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re: AP: McCain thinks he is president and calls for more Americans to die
Posted on 8/10/17 at 12:54 pm to notsince98
Posted on 8/10/17 at 12:54 pm to notsince98
We have no reason to even be in Afghanistan anymore other then to keep the defense industry profitable.
0
Posted on 8/10/17 at 12:56 pm to notsince98
Bloodstains McCain.
What an evil, traitorous man he is.
Thanks for him, Boomer Conservatives.
What an evil, traitorous man he is.
Thanks for him, Boomer Conservatives.
Posted on 8/10/17 at 1:05 pm to Adam Banks
quote:Well the burden of proof is on the person who made the claim, especially because it is a positive claim and can therefore be proven whole the alternative almost certainly cannot.
I'm not saying it's true I'm not saying it's false but to cite polifact as if they have any clue whether or not McCain squealed or not is equally as baseless as the previous poster saying he did
In addition, given the specificity of the claim, the atypical circumstances surrounding it, and the fact that he is a well-known person with many political enemies, if true, the claim would be more likely to be widely known anyways. Therefore, the apriori probability of the claim is already less than the alternative.
And even if politifact is imperfect, the fact that they didn't find any evidence to support the claim (can't prove it false) is not without merit, especially since if it was available, and they were incorrect, they would further harm their own reputation.
So no. They are not equally baseless. In fact, logic and the available evidence indicate the only baseless claim is the original one, unless and until the person provides evidence to support it.
Posted on 8/10/17 at 1:10 pm to notsince98
I wonder how we got into war in Afghanistan, just as I wonder how we got into war in Vietnam. Then I see these warmongering motherfrickers are ready to go to war with Russia right now over Ukraine and 20 other things.
Has John McCain ever met a war (or potential war) he didn't like?
Has John McCain ever met a war (or potential war) he didn't like?
Posted on 8/10/17 at 1:15 pm to buckeye_vol
The only people who know the truth are John McCain and the Vietnamese who tortured him. McCain (obviously) has absolutely no incentive to be truthful if he did squeal. This isn't a court of law we don't have to say that if there's no evidence he did then it's for sure that he didn't. In fact being a reasonable person saying that we can't know the truth would be the most reasonable position to take
This post was edited on 8/10/17 at 1:16 pm
Posted on 8/10/17 at 1:15 pm to 225bred
quote:One would think that after he broke under torture in the Hanoi Hilton he wouldn't advocate (barring absolute necessity) that others be placed in a similar situation or a coffin.
Why do American flag covered caskets give him a hardon
Posted on 8/10/17 at 1:26 pm to notsince98
quote:
McCain said he’ll seek a vote on his “strategy for success” in Afghanistan when the Senate returns in September and takes up the annual defense policy bill. His plan doesn’t say how many more U.S. forces should be sent to Afghanistan.
quote:
But McCain has grown increasingly impatient. During a committee hearing in June, he told Defense Secretary Jim Mattis that he had been confident the Trump administration would deliver a plan for Afghanistan within a month or two after taking office.
“So all I can tell you is that unless we get a strategy from you, you’re going to get a strategy from us,” McCain said at the time.
Um yeah-I'm not real sure that Congress gets to say how a war should be fought, much less one senator. That's the job of the executive branch.
Beyond that, I love that war hawk McCain has become a darling to the Left and the Dems. He is Congress' biggest shill for the military/industrial complex. Rewind to 2008 if you really want to know what the Dems and the MSM think of him. Right now he is just their useful idiot. When he dies, as we all must, they will prop him up as a great uniter and attempt to guilt the Republicucks into compromising on everything.
TL/DR: frick John McCain.
This post was edited on 8/10/17 at 1:27 pm
Posted on 8/10/17 at 1:39 pm to buckeye_vol
LINK
McCain even admitted to succumbing to the torture in his own book. He has vehemently fought for all records regarding POWs in vietnam to be sealed forever.
McCain even admitted to succumbing to the torture in his own book. He has vehemently fought for all records regarding POWs in vietnam to be sealed forever.
Posted on 8/10/17 at 1:41 pm to Adam Banks
quote:So then the claim that he did "squeal" without any evidence is baseless. So the only valid conclusion absent any evidence, is that we have no evidence.
The only people who know the truth are John McCain and the Vietnamese who tortured him. McCain (obviously) has absolutely no incentive to be truthful if he did squeal.
quote:Which is exactly why politifact said "there is no evidence" of the claim.
This isn't a court of law we don't have to say that if there's no evidence he did then it's for sure that he didn't. In fact being a reasonable person saying that we can't know the truth would be the most reasonable position to take
We can't argue "absent of evidence" is "evidence of absence." But it's even less valid to argue that "absence of evidence" supports a claim that requires evidence.
