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Did Jews play role in secularization of America as a reaction to Anti-Semitism?
Posted on 12/25/16 at 1:13 pm
Posted on 12/25/16 at 1:13 pm
As America has secularized, you often see liberal Jews leading the way against Christian prominence, Christmas celebrations, and anything that smacks of Christian establishment. Or, that is the accusation. What is the reality? Did this happen? Or, was it just something that was said?
If so, they have that right and America is a free country. But, have they pushed for a removal of religion from the state and public culture because of persecution in the past at the hands of Christians? So they don't have to live in a Christian America? Or, just because they don't like Christianity?
Or, is the idea that Jews have led this push for secularization just an anti-semitic myth propagated by enemies of the Jewish people to create anger against them?
Living in the South, I do not encounter Jewish people often and I've never seen them advocating against public displays of Christianity. But, this is something that I've heard people say about secularization. Is it true or not?
And, I deplore anti-semitism and am sympathetic to the Jewish people as well as the nation of Israel. This post is not meant to be negative toward Jews. I am more just wondering about the theory. Let's keep any anti-semitism out of this thread, okay?
If so, they have that right and America is a free country. But, have they pushed for a removal of religion from the state and public culture because of persecution in the past at the hands of Christians? So they don't have to live in a Christian America? Or, just because they don't like Christianity?
Or, is the idea that Jews have led this push for secularization just an anti-semitic myth propagated by enemies of the Jewish people to create anger against them?
Living in the South, I do not encounter Jewish people often and I've never seen them advocating against public displays of Christianity. But, this is something that I've heard people say about secularization. Is it true or not?
And, I deplore anti-semitism and am sympathetic to the Jewish people as well as the nation of Israel. This post is not meant to be negative toward Jews. I am more just wondering about the theory. Let's keep any anti-semitism out of this thread, okay?
This post was edited on 12/25/16 at 1:24 pm
11
Posted on 12/25/16 at 1:14 pm to AlaTiger
Jesus Christ
Posted on 12/25/16 at 1:14 pm to AlaTiger
Who are these liberal joooooooos?
Name them.
Name them.
Posted on 12/25/16 at 1:16 pm to mahdragonz
All rich jews are liberals.
Posted on 12/25/16 at 1:17 pm to russellvillehog
quote:
All rich jews are liberals.
You must not know many Jewish people to say that.
Posted on 12/25/16 at 1:18 pm to AlaTiger
They've always been against christianity, heck, they even killed the founder of it
Posted on 12/25/16 at 1:19 pm to AlaTiger
I think a lot of it had to do with intellectuals who resented Christianity and it having such a strong foothold in Europe and the West. A lot harder to control people when they follow Christianity and not human rulers. I think that was the intention of the Frankfurt School - the whole idea was to destroy western culture/capitalism and bring about marxism.
Posted on 12/25/16 at 1:21 pm to AlaTiger
The Jews in America seem more liberal, because all the conservatives are nationalist and went to Israel to fight for their homelands.
Posted on 12/25/16 at 1:21 pm to AlaTiger
Huh?
Stahp.
Stahp.
Posted on 12/25/16 at 1:25 pm to mahdragonz
I am not saying that this accusation is true. I'm asking if it is.
I really don't have an agenda here. I hear this myth and see it propagated from time to time. It makes some sense from a religious perspective that Jews have been a persecuted minority so they want to remove dominant religious influence over them. But, it might just be a myth.
Asking for discussion, not trying to prove a point.
I really don't have an agenda here. I hear this myth and see it propagated from time to time. It makes some sense from a religious perspective that Jews have been a persecuted minority so they want to remove dominant religious influence over them. But, it might just be a myth.
Asking for discussion, not trying to prove a point.
Posted on 12/25/16 at 1:25 pm to goldennugget
Anchor
This post was edited on 12/25/16 at 1:27 pm
Posted on 12/25/16 at 1:27 pm to TbirdSpur2010
I'm not saying I believe it is true. I'm asking if there is any merit to the idea, or if it is just a myth?
My goal really is discussion. I'm not anti-Jewish by any means. A family mentioned that there was a Jewish person they knew who was complaining about references to Christmas at their kid's private school because they weren't Christian and it got me thinking. Is that prominent?
I honestly don't know. I've heard the theories that Jews want a secular state so they can feel more safe, but I'm not sure that it is true.
