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re: Obama and the military brass at odds with strategy to fight ISIL

Posted on 9/19/14 at 12:20 pm to
Posted by Wtodd
Tampa, FL
Member since Oct 2013
67482 posts
Posted on 9/19/14 at 12:20 pm to
We should arm everybody in the ME and let them go at it......all of them.......at once.
Posted by Champagne
Already Conquered USA.
Member since Oct 2007
48280 posts
Posted on 9/19/14 at 1:18 pm to
quote:


You have no way of knowing what he's being told or whether he's ignoring them. Because someone wrote an article that doesn't mean they were in the room when strategies were discussed and decisions were made.






General Keane wasn't lying when he said the words. I only repeated what came directly out of his mouth.

So, you are dead wrong here.
Posted by Big12fan
Dallas
Member since Nov 2011
5340 posts
Posted on 9/19/14 at 2:02 pm to
It is my opinion that our European Allies and Israel should finally contribute boots on the ground. They are at greater risk than we are and we've already spilt more blood than was necessary. Germany and France have yet to commit boots on the ground in Iraq nor has Israel. Or is there a logical reason they should not and that we should?

The Brits & the US have spent enough lives in that God-Forsaken country - Let the Europeans and the inhabitants of the region handle this crap. Add in Iran, Saudi Arabia, and Egypt. We are hated enough as it is. ISIS is NOT our problem. Our presence in Iraq again would be the greatest recruiting tool ISIS could ever dream of. As a matter of fact, they want the US involved again with troops. I stand with Obama on this issue.
Posted by TX Tiger
at home
Member since Jan 2004
35632 posts
Posted on 9/19/14 at 2:56 pm to
quote:

Obama and the military brass at odds with strategy to fight ISIL
Of course they are. Why wouldn't they be?

One side needs to maintain a boogeyman to repay those who put him in office....TWICE.
The other side is trying to eradicate a perceived enemy.
Posted by Walkthedawg
Dawg Pound
Member since Oct 2012
11466 posts
Posted on 9/19/14 at 3:18 pm to
The French are coming, the French are coming

Viva La France - The coalition
Posted by USMCTiger03
Member since Sep 2007
71176 posts
Posted on 9/19/14 at 4:17 pm to
quote:

I'm saying it's tacky for recently retired military personnel to publicly criticize their commander in chief.

How long should they have to wait, SirWinston?
Posted by Champagne
Already Conquered USA.
Member since Oct 2007
48280 posts
Posted on 9/19/14 at 4:29 pm to
quote:

Germany and France have yet to commit boots on the ground in Iraq nor has Israel. Or is there a logical reason they should not and that we should?



IMHO the leaders of people who might be our allies don't trust Obama. They don't like Obama. As such, they won't support Obama with ground troops. Why should they? They know that Obama would abandon them in a heartbeat, if it pleased Obama to do so.
Posted by Arksulli
Fayetteville
Member since Aug 2014
25179 posts
Posted on 9/19/14 at 4:56 pm to
Wait... people think the key to beating ISIS/L and calming down tensions in the middle east is to bring in the Israeli Army?

I could list the many, many reasons this is not a wonderful idea. I will stop at Number One though which is every Arab nation, at best, despises Israel. It would be like trying to put out a kitchen fire by dropping napalm.

Germany and France are a different matter. Germany almost never sends troops abroad and that is because the rest of the civilized world wrote their constitution so that they wouldn't get the urge to go on foreign adventures. They do make up a large part of the NATO force in Afghanistan and they've had their share of fatalities in doing so. They are a pacifistic country for the most part and guess what? We went out of our way to encourage that for obvious reasons.

The French said at the beginning that going into Iraq was a bad idea and they stuck by their guns. They also have sent combat forces into Afghanistan and yes, they have their share of fatalities as well. Even though the French spend a ton of money on their military its already pretty stretched with all of their defense commitments in place as is. Them being willing to lend air support is more then we could have hoped for.
Posted by Champagne
Already Conquered USA.
Member since Oct 2007
48280 posts
Posted on 9/19/14 at 7:23 pm to
Big12fan mentioned bringing in the Israeli army into the fray, not I.

I'm just saying that Obama's coalition of world nations is not impressive because he's neither respected nor liked by other world leaders. Let's face it, you'd have to be a moron to trust a lying schemer like Barack Obama.

THAT'S why the USA will largely be going it alone. Of course, Obama could put some billions on the table to buy off more support. That's how he got Iran to agree to extend the time for negotiations on their nuke program.
This post was edited on 9/19/14 at 7:24 pm
Posted by BamaScoop
Panama City Beach, Florida
Member since May 2007
53814 posts
Posted on 9/19/14 at 8:20 pm to
Obama is probably wanting to send them rice and penicillin. Probably doesn't know where syria is located.
Posted by Big12fan
Dallas
Member since Nov 2011
5340 posts
Posted on 9/19/14 at 8:44 pm to
quote:

Big12fan mentioned bringing in the Israeli army into the fray, not I.


I did and for a reason. They have a lot more at risk than the US does. Ultimately all of the Western European countries do as well and I think Turkey being on the northern borders with Syria & Iraq has an unmet obligation.

There costs of further US involvement in Iraq far outweigh the gains. If ISIS really is the military power that everybody seems to fear, then the Germans as well as the French, Italians, Pol, and the Brits should be able to handle the situation. And what about the Iranians? They have a huge score to settle with the Sunnis.

