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re: Opinion of S & W M&P Shield 40 sw
Posted on 7/28/12 at 2:40 pm to DaSaltyTiger
Posted on 7/28/12 at 2:40 pm to DaSaltyTiger
quote:True, and now many are using .45 instead of .40.
I was of the impression that cops went to the 40 due to knock down power. They liked the 9mm but wanted more knock down power. ?????
0
Posted on 7/28/12 at 2:41 pm to xenon16
No, $407 was total delivered. AS w/ tax would have been about $434 locally. Dealers they use are retail outlets so no extra fees.
Posted on 7/28/12 at 5:04 pm to ArkBengal
Damn, just checked on Gallery of Guns and they are already out of both 9mm and 40 in the Shield. Both on allocation whatever that means ? No mags for them either.
Posted on 7/28/12 at 8:32 pm to ArkBengal
There is no real world advantage with a 40 compared to 9... Back when the 40 was adopted by LE, it was basically a hardware remedy to a software problem.
Modern bullet designs have bridged whatever gap there may have been.
Modern bullet designs have bridged whatever gap there may have been.
Posted on 7/29/12 at 6:05 pm to Bull11
Range report - shot about 100+ rounds thru the Shield 9mm today.
1) Shot a full mag (8) 2" group in 10 seconds at 20 ft, and I'm no outstanding marksman with a pistol. I would say very accurate for a compact 3" barrel pistol. Matched my Sig SP2022 40 cal in that sequence.
2) Really like the trigger on this model, but like any other it take a few rounds to get it down. Short pull and crisp break. Some guys have put aftermarket sear kits on to improve it even more, but unless you are comp shooting I don't see as necessary.
3) Had a few (3-4) FTF with the wife early on, but my buddy (who is a very experienced pistol shooter) believes it had more to do with her technique than the pistol. Neither he nor I had any issue with that. Ejected ok, but the slide did not return all the way to locked position so would not fire - maybe a grip or stance issue. No stovepipes or FTE tho. Would advise to have the women shoot it a bit if they are going to be the one carrying it.
4) Recoil fairly mild for a compact - nobody including the wife had any problems with recoil. From what I've read, the 40's are not bad either.
5) Fit my (large) hand just fine with either mag - no problems on grip, etc. Wife handled it fine also, except for the above occasional FTF from not holding it firmly enough (we think). She did better on that as we went along, so I don't think it's a pistol issue.
All in all, seemed to do very well and performed about as expected, maybe better on accuracy for a 3" barrel. We also shot some steel targets out to 20 yards and hit those regularly also.
I would recommend and hope you can find one - they do seem to be in high demand right now. Good luck !
1) Shot a full mag (8) 2" group in 10 seconds at 20 ft, and I'm no outstanding marksman with a pistol. I would say very accurate for a compact 3" barrel pistol. Matched my Sig SP2022 40 cal in that sequence.
2) Really like the trigger on this model, but like any other it take a few rounds to get it down. Short pull and crisp break. Some guys have put aftermarket sear kits on to improve it even more, but unless you are comp shooting I don't see as necessary.
3) Had a few (3-4) FTF with the wife early on, but my buddy (who is a very experienced pistol shooter) believes it had more to do with her technique than the pistol. Neither he nor I had any issue with that. Ejected ok, but the slide did not return all the way to locked position so would not fire - maybe a grip or stance issue. No stovepipes or FTE tho. Would advise to have the women shoot it a bit if they are going to be the one carrying it.
4) Recoil fairly mild for a compact - nobody including the wife had any problems with recoil. From what I've read, the 40's are not bad either.
5) Fit my (large) hand just fine with either mag - no problems on grip, etc. Wife handled it fine also, except for the above occasional FTF from not holding it firmly enough (we think). She did better on that as we went along, so I don't think it's a pistol issue.
All in all, seemed to do very well and performed about as expected, maybe better on accuracy for a 3" barrel. We also shot some steel targets out to 20 yards and hit those regularly also.
I would recommend and hope you can find one - they do seem to be in high demand right now. Good luck !
Posted on 7/29/12 at 6:35 pm to ArkBengal
quote:
3) Had a few (3-4) FTF with the wife early on, but my buddy (who is a very experienced pistol shooter) believes it had more to do with her technique than the pistol. Neither he nor I had any issue with that. Ejected ok, but the slide did not return all the way to locked position so would not fire - maybe a grip or stance issue. No stovepipes or FTE tho. Would advise to have the women shoot it a bit if they are going to be the one carrying it.
Even though not all guns have a "break-in" period, I always highly recommend shooting a few hundred rounds through it before trusting it for carry. My Kahr CM9 had a break-in period as given by the manufacturer, but it is much tighter fitted than the M&Ps. You'll notice that it will smooth out the more you shoot it. The recoil spring needs to break in a bit, and the metal surfaces that contact each other need to smooth out.
I shot my friend's Shield 9mm a few hundred times and really like it. It fed all hollow points, FMJ target rounds, and all of my handloads. It is a very sweet shooter.
To those who can't find a Shield, I would suggest a Kahr CM9 also. I've shot mine nearly 3000 times and it just keeps ticking like a Timex. Recoil is mild and it is actually a bit smaller than the Shield. If you have cargo pants, it's small enough for pocket carry.
