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Monument/Memorial thread for thinking people.

Posted on 5/11/17 at 7:19 pm
Posted by Scoop
RIP Scoop
Member since Sep 2005
44583 posts
Posted on 5/11/17 at 7:19 pm
Tearing down these things is dangerous.

It is just spreading division.

Mitch empowered the usual suspects in other cities. In Shreveport they are taking another run at the Confederate Monument outside the Caddo Courthouse even though old Shreveport money owns the dirt where it sits via Daughters of the Confederacy.

It can't be moved because it is a monument and not a memorial. It is placed at the location where the last Confederate flag was lowered in an official capacity after Appomattox. The monument is inscribed with such, therefore moving it negates it's purpose.

People need to understand one thing: These monuments and memorials were often a derivitive of a reconciliation process wherein both sides fought and came back together to honor each other as part of the healing process. It was a family fight and after it was over we came together and got right with each other as opposed to a foreign invasion.

These things at art. They are interpretive. They have no singular meaning.

A black person can see them as symbols of oppression. A white person can see them as symbols of oppression. A person can look at them with a sense of pride because their 3rd great grandad wanted to represent his state when called and had no hate in his heart. They can be looked at as warnings regarding what happens when divisions escalate to a level so high that no choice seems available other than taking up arms against someone that you shouldn't.

The old cliche' is that those that forget history are condemned to repeat it.

What happens when you erase history?

Posted by HailToTheChiz
Back in Auburn
Member since Aug 2010
48896 posts
Posted on 5/11/17 at 7:20 pm to
quote:

What happens when you erase history?


Nazis.

Literally Hitler.
Posted by upgrayedd
Lifting at Tobin's house
Member since Mar 2013
134845 posts
Posted on 5/11/17 at 7:20 pm to
Yeah, but racism n stuff.
Posted by Breesus
House of the Rising Sun
Member since Jan 2010
66982 posts
Posted on 5/11/17 at 7:22 pm to
quote:

Tearing down these things is dangerous


Hitler
Stalin
Saddam
Landrieu
Posted by Fusaichi Pegasus
Meh He Co
Member since Oct 2010
14564 posts
Posted on 5/11/17 at 7:23 pm to
To be honest, I'm ready for a great schism
Cleansing if you will
Posted by OWLFAN86
The OT has made me richer
Member since Jun 2004
175699 posts
Posted on 5/11/17 at 7:24 pm to
quote:

for thinking people.
you could not be more out of place
Posted by ksayetiger
Centenary Gents
Member since Jul 2007
68268 posts
Posted on 5/11/17 at 7:24 pm to
quote:

Hitler
Stalin
Saddam
Landrieu


Landrieu isnt like the others, you what is different?




his name ends in a vowel
Posted by upgrayedd
Lifting at Tobin's house
Member since Mar 2013
134845 posts
Posted on 5/11/17 at 7:25 pm to
Posted by saint tiger225
San Diego
Member since Jan 2011
35348 posts
Posted on 5/11/17 at 7:27 pm to
Great thread man, seriously. I agree with everything you said.

It's a shame the population that wants these things removed are too stupid to recognize these things.
Posted by pistolpete23
In the present
Member since Dec 2007
7122 posts
Posted on 5/11/17 at 7:27 pm to

I'm having one in Jeff Davis's honor
Posted by upgrayedd
Lifting at Tobin's house
Member since Mar 2013
134845 posts
Posted on 5/11/17 at 7:33 pm to
OMG.....Billy Idol is a fricking Nazi!!!!!!!
















I JUST CAN'T RIGHT NOW, Y'ALL!
Posted by EastBankTiger
A little west of Hoover Dam
Member since Dec 2003
21316 posts
Posted on 5/11/17 at 7:53 pm to
quote:

It's a shame the population that wants these things removed are too stupid to recognize these things.


