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re: Did anyone catch the Jon Stewart and Oreilly debate on white privilege?
Posted on 10/20/14 at 8:57 pm to Big Scrub TX
Posted on 10/20/14 at 8:57 pm to Big Scrub TX
i'm not going to say whites are better than blacks, but if "white privilege" includes positive cultural traits (like 2-parent households), then what is being implied is that "white culture" (if you're calling that a white trait) is just superior to "black culture", implicitly. that's a major issue (and a reason why i keep asking for a definition)
that's the fine line you walk with these discussions. the whole "subtle racism of lowered expectations"
asians were restricted in property ownership in many areas of the west, too
that's the fine line you walk with these discussions. the whole "subtle racism of lowered expectations"
quote:
FOR INSTANCE: blacks were intentionally excluded from home ownership for the majority of the 20th century
asians were restricted in property ownership in many areas of the west, too
This post was edited on 10/20/14 at 8:59 pm
2
Posted on 10/20/14 at 9:00 pm to SlowFlowPro
quote:
huge spike (among all groups, by by far the most with black people) in the early 60s
It is the largest absolute spike, but I'm not sure its the largest relative increase. For whatever reason, every single race has increased significantly in the last 60yrs or so.
Posted on 10/20/14 at 9:07 pm to SlowFlowPro
Lets pretend white privilege DOES exist and lets take 10,000 people, 5000 black and 5000 white, and pick the top 1000(the top 10%) contributing members to society in todays America. Will it consist of 500 of each racial group? If not, what is the percentage? Is it 90% white and 10% black? 60/40? 30/70? If your % is biased towards whites how much of that is "white privilege"?
Posted on 10/20/14 at 9:08 pm to onmymedicalgrind
quote:
For whatever reason,
Government replacing the family unit
Posted on 10/20/14 at 9:11 pm to lsu480
quote:
lsu480
What is your reason for why blacks, on average, underachieve in this country? Are black people born with lower cognitive capacity? Is it all cultural upbringing? If so, why is the cultural upbringing poor? Are you a believer in the theory that historical context has anything to do with what is going on today? Just wondering
Posted on 10/20/14 at 9:29 pm to onmymedicalgrind
quote:
What is your reason for why blacks, on average, underachieve in this country? Are black people born with lower cognitive capacity? Is it all cultural upbringing? If so, why is the cultural upbringing poor? Are you a believer in the theory that historical context has anything to do with what is going on today? Just wondering
I think all races are different since people evolved over thousands of years in different environments and that is the #1 reason some races are better at certain things. For example if you took 100 asian 10yr olds and had them race a 100 yard dash against 100 black 10yr olds I would bet BIG money the black kids would win. If you did the same thing but with math I would bet on the asian kids. I think races are just different and some are well suited for modern society and some are not. I mean I am white "Christian" male and I will admit Jews are WWWAAAYYY better at business than we are, Blacks are more athletic and Asians are smarter with math. IDK why it is bad to say some races are better at certain things than other and we are not all the same. Of course there are dumb asians and fast white people so its not fair to judge people only on race but to say all races are EXACTLY the same just isn't true IME.
Posted on 10/20/14 at 9:36 pm to lsu480
I agree with many here that say growing up in a single family household or not will effect your odds of success moving forth.
Speaking from experience. From around the time I was 13-14 years old when my mom and father got a divorce. It was night and day to how our financial and discipline situations were after that divorce back then. I could've used a Father around during my teenage years without question. My Mom worked her tail-off, and when I could I needed to work to help too, but doing all this still changed everything for us. Family changed while we never got to spend actual time together anymore like we did beforehand. It effected things and I only experienced a taste of what a single child experiences throughout their whole childhood. I can only imagine what growing up without two parents was like, and anyone who succeeds raising a child alone. I tip my hat to you.
Whether you're black, white, yellow, blue, green or purple. The vulnerability that comes with growing up within a single family household knows no color. I don't think anyone should stay in bad situations, but having kids changes the importance of ones needs. Unless you're in physical, mental, or mortal danger. One should probably try to make things workout before sentencing a kid to a one parent household the rest of their life is all I'm saying. Sure seems divorce is the answer way to easily these days, and divorce has replaced hanging up the phone in anger that fighting couples used to do. Shoot, maybe people are getting married way to early is why there's so many divorces now. Who knows? All I'm trying to say is having a healthy America increases with having healthy Family's throughout the Country. Before one has kids, it's probably best one makes sure they're in it for the long haul. It'd be good if the rat race would slow down a little. So family time could increase some, but that's another long story.
Speaking from experience. From around the time I was 13-14 years old when my mom and father got a divorce. It was night and day to how our financial and discipline situations were after that divorce back then. I could've used a Father around during my teenage years without question. My Mom worked her tail-off, and when I could I needed to work to help too, but doing all this still changed everything for us. Family changed while we never got to spend actual time together anymore like we did beforehand. It effected things and I only experienced a taste of what a single child experiences throughout their whole childhood. I can only imagine what growing up without two parents was like, and anyone who succeeds raising a child alone. I tip my hat to you.
Whether you're black, white, yellow, blue, green or purple. The vulnerability that comes with growing up within a single family household knows no color. I don't think anyone should stay in bad situations, but having kids changes the importance of ones needs. Unless you're in physical, mental, or mortal danger. One should probably try to make things workout before sentencing a kid to a one parent household the rest of their life is all I'm saying. Sure seems divorce is the answer way to easily these days, and divorce has replaced hanging up the phone in anger that fighting couples used to do. Shoot, maybe people are getting married way to early is why there's so many divorces now. Who knows? All I'm trying to say is having a healthy America increases with having healthy Family's throughout the Country. Before one has kids, it's probably best one makes sure they're in it for the long haul. It'd be good if the rat race would slow down a little. So family time could increase some, but that's another long story.