Posted on 8/10/17 at 1:43 pm to buckeye_vol
quote:
So then the claim that he did "squeal" without any evidence is baseless. So the only valid conclusion absent any evidence, is that we have no evidence.
McCain admitted this himself in his own book. Accept it and move on.
Posted on 8/10/17 at 1:48 pm to notsince98
quote:OK? But is there any evidence that he gave them information that led to the deaths of thousands of soldiers? That required knowledge of specific information, that information had to be useful at the time, that information to be acted upon, and the action had to result in the deaths of thousands.
McCain even admitted to succumbing to the torture in his own book.
That is a whole lot of assumptions to get from "succumbing" to "resulting in the deaths of thousands of US soldiers."
Is it possible, sure? But a claim like that require more than a mere possibility to argue its validity; it requires evidence.
But whether it's true or not, I do despise his foreign policy positions. Whatever happened during his torture has no impact on the validity of his positions in 2017.
Posted on 8/10/17 at 1:48 pm to notsince98
quote:He admitted that he gave up intelligence information that led to the deaths of thousands?
McCain admitted this himself in his own book. Accept it and move on.
Posted on 8/10/17 at 1:49 pm to buckeye_vol
quote:
OK? But is there any evidence that he gave them information that led to the deaths of thousands of soldiers? That required knowledge of specific information, that information had to be useful at the time, that information to be acted upon, and the action had to result in the deaths of thousands.
That is a whole lot of assumptions to get from "succumbing" to "resulting in the deaths of thousands of US soldiers."
Is it possible, sure? But a claim like that require more than a mere possibility to argue its validity; it requires evidence.
But whether it's true or not, I do despise his foreign policy positions. Whatever happened during his torture has no impact on the validity of his positions in 2017.
OK, so now that we have addressed your "didn't squeal" attempt we will move on to your next goal post.
yes, ample evidence. It has already been linked and you didn't read it.
Posted on 8/10/17 at 1:50 pm to notsince98
Buckeye Vol is the king of moving the goal posts
Posted on 8/10/17 at 1:54 pm to notsince98
quote:We were discussing a claim that he gave information that led to the deaths of thousands. So the discussion isn't whether he succumbed to torture, like most human beings. So given that "squealing" refers to the specific claim. I'm not moving the goal posts; that's where they were set initially.
OK, so now that we have addressed your "didn't squeal" attempt we will move on to your next goal post.
Posted on 8/10/17 at 1:55 pm to 225bred
quote:Well in this case at least, the goals posts were set at "gave information that led to the deaths of thousands."
Buckeye Vol is the king of moving the goal posts
Posted on 8/10/17 at 2:02 pm to buckeye_vol
quote:
Well in this case at least, the goals posts were set at "gave information that led to the deaths of thousands."
Yet you first attempted to attack the claim he squealed and provided a link that has since been proven to be completely wrong.
I mean, feel free to research this all yourself. I'd recommend avoiding partisan outlets like politifact though if you really want truth.
Here is some more advice. There are interviews out there of guys who were prisoners with McCain. There are even interviews with the Vietnamese guy who captured McCain after his crash and was responsible for protecting McCain from angry Vietnamese who wanted McCain dead. There are interviews with the nurses who took care of McCain while prisoner.
The common theme with all of them is that McCain lied about everything other than squealing. Technically, you could probably say he didn't squeal because the Vietnamese claim he was never tortured. This leads you down the path of what information is McCain admitting to giving the Vietnamese if he wasn't tortured and for what reasons?
It is a highly fascinating topic that you can spend days on if you want.
Posted on 8/10/17 at 2:10 pm to notsince98
Someone should use McCains own words against him, confront him, but alas no one will...
Nearly seven years after Obamacare, we’ve had no strategy at all as conditions on Obamacare have steadily worsened," , “The thousands of Americans forced to pay for insurance they don't want. American citizens deserve better from Congress.”
quote:
“Nearly seven months into President Trump’s administration, we’ve had no strategy at all as conditions on the ground have steadily worsened,” said McCain, a leading voice in Congress on national security matters. “The thousands of Americans putting their lives on the line in Afghanistan deserve better from their commander in chief.”
Nearly seven years after Obamacare, we’ve had no strategy at all as conditions on Obamacare have steadily worsened," , “The thousands of Americans forced to pay for insurance they don't want. American citizens deserve better from Congress.”
Posted on 8/10/17 at 2:15 pm to kevv824
Didn't Maxine Waters and the dims want to impeach Trump based on mental illness? Makes you wonder why no one is saying it for McCain...
Posted on 8/10/17 at 3:05 pm to notsince98
frick this guy. His demise will save American lives.
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