
quote:
1) Fiscal issues matter way more than minute social issues(gay marriage etc)
Pretty much every Libertarian I have met agrees with this. However, this has proven to not be the case.
Exactly, Libertarians like to talk the fiscal game actions speak louder than words.
Posted on 2/12/14 at 11:06 am to bamafan1001
quote:
4) The Christian right is fighting the same battles on the same side as Libertarians on 1 and 2
The Christian right makes up a large portion of the GOP of the last decade that has supported big government, both fiscally and socially.
quote:
8) Expecting the Christian right to ignore the teachings of the Bible(whether you think they are fairy tales or not) will result in major frustration for YOU
As the right looks more like the left on fiscal issues, social issues become all that's left for many that don't want to vote third party. Social conservatism is dying. Good luck winning the White House without legit small government republicans,libertarians, and independents.
Posted on 2/12/14 at 11:06 am to Zach
quote:
You have a jaundiced view of libertarianism. We are not consumed with gay marriage or drug legalization. We are for freedom and that means limited govt and private property rights.
I suppose you've met some anti-Christian sorts who claim to be libertarian. But freedom means being free to worship in any way you see fit as long as it does not infringe upon my freedom.
Bingo. Real freedom is allowing someone to do something that you may find morally reprehensible, as long as it doesnt infringe upon your rights.
Posted on 2/12/14 at 11:07 am to TK421
quote:
But it makes them cool
Exactly, they're never wrong either because they never take a stance on anything.
Posted on 2/12/14 at 11:08 am to Zach
quote:
Zach
Well said.
Posted on 2/12/14 at 11:09 am to bamafan1001
the Christian right should argue from a platform of Federalism, not morality, IMO.
Posted on 2/12/14 at 11:10 am to GoCrazyAuburn
quote:
They don't.
They also don't believe government should be able to impose itself on religious marriage. So, can you not see why they may not vote for somebody that is in favor of just blanket federal legalization of gay marriage?
Changes have been made to law which restricted who can get married. "Federal legalization" of gay marriage is not giving the federal government more power. It's giving more freedom to the public.
And nobody is touching religion so no need to even bring that up here.
Posted on 2/12/14 at 11:12 am to bamafan1001
OP does not understand libertarianism or has a skewed view of it based on limited personal interactions.
Posted on 2/12/14 at 11:13 am to bamafan1001
quote:
Many on the Christian right are more Libertarian than you probably think.
Plus, OP is delusional.
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