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Success on field compared to recruiting

Posted on 12/17/14 at 10:09 am
Posted by TDTGodfather
Baton Rouge
Member since Dec 2007
6169 posts
Posted on 12/17/14 at 10:09 am
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dunno if Germans, i would think it's gotta be but nevertheless i think it speaks for itself.


one of the arguments against Miles is his disparity btwn recruiting and success. this doesn't seem to be the case.









also from deadspin with how the graph was assembled

quote:

When college football teams fail to meet expectations, fans tend to turn to an old stand-by: Our coach is an all right recruiter, but he just can't coach. This is the narrative behind, for example, Will Muschamp's downturn at Florida. On the other hand, coaches who significantly exceed expectations are perceived as solid coaches despite meager recruiting skills. (This the case for Bill Snyder.) But these coaches are outliers. How does the rest of college football fare in translating expected talent to actual success?

We compared how teams recruited to where they ended up in computer polls at the end of each of the last five seasons. To measure on-field success, we used Kenneth Massey's ranking composite. Massey is a statistician whose work contributed to the BCS computer rankings; his composite index averages dozens of rankings including the six computers used in the BCS, the AP poll, and the USA Today coaches' poll.

Rivals rankings were used to measure recruiting. For each season, we used an average of the five previous recruiting classes. Even though upperclassmen generally contribute more than underclassmen, we avoided weighted averages because upperclassmen also transfer schools, declare for the NFL draft early, and have career-ending injuries.

To give an example of how we rated teams, 2009 teams are made up of recruiting classes from 2005-09. In 2009, USC had a 3.2 average, since the five recruiting classes that made up that team were, on average, ranked 3.2.

We then averaged results from 2009-2013 and compared the metrics. Doing this tells you that from 2009-2013, USC finished 22nd in Massey's poll on average with teams that had recruiting classes ranked 4.2 on average, meaning they "underperformed" their recruiting rankings by 17.8 spots on average. Perhaps as a consequence, Lane Kiffin got fired.

The further teams are from the chart's dotted red line, the greater the discrepancy between their recruiting and on-field rankings. Teams in the blue region did better on the field while teams in the red region were better at recruiting.

Of teams in the red region, Kansas had the most distance between its talent and team success. The Jayhawks are near the middle of the horizontal axis, so it's not like they recruited blue chippers. They've just been so awful on the field, as Charlie Weis lost 19 of 20 contests against Power 5 schools, that they haven't come close to meeting the expectations of their mediocre recruiting classes, underperforming their recruiting classes by 48.9 spots on average.

Of teams in the blue region, Navy had the most distance between talent and success. Despite military-academy restrictions that make recruiting top players difficult, Navy made bowl games in four of the last five seasons as they outperformed their recruiting expectations by 57.4 spots on average.




link to article if you want to read more.

LINK
This post was edited on 12/17/14 at 10:16 am
Posted by SouthOfSouth
Baton Rouge
Member since Jun 2008
43456 posts
Posted on 12/17/14 at 10:10 am to
That's pretty cool and basically what I expected. LSU is near the top with both recruiting and success.
Posted by Mattwells90
Lafayette
Member since Jan 2013
3562 posts
Posted on 12/17/14 at 10:12 am to
Its funny that literally the only one more successful is Bama. LSU really is awful eh? Lol
Posted by LSUnKaty
Katy, TX
Member since Dec 2008
4343 posts
Posted on 12/17/14 at 10:12 am to
quote:

Success on field compared to recruiting
Oh oh - LSU is underperforming.

The decline is real!
Posted by TDTGodfather
Baton Rouge
Member since Dec 2007
6169 posts
Posted on 12/17/14 at 10:13 am to
i know we all hate Alabama but it shows just how incredible they've been. while Oregon and stanford have shown that they play in a pretty shitty conference.
Posted by Ppro
natchez
Member since Dec 2013
416 posts
Posted on 12/17/14 at 10:15 am to
over what timeframe is these rankings?
Posted by ironsides
Nashville, TN
Member since May 2006
8153 posts
Posted on 12/17/14 at 10:16 am to
quote:

Its funny that literally the only one more successful is Bama. LSU really is awful eh? Lol


What's even funnier is that many assume that Auburn's recipe of dismissing and reloading coaches is a more successful one.
Posted by TDTGodfather
Baton Rouge
Member since Dec 2007
6169 posts
Posted on 12/17/14 at 10:17 am to
quote:

over what timeframe is these rankings?


sorry i edited this post, bc the on field results are from 2009 on but the recruiting results start in 05 i think. which i think is even worse for negatigers. No saban players in 09.

although Miles haters can hang on to the fact that this is thru 2013. so this season (2014/their favorite) is not in the results
This post was edited on 12/17/14 at 10:23 am
Posted by lsusteve1
Member since Dec 2004
41931 posts
Posted on 12/17/14 at 10:21 am to
Graph is shite

Used Toonces
Posted by C
Houston
Member since Dec 2007
27824 posts
Posted on 12/17/14 at 10:21 am to
quote:

over what timeframe is these rankings?

