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I would like to see a 50/50 4-3/3-4 defense this season.
Posted on 8/2/11 at 11:47 pm
Posted on 8/2/11 at 11:47 pm
We have the personnel and depth now to run more 3-4 than before and still keep guys fresh. We have 2 3-4 starting nose tackles. 2 3-4 starting DE's. Hybrid DE/OLB type in Wilson. Shift Shanle inside as an occasional inside linebacker. Vilma would take less abuse than in a full-time 3-4 scheme. We have about 90% of the puzzle for a base 3-4 team already, why not go 50/50 to confuse the hell out of the opposing offenses.
Posted on 8/2/11 at 11:50 pm to coldhotwings
all i know is that i cant wait for football season to start. our D should be pretty fun to watch this year
Posted on 8/3/11 at 12:00 am to coldhotwings
Don't really think I'd rather have more of our LB's than Dlineman on the field honestly.
Unless Wilson and Casillas show up in a big way. But honestly I like the 43 a lot better.
Unless Wilson and Casillas show up in a big way. But honestly I like the 43 a lot better.
Posted on 8/3/11 at 12:01 am to Jones
Do you think we have the type of LB depth required for a 3-4? I know we have a lot of LB's, but we don't have a lot of quality LB's.
Another thing worth mentioning is that Vilma was in a 3-4 with NYJ when he got drafted and didn't do so hot. I'm sure he's fine running it to mix things up, but I don't know how happy he'd be if we were running that 50% of the time.
Another thing worth mentioning is that Vilma was in a 3-4 with NYJ when he got drafted and didn't do so hot. I'm sure he's fine running it to mix things up, but I don't know how happy he'd be if we were running that 50% of the time.
Posted on 8/3/11 at 12:01 am to coldhotwings
The 3-4 rendered him ineffective in NY. Big reason for his drop off after his 1st two seasons. Vilma is undersized for MLB and has trouble shedding blocks from big olinemen. It's probably his only weakness. The 3-4 exposes him to those blocks. A good 4-3 dline will keep that from happening and allow him to do what he does......get to the ball. If Rogers and Franklin can eat up blocks, Vilma will have a great year.
ETA: Fuzzy, Vilma was rookie of the year under a 4-3 when he first got to NY. When Mangini got there, he installed the 3-4.
ETA: Fuzzy, Vilma was rookie of the year under a 4-3 when he first got to NY. When Mangini got there, he installed the 3-4.
This post was edited on 8/3/11 at 12:03 am
Posted on 8/3/11 at 12:05 am to fuzzymayo
quote:
50% of the time.
Way too much IMO. I don't think you can just say alright let's run it half the time. If Williams thinks we can do better with it then let's throw it in a little based on the situation.
But will all of these beastly offseason additions, I don't see how you keep Jordan, Rodgers, and Franklin off the field.
Posted on 8/3/11 at 12:06 am to SaintEB
Yeah. That sounds about right. I knew he had a big rookie year, because it pissed me off at the time because I had wanted the Saints to draft him.
Didn't realize the 3-4 didn't come in until after he got there. Makes sense.
Didn't realize the 3-4 didn't come in until after he got there. Makes sense.
Posted on 8/3/11 at 12:07 am to fuzzymayo
Vilma was hardly ineffective in the 3-4. He just preferred the 4-3. And is better in a 4-3. But he wasnt bad in a 3-4
with that being said, we dont have the LBs to run a 3-4 50% of the time. That is ludicrous
with that being said, we dont have the LBs to run a 3-4 50% of the time. That is ludicrous
Posted on 8/3/11 at 12:11 am to Lester Earl
I stand corrected, Lester. Ineffective is definitely not the case. He had 114 tackles in his first and only year in the 3-4. (169 the previous year). 2007 was his injury year and 2008 is...... Well you know the rest.
Posted on 8/3/11 at 12:20 am to fuzzymayo
quote:
Do you think we have the type of LB depth required for a 3-4?
no.
our d-line depth> lb depth
Posted on 8/3/11 at 12:22 am to Lester Earl
quote:
we dont have the LBs to run a 3-4 50% of the time.
That's why I said we are around 90% complete. I wouldn't mind grabbing SD free agents like Stephen Cooper or Antwan Barnes. Rocky Mac played some 3-4 in Washington and people have been crossing their fingers on him coming to NO. Martez Wilson has the body type for an ideal 3-4 OLB and was drafted high enough for us to expect him to be at least a solid contributor. People gripe about how slow Shanle has gotten so let's take a look at him inside. Cal's coach and scouts have said that Cam Jordan is so athletic that he's dropped back into coverage as an OLB before(not that I recommend this).
