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Anonymous Xbox engineer explains DRM and Microsoft's Xbox One intentions

Posted on 6/14/13 at 7:33 am
Posted by stout
Smoking Crack with Hunter Biden
Member since Sep 2006
167101 posts
Posted on 6/14/13 at 7:33 am
I am posting this again because the thread last night got hijacked, it had zero highlights of what the engineer said in the OP and because it also validates a lot of what I have said all week in regards to you have to kill the used game market for pricing and the whole industry to move forward.

quote:

>The thing is we suck at telling the story. The whole point of the DRM switch from disc based to cloud based is to kill disc swapping, scratched discs, bringing discs to friends house, trade-ins for shite value with nothign going back to developers, and high game costs. If you want games cheaper then 59.99, you have to limit used games somehow. Steam's model requires a limited used game model.


quote:

>The thing is, the DRM is really really similar to steam... You can login anywhere and play your games, anyone in your house can play with the family xbox. The only diff is steam you have to sign in before playing, and Xbox does it automatically at night for you (once per 24 hours)


quote:

>Think about it, on steam you get a game for the true cost of the game, 5$-30$. On a console you have to pay for that PLUS any additional licenses for when you sell / trade / borrow / etc. If the developer / publisher can't get it on additional licenses (like steam), then they charge the first person more. [...] If we say "Hey publishers, you limit game to 39.99, we ensure every license transfer you get 10$, gamestop gets 20$" that is a decent model... Microsoft gets a license fee on first and subsequent game purchases, compared to just first now? That's a revenue increase.


quote:

>Everyone and their mother complains about how gamestop fricks them on their trade ins, getting 5$ for their used games. We come in trying to find a way to take money out of gamestop, and put some in developers and get you possibly cheaper games and everyone bitches at MS. Well, if you want the @#$@ing from Gamestop, go play PS4.


This is pretty true. A lot of people, even bigtime PS4 fanboys on this site, hated Gamestop for this practice and not all of a sudden they love them. LOL

quote:

>The goal is to move to digital downloads, but Gamestop, Walmart, Target, Amazon are KIND OF frickING ENTRENCHED in the industry. They have a lot of power, and the shift has to be gradual. Long term goal is steam for consoles. [...] If you always want to stay with what you have, then keep current consoles, or a PS4. We're TRYING to move the industry forwards towards digital distribution... it's a bumpy road


Like I have been saying, those retailers are going to do their best to keep the used game market which in turn keeps the new game prices artificially inflated.

quote:

>The cloud capabilities is the shite they like the most. We basically made a huge cloud compute shite and made it free. What people are doing with it is kind of cool. THe original intention was to get all the Multiplayer servers not requiring 3rd party costs (Like EA shutting down game servers to cut costs), as well as taking all the games that servers hosted by the clients (Halo, etc), and have all that compute done in the cloud allowing more CPU cycles for gameplay. That will really expand what developers can do. Anything that doesn't need per frame calculation and can handle 100ms delays can be shifted to the cloud. That's huge.



Just some highlights to share, ponder, and discuss. You can read the rest of it here.
This post was edited on 6/14/13 at 7:35 am
Posted by Scruffy
Kansas City
Member since Jul 2011
72023 posts
Posted on 6/14/13 at 7:39 am to
The more I hear about it, the more Xbox One makes sense. I'm still leaning PS4 due to price and a few other reasons, but it's not so black and white anymore.

Microsoft needs to fire their entire PR dept. because they failed miserably.
Posted by stout
Smoking Crack with Hunter Biden
Member since Sep 2006
167101 posts
Posted on 6/14/13 at 7:41 am to
quote:

Microsoft needs to fire their entire PR dept. because they failed miserably.



Pretty much. I feel like if they would have said some of the things this engineer did from the start everyone would be excited about the potential instead of the mass confusion that is out there about it all.
Posted by AUCE05
Member since Dec 2009
42557 posts
Posted on 6/14/13 at 7:44 am to
quote:

stout


Don't worry. The sheeple will be in here asap to post the amazon vote. Great interview. I've been wanting a steam system on the consoles for a while. It just makes sense.
Posted by AUCE05
Member since Dec 2009
42557 posts
Posted on 6/14/13 at 7:44 am to
quote:

Microsoft needs to fire their entire PR dept. because they failed miserably.
Posted by hiltacular
NYC
Member since Jan 2011
19667 posts
Posted on 6/14/13 at 7:44 am to
If I am reading that correctly, we can expect xbox games to NOT cost $59.99?

ETA why the hell did MS not come out and say "hey no more trading games bla bla bla but oh by the way they are only going to cost you $39.99 initially"
This post was edited on 6/14/13 at 7:46 am
Posted by Scruffy
Kansas City
Member since Jul 2011
72023 posts
Posted on 6/14/13 at 7:46 am to
Truth. I also wish they offered a non-Kinect version. Would be more within my price range and I'm not much of a fan of motion gaming anyway. I move enough at work during the day.
Posted by taylork37
Member since Mar 2010
15319 posts
Posted on 6/14/13 at 7:46 am to
quote:

ETA why the hell did MS not come out and say "hey no more trading games bla bla bla but oh by the way they are only going to cost you $39.99"


Because if the market is going to evolve into all DD it is going to take some time.
Posted by hiltacular
NYC
Member since Jan 2011
19667 posts
Posted on 6/14/13 at 7:47 am to
quote:

Truth. I also wish they offered a non-Kinect version. Would be more within my price range and I'm not much of a fan of motion gaming anyway. I move enough at work during the day.


