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Saints Training Camp: Day 8 Takeaways and Observations
Posted on 8/4/23 at 4:02 pm
Posted on 8/4/23 at 4:02 pm
LINK
METAIRIE -- Friday's Saints training camp session is in the books, as the team rolled with their new practice format due to the extreme heat. Fans were back in the stands, and we got to see a decent bit of action. Here's our notes and observations from Day 8.
Saints Training Camp Notes and Observations from Day 8
ATTENDANCE
The Saints were missing a few faces on Friday, which was headlined by Michael Thomas. Dennis Allen said after practice that it was a veteran rest day for Thomas, so there's no cause for concern. James Hurst, Andrus Peat, Calvin Throckmorton, and Cam Jordan were also among those not spotted at practice. Jordan also had a vet day after signing his contract extension this morning. I did see James Hurst around, so it was more than likely a vet day for him.
STARTING LOOKS AND MORE
With the offensive line missing a few would-be starters, the team rolled a look of Trevor Penning, Landon Young, Erik McCoy, Cesar Ruiz, and Ryan Ramczyk. We have pointed out a few times in recaps that Young was getting guard work. The second pairing had Lewis Kidd, Nick Saldiveri, Max Garcia, Mark Evans II, and Storm Norton.
Defensively, New Orleans went with a base look to start that had Carl Granderson, Khalen Saunders, Nathan Shepherd, and Tanoh Kpassagnon. Zack Baun, Demario Davis, and Pete Werner at linebacker, with Alontae Taylor starting outside opposite of Marshon Lattimore. Tyrann Mathieu and Marcus Maye were at safety.
Later in team drills, the Saints rolled out a three-man rush that had Nathan Shepherd in the middle with Granderson and Kpassagnon on the outside. Bradley Roby was working in the slot, and Jordan Howden was the extra defensive back on the field in addition to defenders Demario Davis, Marshon Lattimore, Alontae Taylor, Marcus Maye, and Tyrann Mathieu.
ALVIN KAMARA ADDRESSES THINGS
Kamara met with the media for over 20 minutes following practice, and he started by getting everything out in the open. He took accountability and responsibility, not looking for any pity and also talking about losing things financially and in the realm of friendships.
"Poor judgment on my end, definitely a bad decision, but I'm a man," Kamara said following practice. "Anything I've ever done in my life, I've stood on and I can take accountability for. I can say when I'm wrong, and I was completely wrong. I embarrassed the Saints, I embarrassed my family and my mother, I embarrassed myself, I embarrassed this city and I embarrassed the NFL."
Kamara's meeting Goodell went well, and he'll serve a three-game suspension to start the season. Even with him out of the lineup, he knows that the Saints will keep on going without him in the fold and not miss a beat. We'll have the full interview up on our video side.
part 1 of 3
METAIRIE -- Friday's Saints training camp session is in the books, as the team rolled with their new practice format due to the extreme heat. Fans were back in the stands, and we got to see a decent bit of action. Here's our notes and observations from Day 8.
Saints Training Camp Notes and Observations from Day 8
ATTENDANCE
The Saints were missing a few faces on Friday, which was headlined by Michael Thomas. Dennis Allen said after practice that it was a veteran rest day for Thomas, so there's no cause for concern. James Hurst, Andrus Peat, Calvin Throckmorton, and Cam Jordan were also among those not spotted at practice. Jordan also had a vet day after signing his contract extension this morning. I did see James Hurst around, so it was more than likely a vet day for him.
STARTING LOOKS AND MORE
With the offensive line missing a few would-be starters, the team rolled a look of Trevor Penning, Landon Young, Erik McCoy, Cesar Ruiz, and Ryan Ramczyk. We have pointed out a few times in recaps that Young was getting guard work. The second pairing had Lewis Kidd, Nick Saldiveri, Max Garcia, Mark Evans II, and Storm Norton.
Defensively, New Orleans went with a base look to start that had Carl Granderson, Khalen Saunders, Nathan Shepherd, and Tanoh Kpassagnon. Zack Baun, Demario Davis, and Pete Werner at linebacker, with Alontae Taylor starting outside opposite of Marshon Lattimore. Tyrann Mathieu and Marcus Maye were at safety.
Later in team drills, the Saints rolled out a three-man rush that had Nathan Shepherd in the middle with Granderson and Kpassagnon on the outside. Bradley Roby was working in the slot, and Jordan Howden was the extra defensive back on the field in addition to defenders Demario Davis, Marshon Lattimore, Alontae Taylor, Marcus Maye, and Tyrann Mathieu.
