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Watch this video, and tell me NBA superstars didn't have it easier in the '90's

Posted on 4/16/15 at 9:45 pm
Posted by PrimeTime Money
Houston, Texas, USA
Member since Nov 2012
27305 posts
Posted on 4/16/15 at 9:45 pm
Here is a video I came across, called "Michael Jordan 1997 Playoffs Highlights". You really only have to watch the first few minutes to get what I'm talking about. Read this post, and honestly watch for what I'm talking about so we can have an honest discussion.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D0Jjl9_ZDY4


I don't think people really understand how the illegal defense rules back then made it much easier for the super star player to score.

Notice in the video how much SPACE Jordan has. Look at how 1-on-1 it was back then. And when I say 1-on-1, I mean how it was man on man... team defense did not exist in the same way as it does today.

Why does he have so much space to operate? Because back then, the defenders were required to stick on their man and follow them all around the court like a puppy dog. They couldn't hang out in space and "cheat" over to help on dribble penetration or clog up driving lanes. That was against the rules.

If they double teamed, they had to make a b-line to Jordan and aggressively double him.

Notice how easy it is to get dribble penetration, because the other defenders do not peel off their man to help. It's strictly 1-on-1. You blow by your man, you got an open look, whether that's taking it all the way to the rim or a pull-up jumper.



The whole video is a good demonstration of what I'm talking about, but here are two clear, picture-perfect examples of what I'm talking about:

2:04 - this is a called isolation play. Notice how EVERYBODY is on the left side of the court, and Jordan is 1-on-1 with his man on the opposite side. There is no help defender shading over. They cannot slide over, or they'll be called for illegal defense. Look how easily he gets to the rim, and look how there was literally zero help defense.



2:58 - PERFECT example of a double team in the 90's before the rule changes. Look how the defender has to SPRINT at Jordan to double team him. There was no cheating over like today. You had to 100% commit to the double team.

Now you can see how easy it was for a good player to exploit the double team. Jordan saw the guy coming at him, and he used that opportunity to attack.

When big men used to see the double coming, they'd hit the open man.

It was much easier to find the open man back then when there was nobody cheating in the passing lanes like they are allowed to do today.

Also, notice how there is zero help defense at the rim, because since the big men have to defend their man only, the rotation comes too late. Now-a-days, Jordan would have been met with a defender outside of the paint.





Just keep those things in mind while you watch the video.
This post was edited on 4/16/15 at 9:49 pm
Posted by mattz1122
Member since Oct 2007
52796 posts
Posted on 4/16/15 at 9:49 pm to
And don't forget the lack of Deandre Jordan.
Posted by Purple Spoon
Hoth
Member since Feb 2005
17838 posts
Posted on 4/16/15 at 9:52 pm to
Good points.

I usually just chalk it up as guys wanting to beleive things were better back in their day.
Posted by BayouBandit24
Member since Aug 2010
16577 posts
Posted on 4/16/15 at 9:53 pm to
quote:

I usually just chalk it up as guys wanting to beleive things were better back in their day.


Because that's what it is
Posted by AlaTiger
America
Member since Aug 2006
21123 posts
Posted on 4/16/15 at 10:09 pm to
Players could actually shoot back then consistently throughout the roster.

If you double teamed Jordan, he would kick it to a number of other players who could shoot really well.

Yes, there are great players today who can shoot. But, when I watch and NBA game, the number of players who are just bad shooters is astounding.

There was strong defense among the better teams back then. These are also Jordan HIGHLIGHTS from one of the best teams of all time. The discussion is about the game OVERALL. No one doubts that Lebron, Westbrook, Durant, Curry, etc are great players or that the Spurs from last year was not an absolutely great team that wouldn't have been great in any era.

The discussion is about overall.
Posted by DollaChoppa
I Simp for ACC
Member since May 2008
84774 posts
Posted on 4/16/15 at 10:09 pm to
I mean, the #1 thing I notice is that MJ is frickign ridiculous. Good lord i forgot how smooth he looks. What an incredible shooter too. Its just fricking poetic

Idk if this is the best video to prove your point because of how insanely good he is.
This post was edited on 4/16/15 at 10:10 pm
Posted by dgtiger3
Prairieville
Member since Sep 2005
5700 posts
Posted on 4/16/15 at 10:10 pm to
But Alonzo Mourning told me Michael Jordan would average 50 in today's NBA.....
Posted by c on z
Zamunda
Member since Mar 2009
127413 posts
Posted on 4/16/15 at 10:11 pm to
Do you at least notice all the wide open lanes he has?
Posted by dgtiger3
Prairieville
Member since Sep 2005
5700 posts
Posted on 4/16/15 at 10:14 pm to
quote:

Players could actually shoot back then consistently throughout the roster. 


Go to an NBA game early enough to watch a shoot around, get back to me on this one.

Watching an NBA shoot around is one of the most astonishing things I have ever witnessed.
Posted by PrimeTime Money
Houston, Texas, USA
Member since Nov 2012
27305 posts
Posted on 4/16/15 at 10:15 pm to
quote:

Players could actually shoot back then consistently throughout the roster.
I could argue this point.. but this topic has nothing to do with that subject.

This is about how super-stars back then could more easily score and facilitate.