The one major advantage that Democrats will always have over Republicans. They know their voting base.
Posted by crewdepoo
Hogwarts
Member since Jan 2015
9580 posts
Posted on 5/11/17 at 7:55 pm to
Wouldn't you rebels want history to forget the civil war. Yall got your arse whooped
Posted by OweO
Plaquemine, La
Member since Sep 2009
113896 posts
Posted on 5/11/17 at 7:55 pm to
quote:

quote:
for thinking people.
you could not be more out of place




I am here now so its in the right place.
Posted by JS87
Member since Aug 2010
16649 posts
Posted on 5/11/17 at 8:00 pm to
This whole ordeal reminds me of Down's song "New Orleans is a dying whore...naked she sleeps on my floor."
Posted by OweO
Plaquemine, La
Member since Sep 2009
113896 posts
Posted on 5/11/17 at 8:22 pm to
This is a complex issue. The confederacy obviously fought for state rights with the main issue being slavery. The southern states obviously didn't want the federal government telling them whether or not they could use slaves.

So any support for the confederacy is seen as a support of slavery, which I understand why people see it that way. After all, that was one of the main issues the civil war was fought.

But as the OP said, it is art. It is interpreted different by different people.

This is a black guy, a student at South Carolina who supports the confederate flag and was forced to take down his flag and he explains why he supports it.

LINK

Personally, if I were black, I would not care enough to get behind taking down the statues, but I would not be in support of it either.. Because it would represent something, that if it was still a thing today, that would force me to be a slave.

But I would also like to know why the monuments were put up? Did, whoever approve of them, do so because they supported slavery? Was it simply because of historic reasons? Either way, because it would not have any personal impact on me whether they are up or taken down, I would not give a good frick.
Posted by 4cubbies
Member since Sep 2008
49978 posts
Posted on 5/11/17 at 8:27 pm to
quote:

These things at art. They are interpretive. They have no singular meaning.


This is such a bullshite position. They are monuments to people. They are statues of the people they honor. There is no interpretation needed.

Fwiw, I don't care about the damned statues.
Posted by ChaseMac
Member since Sep 2016
412 posts
Posted on 5/11/17 at 8:27 pm to
You are clearly not a thinking person, so keep on steering clear of those history books.
Posted by TigerFanInSouthland
Louisiana
Member since Aug 2012
28065 posts
Posted on 5/11/17 at 8:28 pm to
quote:

A person can look at them with a sense of pride because their 3rd great grandad wanted to represent his state when called and had no hate in his heart.


This is what it is to me. My great great great (maybe one more great) grandfather fought at Vicksburg. We still have copies of his parole papers from the Union Army and his pay stubs from the Confederate Army. He held no slaves, I'm sure he was a product of his environment so he wasn't a friend to blacks but that was the time he lived in.

Most men in the confederacy held no slaves, but they fought because they saw what to them was a foreign army marching in their lands.

While, yes, the Confederacy was essentially Un-American, it is an immensely important part of the American heritage and history. People seem to forget that these men were mostly a generation or two removed from the Revolutionary War. Hell, Lee's father was a commander in the Revolution, his wife was related to George fricking Washington himself.

To take these monuments down is damaging and dangerous. It's what every dictatorial entity has done since forever when they come into power.

Eta: And let me be clear, nobody, and I mean NOBODY is trying to stand up for slavery or try to say that slavery was ever justified.
This post was edited on 5/11/17 at 8:33 pm
Posted by blueboy
Member since Apr 2006
56255 posts
Posted on 5/11/17 at 8:29 pm to
quote:

Mitch empowered the usual suspects in other cities.
That's the biggest thing. It never ends. Like the students at UCSB recently proved, enough is never enough. When you give in, they immediately bounce back and want more.

In the case of monuments, I can absolutely assure you that they will eventually come for "slave owners" Washington, Jefferson, etc. The attacks on the Founders have been going on for a while, and have recently surged.

It's what communists do. Polished Marxist Sanders nearly won the nomination and I think he'd have beaten Trump. I fear that the next one like him will. Then, no act of absurd leftism will be off limits.

I'd love to see Trump rescue Lee, but he'll never do it. He appears to be getting steered around by puppeteers just like every other president.
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