re: Did anyone catch the Jon Stewart and Oreilly debate on white privilege?

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When you've done all that was asked of you, that still isn't enlugh...then what?

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Then you hold your head high and demand accountability. The challenge in doing so is to avoid inappropriately impacting others with the exact same type slights, the exact stereotypical assumptions you've found personally hurtful (or at least impactful).

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Whether you like them or not, smart men of their statures wouldn't risk their offices which fake tales of discrimination.

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Those are poor examples you've given. Barack Obama is a known liar. I certainly would not put it past Obama to make up stories of discrimination. He lied about his mother's insurance, he lied about his relationship with Ayers, and he lied on dozens of occasions about Obamacare.

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The one thing I don't think folks like Stewart can answer is "How do we fix white privilege?". He admits in the debate that modern white privilege is simply the residue of racist policies half a century ago. You can't legally fix residue of any law.

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Perhaps a good start would be simply to acknowledge it.

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1) A black baby has only a 25% chance of being born to a married women.

2) Blacks, from 1980 to 2011, committed 53% of the homicides in America, despite only making up 14% of the general population.

That first stat, in my view, is the single most embarrassing, shameful, tragic, disgusting stat in the western world, and it has nothing, nada, zilch to do with white privilege. It was a New York democrat in the 1960s who noticed that tragic trend of black fatherless children, and the report he published was spit on by the black community and the democratic party.

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Why can't any of these be also the result of "residue"?

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What upsets onmymedicalgrind, myself and other high achieving minorities is that our success doesn't always equal equal treatment.

and what I mean is this--blacks have been told for hundreds of years that if they just assimilate, work hard, and essentially follow the majorities law of the land/behavior, that we will be granted colorblindness by whites.

Seriously this stuff dates back to slaves, and at every corner, whether it was Dred Scott, plessy vs ferguson, brown vs Topeka, etc, well to blacks, that had "followed" the rules were reminded that they are black and will not be seen as equals in the eyes of the majority.

For people that pride themselves in what they have achieved and built inspite of their unwanted social position (building this country), they see this as disheartening and hurtful.

When you've done all that was asked of you, that still isn't enlugh...then what?

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i don't doubt you've felt that your skin color has lead to certain interactions. and your skin color alone may have led to certain interactions

i think the issue you're always going to run into is that your default reaction to being ostracized will be an assumption of racial causation. white people, ESPECIALLY poor white people who have faced similar judgments that you have, will always have an issue with that.

i grew up poor and befriended a bunch of rich kids. other than one family, i STILL feel uneasy going to their parents houses for events. no matter what i do, i'm always going to be an outsider to these people. i'm always, even as an adult, worried i'll break something and be told not to come back. or that i eat something i'm not supposed to, or do it in the wrong way, and i'll become a joke and won't be asked back

frick, i have the misfortune to not be raised as trashy, either, so i have similar issues there, too

class "privilege" certainly exists at a much more pervasive level than any privilege based on race

i don't doubt that you may have run into a few very random scenarios based solely on race, but i think you have a self delusion/narrative that will always default to race, even if it isn't based on race. this goes back to the OMMG's comment about earrings: the OT will call white males with earrings trashy faster than black guys with earrings.

But that is exactly what I was hinting at. Why is it not race? Why can it not be?

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and what I mean is this--blacks have been told for hundreds of years that if they just assimilate, work hard, and essentially follow the majorities law of the land/behavior, that we will be granted colorblindness by whites.

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I think you are conflating two different issues, SS; and causing yourself unwarranted upset/pain. "Equal treatment" - in regard to the white guy on the street profiling Black individuals who disproportionately exhibit anti-white attitudes, believe that Society undervalues them because of color and not character/productivity...and the fact that stats show that Blacks commit crimes at a significantly higher percent - should not be realistically expected in such a scenario. Common sense does not judge all scenarios to be equal. They aren't.

Profiling is common-sense a fact of life; reading the tea leaves and acting accordingly in order to make rational choices toward survival and prosperity is exactly what you and I do. And to a great extent, genes (Nature) rule...with Nurture (upbringing circumstances) holding equal weight, in the intellectual act of discernment.

We are all off-the-cuff pre-judged in relation to the group (actions/beliefs) of which we are outwardly perceived to be a member of. This is Genetic...and it ain't going away no time soon...nws the future option of highly-problematic genetic engineering. The best way for a good person to dodge the "upset" and help make this (prejudicial, pre-judgment) hurtful attitude go away, is to exhibit exceptional character in belief and action. Book it...you'll win the admiration of them who really count. And most of all...your own peace of mind and satisfaction...regardless what the yahoos think of do.

A prime example of the transformative and winning power of superior character is exhibited in the hands-down Board favorite. BHP. Pilot may not believe in Jesus - the philosophy of active Love and tolerance - but he damn sure reflects it. And changes the World. One word at a time.

Good luck. Or God speed. Whichever.

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Why is it not race? Why can it not be?

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it certainly can be

but i honestly don't think a person with your disposition will truly understand that cornball white people get fricked with, too. i'm not saying it's b/c we're white, or that it never happens to you b/c you're black, but white people who have faced similar issues will have a hard time hearing that your similar issue was solely b/c of your race. if that's true, why the hell did we get treated the same being white?

it's like i said earlier, cornball white people get scared around white trash. white people judge white trash the same as they judge black trash. we all also judge people who have looks that we associate with white trash, solely by these variables. culture matters a lot more than color.

honest question: who do you think a cornball white guy will avoid first:

this guy



or this guy

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honest question: who do you think a cornball white guy will avoid first:

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Nobody is arguing with you on this dichotomy you are setting up ("battered woman" redneck vs. Carlton), obviously the first guy will be avoided. But my point, or rather my inquiry, is much more subtle: does a young black professional have to be particularly careful and avoid certain things/behaviors to keep his "professional image" in tact in ways different than a young indian or young white professional? I don't know the answer to that question, but what I do know is that I don't take "risks" that I see other people of other race more willing to take.

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when blacks were facing legitimate institutional racism, the rate was basically flipped around. you can't claim that racism led to blacks engaging in this behavior when as racism decreased, teh behavior increased. it also didn't really skyrocket until another, non-racial variable was created (welfare-medicaid)

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Which year did blacks "stop facing legitimate institutional racism"?

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as the media ever considered the fact that whites are ahead of blacks because they are just "better" as a race when it comes to dealing with modern society? Everything I read about why whites have the advantage gives excuses for black people like lots are poor, the police are hard on them, they grow up without fathers, they dont get the same level of schooling etc. Why don't people ever wonder if they are not as capable of competing in modern America. Is it because they would be called racist or is because its not a possibility?

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It's certainly possible. OR, more plausibly, it has to do with literal centuries of institutional, violent mistreatment, disenfranchisement and intimidation. FOR INSTANCE: blacks were intentionally excluded from home ownership for the majority of the 20th century. Home ownership has formed the backbone of middle-class wealth creation over that same time period. Yet when blacks show up with less wealth after all of that, they are blamed for it. (And the ultimate slap in the face is they are then blamed for creating the financial crisis because they took out risky loans.)