Posted on 8/3/11 at 12:39 am to coldhotwings
quote:
I wouldn't mind grabbing SD free agents like Stephen Cooper or Antwan Barnes. Rocky Mac played some 3-4 in Washington and people have been crossing their fingers on him coming to NO. Martez Wilson has the body type for an ideal 3-4 OLB and was drafted high enough for us to expect him to be at least a solid contributor. People gripe about how slow Shanle has gotten so let's take a look at him inside. Cal's coach and scouts have said that Cam Jordan is so athletic that he's dropped back into coverage as an OLB before(not that I recommend this).
We have signed a good number of DB's so far. Where do they fit in a 3-4 scheme; a LB friendly scheme that is.
This post was edited on 8/3/11 at 12:40 am
Posted on 8/3/11 at 12:49 am to coldhotwings
quote:
. Martez Wilson has the body type for an ideal 3-4 OLB and was drafted high enough for us to expect him to be at least a solid contributor. People gripe about how slow Shanle has gotten so let's take a look at him inside.
IMO our LB's lack the thickness(ILB) and size/athleticism combo(OLB) that most good 3-4 LB's corps have.
last i looked Jordan was pushing 290 and Will Smith wasnt any thinner. If these guys could shed 25 lbs we could prob run it well. Though both could prob survive at DE in a 3-4 at their current size. I dont think they could play LB
Posted on 8/3/11 at 12:51 am to LooseCannon22282
I don't see how a 4-3 benefits DB's more than a 3-4. There is still a front 7 and 4 DB's in a base formation.
I don't think we signed as many quality DB's as you think. Of all our new DB FA signings, Fabian Washington is the only one who is starter/nickel material. Our two starting CB's can't seem to stay healthy, jury is still out on Robinson, and Patrick is unproven.
I don't think we signed as many quality DB's as you think. Of all our new DB FA signings, Fabian Washington is the only one who is starter/nickel material. Our two starting CB's can't seem to stay healthy, jury is still out on Robinson, and Patrick is unproven.
This post was edited on 8/3/11 at 12:52 am
Posted on 8/3/11 at 12:52 am to coldhotwings
we have 3 DTs that could start for just about any team in the NFL
why only put one of them on the field at a time?
why only put one of them on the field at a time?
Posted on 8/3/11 at 12:55 am to LooseCannon22282
One thing is for certain, when we do run a 3-4 (which Williams likes to run in certain packages), we'll have better personnel on the field for it than we have ever had during the Payton era.
With that said, we have the best 4-3 personnel now than we have ever had. Especially with our DTs who are the closest to the opponents QB.
With that said, we have the best 4-3 personnel now than we have ever had. Especially with our DTs who are the closest to the opponents QB.
Posted on 8/3/11 at 1:04 am to coldhotwings
quote:
I don't think we signed as many quality DB's as you think. Of all our new DB FA signings, Fabian Washington is the only one who is starter/nickel material. Our two starting CB's can't seem to stay healthy, jury is still out on Robinson, and Patrick is unproven.
We have loaded up on the D-line and the secondary more than anything. I don't disagree with mixing up coverages but to say Patrick is unproven and tout Wilson as a 3-4 difference maker who is also a rookie is stupid.
This post was edited on 8/3/11 at 1:08 am
Posted on 8/3/11 at 1:06 am to coldhotwings
reports out of camp is coaches fully expect Robinson to be our 3rd CB
Posted on 8/3/11 at 1:09 am to baytiger
I see it as a way to keep the interior fresh. Rogers has had experience playing DE and Ellis could be part of the rotation as a 3-4 NT. Ellis has had a lot of trouble staying healthy in his first 2 seasons due to wear and tear. Rogers and Franklin are both in their 30's so rotating through should reduce injury risk and maintain high performance throughout the season. In a 50/50 split, I can see all three average around 70% of the snaps.
Posted on 8/3/11 at 1:14 am to Lester Earl
When we had Johnson, Glover, Hand, and Howard, we literally had free agent scrub vets at LB & CB. Our DL made them look good cuz they intercepted or deflected inaccurate passes caused by the 4 down linemen pressure, if the QB wasn't sacked first.
Now our secondary and linebackers are light years ahead of that team, so I'm confident even if we lose a Greer or Porter for a game or three, Washington or Robinson or Patrick will still look good.
Now our secondary and linebackers are light years ahead of that team, so I'm confident even if we lose a Greer or Porter for a game or three, Washington or Robinson or Patrick will still look good.
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