Now, it's much harder to go 1-on-1. Superior 1-on-1 players back then (like Jordan) could light teams up due to the tremendous amounts of space the rules created.

Space is the #1 thing a coach will talk about with regards to offense.

That's why now the "stretch 4" is such a coveted thing. Since players can clog up the paint and hang out in space now, it's harder for teams to execute their offense.

Back in the 90's, teams could create space simply by spreading out, and their man had to follow them, whether they could shoot or not. Now, their man doesn't have to follow a bad shooter out to the perimeter.

Stretch 4's help to space the floor some, but it still does not compare to the space created for super stars to go 1-on-1 in the 90's.
Posted by dgtiger3
Prairieville
Member since Sep 2005
5700 posts
Posted on 4/16/15 at 10:16 pm to
quote:

Do you at least notice all the wide open lanes he has?



Anthony Davis would be fricking unstoppable, Tyreke would be pretty damn solid himself.
Posted by PrimeTime Money
Houston, Texas, USA
Member since Nov 2012
27305 posts
Posted on 4/16/15 at 10:16 pm to
quote:

Idk if this is the best video to prove your point because of how insanely good he is.

I know he was amazing... but this video isn't even about that.

It's for you to notice how wide open the driving lanes were and how nobody could help on him when he took a jump shot.

There is literally guys standing just a few feet away and watching him shoot an open jumper... but he does nothing because he has to stick on his man.
Posted by goldenbadger08
Sorting Out MSB BS Since 2011
Member since Oct 2011
37900 posts
Posted on 4/16/15 at 10:17 pm to
quote:

NBA superstars didn't have it easier in the '90's
Posted by AlaTiger
America
Member since Aug 2006
21123 posts
Posted on 4/16/15 at 10:18 pm to
quote:

quote:
Players could actually shoot back then consistently throughout the roster. 


Go to an NBA game early enough to watch a shoot around, get back to me on this one.

Watching an NBA shoot around is one of the most astonishing things I have ever witnessed.


I have. It is incredible to watch.

They could do the same in the 80s and 90s too. The difference is, when the game action starts, those guys were better throughout the roster. Now, there is a lot of freezing up, missing wide open shots, and even missing layups.

I remember that when guys used to get open looks, they would usually make them. The whole thing was about getting a guy open. Now, guys have wide open shots and miss consistently.
Posted by thewarmth
Bali
Member since May 2010
1891 posts
Posted on 4/16/15 at 10:19 pm to
quote:

quote:


Anthony Davis would be fricking unstoppable, Tyreke would be pretty damn solid himself.


LOL, AD maybe but gtfo with Tyreke
Posted by DMagic
#ChowderPosse
Member since Aug 2010
46460 posts
Posted on 4/16/15 at 10:21 pm to
Your entire argument is anecdotal. They missed a lot of shots back in the 90s too.
Posted by DollaChoppa
I Simp for ACC
Member since May 2008
84774 posts
Posted on 4/16/15 at 10:22 pm to
Well Im confused for a few reasons. I didnt know if part of that was just a strategy of defending MJ. It would be more beneficial to me to see a full game that showed this well. I mean, I thought maybe they knew Jordan could beat a double team anyway so there was no point in leaving a man open.

Im also confused about these rules you are mentioning and if you are exaggerating them. What about the "Jordan Rules" the pistons used? And the Knicks in the 90s? What time frame are you really referencing when you say 90's?
This post was edited on 4/16/15 at 10:23 pm
Posted by AlaTiger
America
Member since Aug 2006
21123 posts
Posted on 4/16/15 at 10:24 pm to
quote:

quote:
Idk if this is the best video to prove your point because of how insanely good he is.
I know he was amazing... but this video isn't even about that.

It's for you to notice how wide open the driving lanes were and how nobody could help on him when he took a jump shot.

There is literally guys standing just a few feet away and watching him shoot an open jumper... but he does nothing because he has to stick on his man.


No. Once he blew past the guy covering him, the 3 bigs in the lane are allowed to go to him when he gets to them. They can switch to the guy who has the ball when he comes through the lane. They don't have to stay on their man at that point. Jordan was so fast and so fluid that they were not able to get over fast enough.

This video says a lot more about how amazing Jordan was than it does about the point that you are trying to make. Did you see the Rockets and Knicks Finals in 1994 when it was a complete slugfest? What about the Pistons in the late 80's who absolutely protected the basket like their lives depended on it? The Celtics in the 80s would not let anyone get to the rim on them uncontested. Those are just the standout teams at the top. There was brutal play throughout the league on a nightly basis.

But, there was also lots of transition play and motion on offense and the game was a lot more fluid. Guys could shoot from all over the floor so you had to go with them and extend the defense. Sure, man to man defense was required, but you didn't have to stick to your man like glue. You could play off of him quite a bit and then collapse in help defense when someone drove the paint. It was not all one on one like you say. Those highlights of Jordan just make it look that way.
Posted by Rebel Land Shark
Member since Jul 2013
30167 posts
Posted on 4/16/15 at 10:24 pm to
NBA was harder in the 90's
Posted by PrimeTime Money
Houston, Texas, USA
Member since Nov 2012
27305 posts
Posted on 4/16/15 at 10:26 pm to
I just used the 90's as an example. Really any time before the rules were changed prior to 2001-2002.
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