2005-09 recruiting and 2009-2013 performance.

I wonder how it hurts/helps that LSU has had the most underclassman go pro than other universities in skewing these results?
This post was edited on 12/17/14 at 10:22 am
Posted by High C
viewing the fall....
Member since Nov 2012
53827 posts
Posted on 12/17/14 at 10:24 am to
This makes me actually at the Miles detractors. It PROVES two things: that they are wrong when they say that he under uses or under develops talent, and that they are clearly Bamasessed.
Posted by cas4t
Member since Jan 2010
70922 posts
Posted on 12/17/14 at 10:24 am to
that's encouraging for the future as I'm sure LSU was even closer to the blue in 2011

that said I'd obviously rather be in the blue than the red at any given point. It's pretty telling that Oregon and Stanford are so far into the blue, and both coaches who coached them to that point are in the NFL now....
Posted by TDTGodfather
Baton Rouge
Member since Dec 2007
6169 posts
Posted on 12/17/14 at 10:24 am to
quote:

I wonder how it hurts/helps that LSU has had the most underclassman go pro than other universities in skewing these results?

i would think when taking into consideration, it helps as there arent many teams ahead of LSU on the graph and the graph basically shows that they are recruiting and playing at a high level despite the early entrants. remember though, bama had many early entrants too.


This post was edited on 12/17/14 at 10:27 am
Posted by TDTGodfather
Baton Rouge
Member since Dec 2007
6169 posts
Posted on 12/17/14 at 10:26 am to
quote:

that said I'd obviously rather be in the blue than the red at any given point. It's pretty telling that Oregon and Stanford are so far into the blue, and both coaches who coached them to that point are in the NFL now....

good point. though when taking into account the two conference differences in strength it makes the sec teams look more impressive imo.
This post was edited on 12/17/14 at 10:27 am
Posted by cas4t
Member since Jan 2010
70922 posts
Posted on 12/17/14 at 10:30 am to
quote:

though when taking into account the two conference differences in strength it makes the sec teams look more impressive imo.


absolutely. not to mention I bet right before this season LSU was in the blue. 10 consistent wins has to put you in a category of 'better on the field'
Posted by TDTGodfather
Baton Rouge
Member since Dec 2007
6169 posts
Posted on 12/17/14 at 10:31 am to
quote:

This makes me actually at the Miles detractors. It PROVES two things: that they are wrong when they say that he under uses or under develops talent, and that they are clearly Bamasessed.

here's the thing about bama. the secret behind their success is that they/saban recruit better than everyone and it isn't that close. better talent = better results.

you could almost make a better argument that bama should never lose a game as opposed to Miles has done a poor job here.

but the fact remains the SEC is a slaughterhouse and bama has thrived in it and it's more than impressive.
Posted by dgnx6
Baton Rouge
Member since Feb 2006
68690 posts
Posted on 12/17/14 at 10:33 am to
I didn't read all that, does it take into account a team playing 3-4 teams ranked in the top 10 of recruiting every year?

I like how we are above FSU though. And people would trade miles for jimbo in a heart beat. They out recruit us almost every cycle and still find ways to lose to nc state, wake Forrest and uva.

We've also played 12 of those teams bunched up at the top under Miles. If you include Wisconsin that is 13.
This post was edited on 12/17/14 at 10:43 am
Posted by Dr. Shultz
Baton Rouge, La
Member since Jun 2013
6391 posts
Posted on 12/17/14 at 10:33 am to
Correct me if I'm wrong..

But Bama having #1 recruiting classes like the last 7 years and only having 3 championships is actually underachieving..

AMIRITE?!
Posted by TDTGodfather
Baton Rouge
Member since Dec 2007
6169 posts
Posted on 12/17/14 at 10:36 am to
quote:

Correct me if I'm wrong..

But Bama having #1 recruiting classes like the last 7 years and only having 3 championships is actually underachieving..

AMIRITE?!

a reasonable person would say no. but the premise isn't flawed.
however if we were in their place: 7 top classes and 3 NC's i wonder if our fans would think the coach has got to go?
Posted by Danny Woodhead
Member since Oct 2013
694 posts
Posted on 12/17/14 at 10:40 am to
Nothing succeeds like success
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