My goal really is discussion. I'm not anti-Jewish by any means. A family mentioned that there was a Jewish person they knew who was complaining about references to Christmas at their kid's private school because they weren't Christian and it got me thinking. Is that prominent?
I honestly don't know. I've heard the theories that Jews want a secular state so they can feel more safe, but I'm not sure that it is true.
Posted on 12/25/16 at 1:29 pm to goldennugget
quote:
Anchor
Good grief. I'm not promoting the idea. I'm asking about a secularization theory and if the Jewish people, who are a religious minority, have promoted secularization as a response to prior persecution so they can feel more a part of America and feel safer.
How is that anti-Jewish? It is a discussion point that would make perfect sense, honestly.
"Jew" is not a bad word.
Posted on 12/25/16 at 1:30 pm to AlaTiger
Do bears take big shits? Of course Jews played a role in the secularization of America as well as the political left and communists pre-WWII.
Posted on 12/25/16 at 1:32 pm to goldennugget
I have no idea why this would be anchored.
The mods on this board baffle me at times.
THIS IS NOT AN ANTI-SEMITIC POST. It is a discussion of how the Jewish people in America have tried to respond to past persecution. Again, I don't blame them if the theory is true. It makes sense. But, I'm not sure it is true. I was wondering. It might just be a coincidence of history and there were other factors involved.
The mods on this board baffle me at times.
THIS IS NOT AN ANTI-SEMITIC POST. It is a discussion of how the Jewish people in America have tried to respond to past persecution. Again, I don't blame them if the theory is true. It makes sense. But, I'm not sure it is true. I was wondering. It might just be a coincidence of history and there were other factors involved.
Posted on 12/25/16 at 1:34 pm to AlaTiger
quote:
I'm not saying I believe it is true. I'm asking if there is any merit to the idea, or if it is just a myth?
Myth. Not one iota of merit, IMHO.
Posted on 12/25/16 at 1:35 pm to TbirdSpur2010
America has always been a secular republic so I don't think Jews had anything to do with it. If you look at the Constitution it's clear that we were founded as a secular Republic with no state church and freedom to exercise at will.
Now, the idea of no christian symbols on state property like nativity scenes or no school prayers at commencement or before football games you mainly have liberal and secular protestants to blame instead of Jews.
Jews in the US have stayed out of the push to sue over Christian symbols on government property or school prayer as a survival mechanism. Jews really don't mess with the state-Church debate if you look who files the lawsuits
Now, the idea of no christian symbols on state property like nativity scenes or no school prayers at commencement or before football games you mainly have liberal and secular protestants to blame instead of Jews.
Jews in the US have stayed out of the push to sue over Christian symbols on government property or school prayer as a survival mechanism. Jews really don't mess with the state-Church debate if you look who files the lawsuits
This post was edited on 12/25/16 at 1:41 pm
Posted on 12/25/16 at 1:39 pm to TbirdSpur2010
quote:
Myth. Not one iota of merit, IMHO.
Thanks. Honestly, that is the kind of feedback I was looking for. I was afraid to post this, almost, because I didn't want any anti-semites coming in here railing against Jews.
But, I thought that post-WW2 and all that happened, there might have been a push for just pure secularism by Jews as a way of self-protection so they could be who they were without fear. The idea made sense, in a way.
Posted on 12/25/16 at 1:39 pm to Ralph_Wiggum
quote:
America has always been a secular republic so I don't think Jews had anything to do with it. If you look at the Constitution it's clear that we were founded as a secular Republican with no state church and freedom to exercise at will.
Now, the idea of no christian symbols on state property like nativity scenes or no school prayers at commencement or before football games you mainly have liberal and secular protestants to blame instead of Jews.
Jews in the US have stayed out of the push to sue over Christian symbols on government property or school prayer as a survival mechanism. Jews really don't mess with the state-Church debate if you look who files the lawsuits
Thanks. This was the kind of feedback I was looking for. It is not a theory I have given much thought to. Appreciate it!
Posted on 12/25/16 at 1:40 pm to AlaTiger
quote:
have promoted secularization as a response to prior persecution so they can feel more a part of America and feel safer
No. They do it because they want the NWO. You need to destroy nation-states to get a one world government. If a country has no culture then there will be very few that defend it. So they promote culture rot. If the country has no principles who gives a shite what happens to it.
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