Posted on 10/20/14 at 9:36 pm to lsu480
quote:
I think all races are different since people evolved over thousands of years in different environments and that is the #1 reason some races are better at certain things. For example if you took 100 asian 10yr olds and had them race a 100 yard dash against 100 black 10yr olds I would bet BIG money the black kids would win. If you did the same thing but with math I would bet on the asian kids. I think races are just different and some are well suited for modern society and some are not. I mean I am white "Christian" male and I will admit Jews are WWWAAAYYY better at business than we are, Blacks are more athletic and Asians are smarter with math. IDK why it is bad to say some races are better at certain things than other and we are not all the same. Of course there are dumb asians and fast white people so its not fair to judge people only on race but to say all races are EXACTLY the same just isn't true IME.
I hear you, but are you saying this is a hereditary/genetic thing, or cultural thing? I've seen alot of child births, and I am waiting for my first child to exit the womb doing algebra, Asian or otherwise.
Posted on 10/20/14 at 9:39 pm to onmymedicalgrind
Its genetic IMO
Posted on 10/20/14 at 9:39 pm to lsu480
quote:
Its genetic IMO
So you believe in white privilege then?
Posted on 10/20/14 at 9:45 pm to onmymedicalgrind
quote:
So you believe in white privilege then?
Not by the definition these guys are using.
Posted on 10/20/14 at 9:59 pm to SlowFlowPro
quote:
asians were restricted in property ownership in many areas of the west, too
Perhaps, but in no way near the scale of blacks.
Posted on 10/20/14 at 10:08 pm to lsu480
quote:
Not by the definition these guys are using.
Yea what you are arguing for is a much more significant, less subtle "white privilege." Interesting.
Posted on 10/20/14 at 10:17 pm to onmymedicalgrind
I am just saying that should be included in the discussion.
Posted on 10/20/14 at 10:33 pm to onmymedicalgrind
quote:First off, the good news is your "professional" premise is off.
But my point, or rather my inquiry, is much more subtle: does a young black professional have to be particularly careful and avoid certain things/behaviors to keep his "professional image" in tact in ways different than a young indian or young white professional?
I was joking earlier about the earring, but not in terms of uniformity of perception.
The expectation of physicians from an appearance stance is conservative, meticulous, trustworthy. Just the way it is. If you think I am going to convey the same confidence at bedside clothed in jeans and a tee shirt as I will in a crisply laundered white coat and tie, you're sorely mistaken. Has nothing to do with race. If an Indian male or any other person shows up bejeweled, dressed, or acting in an odd way, it conveys a different impression.
The concern I have when I hear anecdotes like yours or 'strongsafety's' is how do you filter life's normal setbacks/conflicts, from those with a racial basis. Is everything racial? Is anything racial. My suggestion is to do what it sounds like you've done. Forget color and analyse culpability. Do you have some culpability? If so own it, fix it, and move on. Set presumptions of race aside, and solve the problem for yourself independent of race.
Not an altruistic approach. It's pure personal pragmatism. If race was not the issue, but you assume it was, you're not helping yourself. In fact you've probably hurt yourself. If race was involved, you've got to move thru the challenge anyway.
All that is more generally directed advice, than to you in specific. One doesn't achieve what you have without possessing a strong sense as to how to persevere. Certainly, you've been there; done that.
Posted on 10/20/14 at 10:40 pm to onmymedicalgrind
quote:
. But my point, or rather my inquiry, is much more subtle: does a young black professional have to be particularly careful and avoid certain things/behaviors to keep his "professional image" in tact in ways different than a young indian or young white professional?
Hell yes you do! ESPECIALLY if you have a name that is not "white". If you are a black kid with a name in med school like Barkevious and you get arrested for DUI you are frickED! If you are a jewish kid named Ira in med school and you get a DUI its no big deal and THAT is the analogy John Stewart should have used.
Posted on 10/20/14 at 10:42 pm to SlowFlowPro
quote:Track those numbers by income instead. You'll likely see similar patterns.
When you look at median race income differences, I suspect the argument easily shifts from race to income. The chicken-or-egg question remaining is does poverty cause OOWB's, or do OOWB's cause poverty?
Posted on 10/20/14 at 10:45 pm to lsu480
quote:Completely, totally, 100% false BTW. But it sure sounds good.
kid with a name in med school like Barkevious and you get arrested for DUI you are frickED! If you are a jewish kid named Ira in med school and you get a DUI its no big deal and THAT is the analogy John Stewart should have used.
Posted on 10/20/14 at 10:46 pm to NC_Tigah
quote:
Track those numbers by income instead. You'll likely see similar patterns.
When you look at median race income differences, I suspect the argument easily shifts from race to income. The chicken-or-egg question remaining is does poverty cause OOWB's, or do OOWB's cause poverty?
According the the book the Bell Curve, and most other studies, a chart of IQ levels would look very similar to that. I am not saying science it right but thats what it says.
Posted on 10/20/14 at 10:49 pm to NC_Tigah
quote:
Completely, totally, 100% false BTW. But it sure sounds good.
bullshite! I know it feels good to think that but come on, its true! When MOST people are signing up for insurance at work and have to pick a doctor would they pick Ira Goldstein or Barkevious Jackson? If you think it would be 50-50 you are high. If you really want to help fight bigotry we need to be honest and people are bigots when it comes to things like that.
This post was edited on 10/20/14 at 10:51 pm
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