Started By
Message
locked post

I would like to see a 50/50 4-3/3-4 defense this season.

Posted on 8/2/11 at 11:47 pm
Posted by coldhotwings
Mississippi
Member since Jan 2008
6497 posts
Posted on 8/2/11 at 11:47 pm
We have the personnel and depth now to run more 3-4 than before and still keep guys fresh. We have 2 3-4 starting nose tackles. 2 3-4 starting DE's. Hybrid DE/OLB type in Wilson. Shift Shanle inside as an occasional inside linebacker. Vilma would take less abuse than in a full-time 3-4 scheme. We have about 90% of the puzzle for a base 3-4 team already, why not go 50/50 to confuse the hell out of the opposing offenses.
Posted by Jones
Member since Oct 2005
90500 posts
Posted on 8/2/11 at 11:50 pm to
all i know is that i cant wait for football season to start. our D should be pretty fun to watch this year
Posted by Brettesaurus Rex
Baton Rouge
Member since Dec 2009
38259 posts
Posted on 8/3/11 at 12:00 am to
Don't really think I'd rather have more of our LB's than Dlineman on the field honestly.
Unless Wilson and Casillas show up in a big way. But honestly I like the 43 a lot better.
Posted by fuzzymayo
Member since Jun 2010
256 posts
Posted on 8/3/11 at 12:01 am to
Do you think we have the type of LB depth required for a 3-4? I know we have a lot of LB's, but we don't have a lot of quality LB's.

Another thing worth mentioning is that Vilma was in a 3-4 with NYJ when he got drafted and didn't do so hot. I'm sure he's fine running it to mix things up, but I don't know how happy he'd be if we were running that 50% of the time.
Posted by SaintEB
Member since Jul 2008
22720 posts
Posted on 8/3/11 at 12:01 am to
The 3-4 rendered him ineffective in NY. Big reason for his drop off after his 1st two seasons. Vilma is undersized for MLB and has trouble shedding blocks from big olinemen. It's probably his only weakness. The 3-4 exposes him to those blocks. A good 4-3 dline will keep that from happening and allow him to do what he does......get to the ball. If Rogers and Franklin can eat up blocks, Vilma will have a great year.

ETA: Fuzzy, Vilma was rookie of the year under a 4-3 when he first got to NY. When Mangini got there, he installed the 3-4.
This post was edited on 8/3/11 at 12:03 am
Posted by Brettesaurus Rex
Baton Rouge
Member since Dec 2009
38259 posts
Posted on 8/3/11 at 12:05 am to
quote:

50% of the time.

Way too much IMO. I don't think you can just say alright let's run it half the time. If Williams thinks we can do better with it then let's throw it in a little based on the situation.
But will all of these beastly offseason additions, I don't see how you keep Jordan, Rodgers, and Franklin off the field.
Posted by fuzzymayo
Member since Jun 2010
256 posts
Posted on 8/3/11 at 12:06 am to
Yeah. That sounds about right. I knew he had a big rookie year, because it pissed me off at the time because I had wanted the Saints to draft him.

Didn't realize the 3-4 didn't come in until after he got there. Makes sense.
Posted by Lester Earl
Member since Nov 2003
278380 posts
Posted on 8/3/11 at 12:07 am to
Vilma was hardly ineffective in the 3-4. He just preferred the 4-3. And is better in a 4-3. But he wasnt bad in a 3-4


with that being said, we dont have the LBs to run a 3-4 50% of the time. That is ludicrous
Posted by SaintEB
Member since Jul 2008
22720 posts
Posted on 8/3/11 at 12:11 am to
I stand corrected, Lester. Ineffective is definitely not the case. He had 114 tackles in his first and only year in the 3-4. (169 the previous year). 2007 was his injury year and 2008 is...... Well you know the rest.
Posted by Jones
Member since Oct 2005
90500 posts
Posted on 8/3/11 at 12:20 am to
quote:

Do you think we have the type of LB depth required for a 3-4?


no.


our d-line depth> lb depth
Posted by coldhotwings
Mississippi
Member since Jan 2008
6497 posts
Posted on 8/3/11 at 12:22 am to
quote:

we dont have the LBs to run a 3-4 50% of the time.


