Has the government always been so divided? | TigerDroppings.com

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Scruffy
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Member since Jul 2011
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Has the government always been so divided?


Good afternoon ladies and gents. Scruffy here and it is now time for one of the rare and oh so wonderful Scruffy Threads.



Thank you. Thank you. You are too kind.

Well, Scruffy is in need of some answers and he comes to gain some knowledge from the brightest minds this world has to off.....

*wipes a tear from his eye* Phew, haha, didn't know how much longer Scruffy could keep a straight face.

Now that the pleasantries are out of the way, let's get down to business. Scruffy has only been on this planet for about 25 years. In that short, but epic, span, it appears that Congress and the political parties are polarized to the extreme. Has it always been this way? Compromise seems to be nonexistent now.

Was there a time when the parties worked for the benefit of the country itself, rather than for the advancement of their political parties? Or is Scruffy just romanticizing the past?

What caused Congress and the political parties to reach this level of partisanship? Mass media maybe?

Help a lowly janitor out.



This post was edited on 11/29 at 12:52 pm



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TrueTiger
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re: Has the government always been so divided?


I don't have that many more years personal observation experience than you do. I don't recall it being this bad in the 90s. From the history books its doesn't look this bad back in the 1940s, 1950s and 60s either. Apparently there were some rough spots in the 30s.

Could it be worse? Its looks like it was quite a bit more worse in the 1850s and 1860.

I'm sure you wanted more but we'll have to see who might want to contribute.






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TupeloTiger
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Member since Jul 2004
2782 posts

re: Has the government always been so divided?


No, it has not been so divided. This is a result of the Special Interest Groups. They have taken over in Washington with their contributions and money. It's too expensive to run for office now. THe unions have become the dominant group with Obama and the Democrats. Then joining with them, SEIU and AFSME, the Trial Lawyers [who do all the lawsuits in Workman's Comp], the AARP,Planned Parenhood, ACORN, Media Matters, George Soros-Socialists/Communists, Gays/Lesbians, Abortionists, and Climate Change Evironmentalists. The Democrats have solidified and hate Republicans. Now, the new thing is to lie about people and groups to get what you want. Selfish. It is a permanent split,there is no hope for America, unless a young witty Ronald Reagan type comes along. Then,he'll be attacked and ruined where no moral,honest,family man will run for office. Only people committed to special inerest groups will run. You did not have this until Obama and the Leftist groups became dominant. You did NOT have this in the 80's and early 90's, I know, I was in it professionally. I remember Dem's and GOP's working together to pass major bills and solve problems. WE voted on all bills and amendments,instead of secret meetings at the White House by Pelosi and Reid. We could bring up any bill or amendment we wanted to. Each vote was only one vote,now you can't bring up anything in the Senate unless you are Democrat. That's not right, it used to not be that way. Reid and Trumka did that.





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BigJim
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re: Has the government always been so divided?


quote:

I don't recall it being this bad in the 90s


before or after the house impeached the president?






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Zach
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Member since May 2005
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re: Has the government always been so divided?


I go back to the 50s and it was not so divided.
In the 60s all hell broke loose. Vietnam, race riots, drugs, sexual revolution, etc. It all happened in a very compressed period of time.

The teenagers of the 60s are now running govt. They have been running the colleges since the 80s.

Thus we get our most divided govt. One might say that the Civil War was more divided but I wasn't around then so I can't give first hand testimony.






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Gmorgan4982
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re: Has the government always been so divided?


quote:

Was there a time when the parties worked for the benefit of the country itself
No






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Gmorgan4982
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re: Has the government always been so divided?


quote:

before or after the house impeached the president?






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goatmilker
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re: Has the government always been so divided?


Born in 1961 Scruffy.
Amature historian and sports nut.

quote:

Has the government always been so divided?


It was much worse early on but one could expect that as the young nation was trying to form parties and figure out our future political structure.
As stated above for reasons we all know 1840-1865 was as divided as you could get.

From 1955-1980 the democrats controled both houses and ran the show. I would say with few media outlets and a weak apathetic republican party that was about as....timid or peaceful a time between the two parties as you are likely ever to see.

I don't think its just one thing that gives us our politics in this age.

"get the money out of politics".
This one always cracks me up. Money and influence ARE politics and has always been so.
"get the lobbiest out".
Same as above but you can get better transparency.
"to much media and its influence".
I want more. We the people just must be better at desseminating it.

Things go in cycles Scruffy and right now both sides as we can all see are sparring over and likely sweeping the budget issue under the rug with both being afraid of being on the wrong side and losing power.

Call them what they are. An entrenched political caste more concerned with aquiring power and holding on to it.

Hope that helps a bit.







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TrueTiger
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re: Has the government always been so divided?


before, that was a widening point for sure but even after that I don't think it was this bad.





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tketaco
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re: Has the government always been so divided?


Perhaps we should at history with the parties that proceeded them. I'm no historian but maybe those parties were so polarized that it caused the two to fall.





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BugAC
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Baton Rouge
Member since Oct 2007
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re: Has the government always been so divided?


quote:

before or after the house impeached the president?


I don't think that shows division. They impeached a president who lied under oath, an impeachable offense. You can argue the merits of the questioning that led to the impeachment, but the act of lying under oath is indefensible.






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elposter
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Member since Dec 2010
7887 posts

re: Has the government always been so divided?


Government got pretty divided in the 1860s I think.





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kingbob
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Member since Nov 2010
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re: Has the government always been so divided?


not always, but quite often





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TigerTattle
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re: Has the government always been so divided?


Question:
quote:

Was there a time when the parties worked for the benefit of the country itself, rather than for the advancement of their political parties
Answer:
quote:

Scruffy just romanticizing the past



I think the sixties may have been as divided. They were definitely more turbulent---Nam, the draft, segregation/integration, Kent State, JFK & MLK assassinations, civil rights, bra burning, hippies & Haight-Ashbury & burgeoning drug culture... You name it, it was an issue, and each brought with it the attendant protests and riots.

But all this was mostly an uprising against government and policies by various groups of citizens. I don't recall as much division between the political leadership then as now, except in the case of integration, and maybe the "Conflict" in Nam.



This post was edited on 11/29 at 3:51 pm


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BigJim
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re: Has the government always been so divided?


quote:

quote:

before or after the house impeached the president?
I don't think that shows division. They impeached a president who lied under oath, an impeachable offense. You can argue the merits of the questioning that led to the impeachment, but the act of lying under oath is indefensible.


By itself- maybe not. But prior to 1994, I think democrats felt comfortably in charge of congress (even if they occasionally lost the senate) and thus didn't worry about negotiating with a permanent minority.

Then, among Ken Starr and all the many, many Clinton scandals comes Newt Gingrich. He purposefully polarized the political atmosphere so republicans could take over congress. And then when they got it, they ran roughshod over the democrats (such as really using the power of the Rules committee). Didn't last, but I think that really changed things.

And not necessarily in ways that were all bad. You think there is no difference between republicans and democrats now, go back prior to the 90s. Newt basically said "small government types over here, liberal/progressives over there." So parties were based more on ideology rather than geography and demographics.






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Zach
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Member since May 2005
63510 posts

re: Has the government always been so divided?


quote:

Things go in cycles

Not really. Govt has always grown. It never shrinks. What you would call a cycle to the right wing is merely a slowing down of the growth of govt power.






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