I've got time to kill, how about more tactics? Bayern vs BVB | Page 2 | TigerDroppings.com

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re: I've got time to kill, how about more tactics? Bayern vs BVB


quote:

the article was talking about all the number 10s Pellegrini has used to great effect.


andres d'alessandro






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acgeaux129
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re: I've got time to kill, how about more tactics? Bayern vs BVB


What did Muller play in his breakout in the WC? Seemed like a CAM or possibly a very withdrawn CF to me. Also how much did he play CM under Jupp?





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hendersonshands
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re: I've got time to kill, how about more tactics? Bayern vs BVB


Right wing but he drifts inside frequently. He never played center mid.





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hendersonshands
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re: I've got time to kill, how about more tactics? Bayern vs BVB


LINK /


Good read on the tactics from the game.






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crazy4lsu
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re: I've got time to kill, how about more tactics? Bayern vs BVB


quote:

Good read on the tactics from the game.



Interesting read.

Do you think in possession based teams we are going to see the end of the Makelele type DM? I noticed Thiago was the deepest midfielder, and while not unusual for a passer of his mold, Muller and Kroos aren't exactly great protection.

The reason I theorize this is that possession based sides have to worry much less about breaking up opposition play as much as they are interested in holding possession. Busquets is an amazing player in this regard, as he has amazing technique for a player over 6 foot, thus he can foul tactically and he can recycle attacks.

Arsenal, Man U, and other teams have gotten by without a DM. I don't think we will see the position die out, but I think good sides will only employ them against teams that offer them a direct threat.







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crazy4lsu
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re: I've got time to kill, how about more tactics? Bayern vs BVB


Also, how did the Gundogan-Sahin-Bender triangle work? Gundogan and Sahin will be an interesting partnership.





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hendersonshands
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re: I've got time to kill, how about more tactics? Bayern vs BVB


quote:

Do you think in possession based teams we are going to see the end of the Makelele type DM



I think that writeup kind of alludes to it. However, Bayern is going to have a hard time in the Bundesliga this year without a DM. Most Bundi teams play a 4-2-3-1 which means most are pretty adept at counter attacking. The 4-1-4-1 without a ball winner is going to be very susceptible to the counter.

quote:

I noticed Thiago was the deepest midfielder, and while not unusual for a passer of his mold, Muller and Kroos aren't exactly great protection.


Hopefully that's the last time we see that. Thiago has great passing range but his positioning is nowhere near good enough yet to be the deepest man in the midfield, especially if the other two guys aren't providing much cover.

quote:

Busquets is an amazing player in this regard, as he has amazing technique for a player over 6 foot, thus he can foul tactically and he can recycle attacks.



Busquets is the guy who makes Barca work, IMO. I think Bayern has a guy like that in Javi, I still don't know if we're playing him at DM or CB. I hope it's DM.


I think the best XI Bayern can put out with a 4-1-4-1 is:

---------------------------- Neuer --------------------------------

Lahm ------------ Dante -------- Boateng ---------------- Alaba

--------------------------- Javi ---------------------------------------

Robben -------- Schweiny ---- Thiago/Kroos/Gotze ------- Ribery

--------------------------- Muller ------------------------------------




Tweezy and I have talked about this some. We agree that Mandzukic is not the striker you want if you expect him to drift wide to allow Ribery space in the middle. I think Muller would be perfect for that.

Schweinsteiger has a natural inclination to drop back anyway, so he'd provide passing support for Martinez and Thiago has shown that he's willing to receive the ball deep, so it would look a lot like a double pivot with the other pushing forward.

I also think Gotze can play either wing and as a striker so I'm ready to see him on the field.






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hendersonshands
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re: I've got time to kill, how about more tactics? Bayern vs BVB


quote:

Also, how did the Gundogan-Sahin-Bender triangle work? Gundogan and Sahin will be an interesting partnership.



Gundogan is really, really good. Seriously, he's one of the best 3 or 4 players in the entire league. I wasn't very impressed with Sahin to be honest and Kehl came on at half time so I don't know. BVB is very smart in their buildup play though and Gundogan positions himself so well, it's impressive to watch.

I don't think they'll miss Gotze all that much. Mkhitaryan was looking real good before he got hurt, Gundogan can play CAM, Reus can play it too now that they have Aubemayang who, by the way, is fast as frick.






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crazy4lsu
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re: I've got time to kill, how about more tactics? Bayern vs BVB


I forgot about Javi. He's the closest player to Busquets. He might even be better than him. It's insane when you have players of that size and technical ability. Gustavo is no slouch in that regard either, but I think he may be 'Yaya Toure'd' by Guardiola.

In some ways I think the 4-1-4-1 is the perfect counter to the 4-2-3-1, with the triangle inverted. It might be more difficult for the latter as both of the deepest midfielders in the double pivot face forward midfielders, losing the spare man advantage.






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crazy4lsu
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re: I've got time to kill, how about more tactics? Bayern vs BVB


Klopp did a great job developing Gundogan, who was fairly ineffective when we faced him in the CL two years ago. In that time he's become one of the best midfielders in the world. I thought he was more important to that Dortmund team than Goetze to be honest.


This post was edited on 7/29 at 11:51 pm


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hendersonshands
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re: I've got time to kill, how about more tactics? Bayern vs BVB


Yeah, I think I see the writing on the wall for Goose and I really don't like it because I think he's very underrated. I think he'd do great in the PL.

quote:

In some ways I think the 4-1-4-1 is the perfect counter to the 4-2-3-1, with the triangle inverted. It might be more difficult for the latter as both of the deepest midfielders in the double pivot face forward midfielders, losing the spare man advantage.



I think it offers a lot of flexibility but I think that you have to have a DM in order to counter the 4-2-3-1. The article articulated what I was trying to say better about Bayern's positioning on Gundogan's goal. Javi would have broken that attack up or at least disrupted it enough to where he can't put that shot on target so easily.






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hendersonshands
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re: I've got time to kill, how about more tactics? Bayern vs BVB


quote:

Klopp did a great job developing Gundogan, who was fairly ineffective when we faced him in the CL two years ago. In that time he's become one of the best midfielders in the world.



When Dortmund bought Gundogan, he was a good attacking mid who struggled as a DLP, now he's the second best behind Schweinsteiger.

quote:

I thought he was more important to that Dortmund team than Goetze to be honest.


There's no doubt in my mind.






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