That's why I said we are around 90% complete. I wouldn't mind grabbing SD free agents like Stephen Cooper or Antwan Barnes. Rocky Mac played some 3-4 in Washington and people have been crossing their fingers on him coming to NO. Martez Wilson has the body type for an ideal 3-4 OLB and was drafted high enough for us to expect him to be at least a solid contributor. People gripe about how slow Shanle has gotten so let's take a look at him inside. Cal's coach and scouts have said that Cam Jordan is so athletic that he's dropped back into coverage as an OLB before(not that I recommend this).
Posted by LooseCannon22282
Mobile
Member since May 2008
33742 posts
Posted on 8/3/11 at 12:39 am to
quote:

I wouldn't mind grabbing SD free agents like Stephen Cooper or Antwan Barnes. Rocky Mac played some 3-4 in Washington and people have been crossing their fingers on him coming to NO. Martez Wilson has the body type for an ideal 3-4 OLB and was drafted high enough for us to expect him to be at least a solid contributor. People gripe about how slow Shanle has gotten so let's take a look at him inside. Cal's coach and scouts have said that Cam Jordan is so athletic that he's dropped back into coverage as an OLB before(not that I recommend this).



We have signed a good number of DB's so far. Where do they fit in a 3-4 scheme; a LB friendly scheme that is.
This post was edited on 8/3/11 at 12:40 am
Posted by Lester Earl
Member since Nov 2003
278380 posts
Posted on 8/3/11 at 12:49 am to
quote:

. Martez Wilson has the body type for an ideal 3-4 OLB and was drafted high enough for us to expect him to be at least a solid contributor. People gripe about how slow Shanle has gotten so let's take a look at him inside.


IMO our LB's lack the thickness(ILB) and size/athleticism combo(OLB) that most good 3-4 LB's corps have.



last i looked Jordan was pushing 290 and Will Smith wasnt any thinner. If these guys could shed 25 lbs we could prob run it well. Though both could prob survive at DE in a 3-4 at their current size. I dont think they could play LB
Posted by coldhotwings
Mississippi
Member since Jan 2008
6497 posts
Posted on 8/3/11 at 12:51 am to
I don't see how a 4-3 benefits DB's more than a 3-4. There is still a front 7 and 4 DB's in a base formation.

I don't think we signed as many quality DB's as you think. Of all our new DB FA signings, Fabian Washington is the only one who is starter/nickel material. Our two starting CB's can't seem to stay healthy, jury is still out on Robinson, and Patrick is unproven.
This post was edited on 8/3/11 at 12:52 am
Posted by baytiger
Boston
Member since Dec 2007
46978 posts
Posted on 8/3/11 at 12:52 am to
we have 3 DTs that could start for just about any team in the NFL

why only put one of them on the field at a time?
Posted by LSUFreek
Greater New Orleans
Member since Jan 2007
14776 posts
Posted on 8/3/11 at 12:55 am to
One thing is for certain, when we do run a 3-4 (which Williams likes to run in certain packages), we'll have better personnel on the field for it than we have ever had during the Payton era.

With that said, we have the best 4-3 personnel now than we have ever had. Especially with our DTs who are the closest to the opponents QB.
Posted by LooseCannon22282
Mobile
Member since May 2008
33742 posts
Posted on 8/3/11 at 1:04 am to
quote:

I don't think we signed as many quality DB's as you think. Of all our new DB FA signings, Fabian Washington is the only one who is starter/nickel material. Our two starting CB's can't seem to stay healthy, jury is still out on Robinson, and Patrick is unproven.



We have loaded up on the D-line and the secondary more than anything. I don't disagree with mixing up coverages but to say Patrick is unproven and tout Wilson as a 3-4 difference maker who is also a rookie is stupid.
This post was edited on 8/3/11 at 1:08 am
Posted by Lester Earl
Member since Nov 2003
278380 posts
Posted on 8/3/11 at 1:06 am to
reports out of camp is coaches fully expect Robinson to be our 3rd CB
Posted by coldhotwings
Mississippi
Member since Jan 2008
6497 posts
Posted on 8/3/11 at 1:09 am to
I see it as a way to keep the interior fresh. Rogers has had experience playing DE and Ellis could be part of the rotation as a 3-4 NT. Ellis has had a lot of trouble staying healthy in his first 2 seasons due to wear and tear. Rogers and Franklin are both in their 30's so rotating through should reduce injury risk and maintain high performance throughout the season. In a 50/50 split, I can see all three average around 70% of the snaps.
Posted by LSUFreek
Greater New Orleans
Member since Jan 2007
14776 posts
Posted on 8/3/11 at 1:14 am to
When we had Johnson, Glover, Hand, and Howard, we literally had free agent scrub vets at LB & CB. Our DL made them look good cuz they intercepted or deflected inaccurate passes caused by the 4 down linemen pressure, if the QB wasn't sacked first.

Now our secondary and linebackers are light years ahead of that team, so I'm confident even if we lose a Greer or Porter for a game or three, Washington or Robinson or Patrick will still look good.
first pageprev pagePage 1 of 3Next pagelast page

Back to top
logoFollow TigerDroppings for LSU Football News
Follow us on Twitter, Facebook and Instagram to get the latest updates on LSU Football and Recruiting.

FacebookTwitterInstagram