My point is that we have no real friends in the region. Robert Gates once said that anyone who considers ground troops in the ME ought to have his head examined. Oh and what about Syria's best friend Russia? They damn sure have a military and Putin has 16 million Muslims within his borders who might well join forces with an ISIS advancement.

Why would we go there? "Fighting for our freedom" doesn't seem to be a legitimate reason any longer. ISIS would like nothing better than to get the US back in Iraq and I believe it to be sadistic to send our soldiers back into that bobbie-traped, IED-laden, sand pit and have them endure more then they've already encountered.

If ISIS is the big bad wolf, Europe will have to act or get eaten alive. I'm willing to sit this one out and force our "allies" to take more responsibility for their security.
Posted by Champagne
Already Conquered USA.
Member since Oct 2007
48280 posts
Posted on 9/19/14 at 9:29 pm to
quote:

If ISIS is the big bad wolf, Europe will have to act or get eaten alive. I'm willing to sit this one out and force our "allies" to take more responsibility for their security.



Obama is thoroughly mistrusted and disliked by other world leaders. I doubt he will get any of the countries you mentioned to commit ground troops.

The only people who think highly of Obama are the American Left, the Democrats and the mainstream media. The rest of the Universe knows the truth about him.


Posted by USMCTiger03
Member since Sep 2007
71176 posts
Posted on 9/19/14 at 10:12 pm to
#frickingcommunityorganizer
Posted by Big12fan
Dallas
Member since Nov 2011
5340 posts
Posted on 9/19/14 at 10:21 pm to
quote:

Obama is thoroughly mistrusted and disliked by other world leaders. I doubt he will get any of the countries you mentioned to commit ground troops.

The only people who think highly of Obama are the American Left, the Democrats and the mainstream media. The rest of the Universe knows the truth about him.


Well hell, since they are much more likely to be affected by ISIS than we are, if they can't be motivated to defend themselves, then I'd say ISIS will kick their butts.

Leave Obama out of the discussion - if fear of ISIS does not scare Europe into action, then this whole thing is greatly exaggerated.

I support the inaction by our President in this instance. No more insane military interventions. Let the next Potus repeat our mistakes.
Posted by Champagne
Already Conquered USA.
Member since Oct 2007
48280 posts
Posted on 9/19/14 at 10:38 pm to
quote:

I support the inaction by our President in this instance.


To what "inaction" do you refer? Right now, POTUS has US troops on the ground directing air strikes, and he plans to send more.

Not only that, but, he also plans to bomb targets inside of the sovereign nation of Syria, with whom the USA is not authorized by the UN Security Council to be at war.

So, besides these US airstrikes, these US troops and this planned but illegal armed attack on Syria, to what "inaction" do you refer, Sir?
Posted by Big12fan
Dallas
Member since Nov 2011
5340 posts
Posted on 9/19/14 at 11:52 pm to
quote:

So, besides these US airstrikes, these US troops and this planned but illegal armed attack on Syria, to what "inaction" do you refer, Sir?


Thought it would be obvious - but I was referring to troops on the ground in the Middle East.
Posted by Champagne
Already Conquered USA.
Member since Oct 2007
48280 posts
Posted on 9/20/14 at 11:23 am to
There ARE US ground troops on the ground in the Middle East. Not only that, but Obama is sending more US ground troops and the number will be several thousand at least.

Now, if you are praising Obama for not sending tens of thousands of US ground troops to Iraq/Syria, then, I understand.

But, honestly, after ignoring the military's advice to leave a follow-on force in Iraq, how could Obama now send tens of thousands BACK to Iraq so soon? He'd look like a totally clueless fool if he did that.

Posted by Arksulli
Fayetteville
Member since Aug 2014
25179 posts
Posted on 9/20/14 at 11:43 am to
Enh, sorry about that Champagne, wasn't replying directly to you in my previous post. Hell, you're preaching to my choir so far in this thread.
Posted by Big12fan
Dallas
Member since Nov 2011
5340 posts
Posted on 9/20/14 at 12:04 pm to
quote:

There ARE US ground troops on the ground in the Middle East. Not only that, but Obama is sending more US ground troops and the number will be several thousand at least.

Now, if you are praising Obama for not sending tens of thousands of US ground troops to Iraq/Syria, then, I understand.

But, honestly, after ignoring the military's advice to leave a follow-on force in Iraq, how could Obama now send tens of thousands BACK to Iraq so soon? He'd look like a totally clueless fool if he did that.


It doesn't appear that Obama is phased by optics. Regardless, you make good points, so to clarify my point of view, I'd agree with this statement in the link posted by the OP.

quote:

In an interview with MSNBC, Blinken insisted that such deployments would not amount to combat “where Americans are on the ground leading the fight. That is not going to happen. That’s not part of this campaign. The president’s been clear about that.”


Posted by SpidermanTUba
my house
Member since May 2004
36128 posts
Posted on 9/20/14 at 12:11 pm to
quote:

Holy fricking shite


OMG?!?! WTF (We're Tobacco Free!) ?!?!? Do we have a system in place that determines how we move forward when the President and his military advisors disagree on something?!? I hope the Founders thought of this!!!!
This post was edited on 9/20/14 at 12:12 pm
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