I have said this on a few different boards. the only thing that turns me off about the xb1 is this kinect feature that i am NEVER going to use
Posted by hiltacular
NYC
Member since Jan 2011
19667 posts
Posted on 6/14/13 at 7:47 am to
quote:

Because if the market is going to evolve into all DD it is going to take some time.


lol so we are paying $59.99 so that games in the future can cost $39.99?
Posted by stout
Smoking Crack with Hunter Biden
Member since Sep 2006
167101 posts
Posted on 6/14/13 at 7:48 am to
Eventually. It won't happen over night like he says but that is where they want to go. That is why they are going to limit the used games market on the One in hopes that if publishers sale more new games because of the limited used games market that the publishers will lower prices to balance it all out.

It's exactly why you get games so cheap on Steam as he says.
Posted by hiltacular
NYC
Member since Jan 2011
19667 posts
Posted on 6/14/13 at 7:49 am to
I get it but at the same time, why don't they just commit to this entire idea and change the whole landscape by making the move and lowering costs??
Posted by LSUSaintsFan86
Baton Rouge
Member since Dec 2009
2294 posts
Posted on 6/14/13 at 7:49 am to
I just don't see how MS dropped the ball so badly.... I mean why not use this as your main marketing tool???
Posted by stout
Smoking Crack with Hunter Biden
Member since Sep 2006
167101 posts
Posted on 6/14/13 at 7:49 am to
quote:

lol so we are paying $59.99 so that games in the future can cost $39.99?



Nope.

You are going to be limited on the amount of times a game can be resold so games in the future will cost less.
Posted by ShoeBang
Member since May 2012
19348 posts
Posted on 6/14/13 at 7:51 am to
"well when you explain it that way, Paw...."

Not as "do not want" anymore. Still going PS4 because of the better (imo) exclusive titles, but I get it.

I have 6mbs internets at home. Six...SIX...in 2013. I got 6 in 2003 with Cox in Lafayette.... TEN frickING YEARS AGO Why? Because that's all CenturySuck offers at my address. The cable company only goes to 3mbs. Disc based games are almost a must for me.
Posted by stout
Smoking Crack with Hunter Biden
Member since Sep 2006
167101 posts
Posted on 6/14/13 at 7:53 am to
quote:

Truth. I also wish they offered a non-Kinect version. Would be more within my price range and I'm not much of a fan of motion gaming anyway. I move enough at work during the day.



Reading about the Kinect 2.0 shows that it is more than just motion control this time around so maybe they don't want to limit devs by saying now EVERY console has a Kinect so you can plan your games around that.
Posted by The Sad Banana
The gate is narrow.
Member since Jul 2008
89498 posts
Posted on 6/14/13 at 7:54 am to
You know, just because I'm getting a PS4 does not mean I'm a PS fanboy. And for someone who is all about master race PC flame wars, you really are giving this way more attention than I figured you would. The information is good, though.
Posted by stout
Smoking Crack with Hunter Biden
Member since Sep 2006
167101 posts
Posted on 6/14/13 at 7:55 am to
quote:

I get it but at the same time, why don't they just commit to this entire idea and change the whole landscape by making the move and lowering costs??


quote:

>The goal is to move to digital downloads, but Gamestop, Walmart, Target, Amazon are KIND OF frickING ENTRENCHED in the industry. They have a lot of power, and the shift has to be gradual. Long term goal is steam for consoles. [...] If you always want to stay with what you have, then keep current consoles, or a PS4. We're TRYING to move the industry forwards towards digital distribution... it'sa bumpy road

>Publishers have enourmous power. Microsoft is trying to balance between consumer delight, and publisher wishes. If we cave to far in either direction you have a non-starting product. WiiU goes too far to consumer, you have no 3rd party support to shake a stick at. PS4 is status-quo. XB1 is trying to push some things, at the expense of others. We have a vision, we'll see if it works in the coming years


It's going to take some time. Steam didn't happen over night either as he stated

quote:

>It's a long tail strategy, just like steam. Steam had it's growing pains at the beginning with all it's drm shite as well. [...] For digital downloads steam had no real competition at the time, they were competing against boxed sales. At the time people were pretty irate about steam, (on 4chan too...) It was only once they had a digital marketplace with DRM that was locked down to prevent sharing that they could do super discounted shite.

Posted by stout
Smoking Crack with Hunter Biden
Member since Sep 2006
167101 posts
Posted on 6/14/13 at 7:59 am to
quote:

you really are giving this way more attention than I figured you would


I enjoy discussion.

This moves the whole industry forward eventually as well. Consoles make or break PC in a lot of ways because major publishers wouldn't survive without them.

I also think the used games market cripples the industry as a whole and wouldn't mind seeing it die off.

You have to wonder, after reading all of this, how much is the used games market responsible for the rise of DLC too? I mean maybe it forced publishers to seek other revenue streams since they were losing so much to used games.

They are essentially competing with their own products but reap none of the revenue from the used version of it.
This post was edited on 6/14/13 at 8:07 am
Posted by hiltacular
NYC
Member since Jan 2011
19667 posts
Posted on 6/14/13 at 7:59 am to
I get it, I really do.

I just think the majority of people buying their next console will not care what MS is trying to do for the future of gaming... They will see the $100 price difference and inability to buy or sell used games.

MS really needs to come out and explain this "10 family member" thing.
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