Of all the subcompact single-stack pistols out there now, I would suggest the M&P Shield, Kahr CM9, and Springfield XDs (surprisingly mild recoil for a 45).
Double stacks are a completely different ballgame though. That would be a topic for a different thread.
This post was edited on 7/29/12 at 6:37 pm
Posted on 7/29/12 at 6:45 pm to bapple
You are correct - I meant to mention the slide/recoil spring is pretty tough at first. Wife found it hard to operate, along with slide release button. The release loosened up pretty quick and we trust (hope) the slide spring itself will "loosen up" some as we get more rounds through it.
This post was edited on 7/29/12 at 6:48 pm
Posted on 7/30/12 at 12:01 am to ArkBengal
The Shield will probably be a good gun, but still pretty new to the market. If it were me, I'd wait a while to let S&W get all the kinks worked out. In addition, I'd prefer that the Shield not have an external safety lever. Last, many of the subcompact 9's can be carried in the pocket. The Shield's dimensions look a little big for this.
In a gun this small, I'd get a 9 instead of a 40.
In a gun this small, I'd get a 9 instead of a 40.
Posted on 7/30/12 at 9:24 am to TigerOnThe Hill
It is pretty big for a pocket. Better for a purse or car tote, or a holstered carry. The safety is pretty flush tho - I don't think that will be a problem. A lot of folks carry with the safety off also depending on the trigger safety.
Posted on 7/30/12 at 9:47 am to ArkBengal
quote:
It is pretty big for a pocket. Better for a purse or car tote, or a holstered carry. The safety is pretty flush tho - I don't think that will be a problem. A lot of folks carry with the safety off also depending on the trigger safety.
I agree on all counts. There are few 9mm subcompacts that can be carried in a pocket though. The Kahr CM9/PM9 and Keltec Pf9 are really the only two that I can see going into a rather large pocket. I carry my Kahr IWB anyway, and it is super comfortable.
The safety can be removed. There have been a few people on youtube who have done it. But it's low-profile enough to where it isn't really necessary.
Posted on 7/30/12 at 11:14 am to Gingineer
She was probably
Limp wristing
Limp wristing
Posted on 7/30/12 at 11:58 am to xenon16
Yeah, my PF9 can be carried in most of my dress slacks. This time of year, it also spends a lot time in cargo shorts.
In addition to the PF9 and Kahr CM9/PM9, there are some other subcompact 9's that should fit in carefully selected front pockets and cargo pockets. I don't own any of the following guns, but looks like these should also fit: Kimber Solo, Ruger LC9, Sig 290 and possibly Beretta Nano.
Here's a nice pic comparison of some of the more popular subcompact 9's, but it predates the Shield.
LINK
In addition to the PF9 and Kahr CM9/PM9, there are some other subcompact 9's that should fit in carefully selected front pockets and cargo pockets. I don't own any of the following guns, but looks like these should also fit: Kimber Solo, Ruger LC9, Sig 290 and possibly Beretta Nano.
Here's a nice pic comparison of some of the more popular subcompact 9's, but it predates the Shield.
LINK
Posted on 7/30/12 at 4:47 pm to TigerOnThe Hill
quote:
In a gun this small, I'd get a 9 instead of a 40.
What would be your reasoning? Too much recoil or just personal preference? I shot the 40 but not the 9. Recoil is not bad at all and accuracy was good. I shot targets at about 15 yards. No problems.
Posted on 7/30/12 at 5:47 pm to xenon16
Possible, but looking back we think most of the problem was loading first shell after a new mag. Heard of some that you need to insert mag with slide open then release slide. Could be we didn't get enough "snap" on the slide on first load - had same issue on a couple of manual cycles too, but I don't remember any now after an actual shot. Could be just a break-in issue too. Couple guys on S&W forum said just keep shooting it and it will smooth out. Works for me !
Posted on 7/30/12 at 10:56 pm to ArkBengal
quote:
In a gun this small, I'd get a 9 instead of a 40.
What would be your reasoning? Too much recoil or just personal preference?
In guns of similar weight and using similar powered loads, the 40 S&W has a "snappier" recoil than does the 9mm. In fact, the 40 S&W has a snappier recoil than does the 45 ACP. Admittedly, I don't own a subcompact 40 S&W, although I do own a PF9 in 9mm and Kahr CCW45 in 45 ACP. In a gun as small as a subcompact 9mm or 40 S&W, any potential small self defense benefits the 40 has over the 9mm are offset by the 40's increased recoil. If you've shot the Shield in 40 S&W, handled it well and are satisfied w/ it, then more power to you as you should have a very formidable self defense handgun.
Posted on 7/31/12 at 8:11 am to ArkBengal
quote:
Possible, but looking back we think most of the problem was loading first shell after a new mag.
If this is what was happening then it's not the fault of the gun at all.
Guns are mechanical and require certain manipulation to function correctly. The gun is designed to function in a rather harsh state. The slide should slam backward (all the way to the rear) then begin forward travel after the recoil spring counteracts the rearward movement. To sum that up, loading the first round by hand can short-stroke the slide, especially on stiff, subcompact models.
If that's the only place she was having trouble, try loading the first round with the slide locked back as you suggested before. This will make the gun function as intended and will prevent short-stroking.
Good luck to ya.
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