ALVIN KAMARA ADDRESSES THINGS
Kamara met with the media for over 20 minutes following practice, and he started by getting everything out in the open. He took accountability and responsibility, not looking for any pity and also talking about losing things financially and in the realm of friendships.
"Poor judgment on my end, definitely a bad decision, but I'm a man," Kamara said following practice. "Anything I've ever done in my life, I've stood on and I can take accountability for. I can say when I'm wrong, and I was completely wrong. I embarrassed the Saints, I embarrassed my family and my mother, I embarrassed myself, I embarrassed this city and I embarrassed the NFL."
Kamara's meeting Goodell went well, and he'll serve a three-game suspension to start the season. Even with him out of the lineup, he knows that the Saints will keep on going without him in the fold and not miss a beat. We'll have the full interview up on our video side.
part 1 of 3
2
Posted on 8/4/23 at 4:04 pm to hellsu
QUARTERBACK BREAKDOWN
Here's all the breakdowns from the day, as it was more of a running day.
Derek Carr: 4/6 (7s), 1/1, 2/2, 0/3
Jameis Winston: 4/4 (7s), no passes, 1/1, 3/4
Jake Haener: 2/2 (7s), 1/1, 1/2, 1/3
7-ON-7: Carr's first series started with a nice floater for a deep gain left to Rashid Shaheed with Marcus Maye and Tyrann Mathieu around. Alontae Taylor made a nice pass breakup on a pass to the sidelines intended for Kendre Miller on the next play, and then Carr hit a deep crosser to Tre'Quan Smith with Jordan Howden and Tyrann Mathieu as the closest defenders.
Chris Olave had a fairly easy catch over the middle for a nice gain on the next play, but it was dropped. Lonnie Johnson Jr. was right there and would have had a big hit if it were a real game situation. Carr then hit Jimmy Graham in the flats for a short gain, and then the play of the day happened with Alvin Kamara going for a deep hookup running a wheel route out of the backfield with Zack Baun in coverage.
Jameis Winston got his series started by hitting Tre'Quan Smith on a curl route for a short gain, and then Kirk Merritt on a drag route working against Zack Baun. Jesse James had an easy hookup underneath for a nice gain on the next play with Troy Pride as the closest defender. Winston's last play was a hookup on the sideline to Keith Kirkwood on a quick out.
Haener only got two reps, as the Saints typically run 12 plays total during these drills. His first pass was for an intermediate gain near the sideline to Keith Kirkwood. His other pass was to Foster Moreau on a short curl hookup.
TEAM SERIES NO. 1: The run defense had a pretty strong series during Carr's reps, as Carl Granderson and Demario Davis had a nice run stop on an inside rush attempt to Jamaal Williams to start. Alvin Kamara had a run to the outside on the next play, with Marcus Maye and Bradley Roby stopping him for a short gain. The lone pass from Carr was a good hookup to Kawaan Baker near the right sideline with Zack Baun as the closest in coverage. The series ended with a run inside to Kamara that was stopped for a loss by Pete Werner.
Winston's series saw all runs, with the first going to Jamaal Williams inside that was stuffed by Malcolm Roach for a loss. Zack Baun had a tackle for loss on the next run play outside to Kirk Merritt. Miller came back with a decent run to the outside on the next play, and I specifically honed in on Nick Saldiveri getting a nice block on Bryan Bresee to help open a way. Eno Benjamin had the final carry that got to the second level going inside to close things out.
Haener's reps were mostly runs, with a Ellis Merriweather attempt right to start. Anfernee Orji had the stop on the play. Kirk Merritt had a cut right on the next play in which J.T. Gray was there for the stop. His lone pass was a swing one out to the right for a nice gain with Koda Martin out in front making a nice block. Eno Benjamin had the final carry outside with Nick Anderson getting the stop.
TEAM SERIES NO. 2: Carr's second series started with an outside run with Marcus Maye and Demario Davis in pursuit. The defense had Bryan Bresee and Malcolm Roach in to start on the interior here. The next play got shut down by Carr due to something not being right during the process leading up to the snap. The offense came back with a nice run with Kendre Miller on the next play with good blocking from Erik McCoy. Miller also had really good vision on his attempt.
Carr hit a deep crossing route on the next play to Taysom Hill off the deep left sideline with Marcus Maye and Pete Werner as the closest defenders. He closed out the series hitting a crosser to Tre'Quan Smith with Ugo Amadi in coverage. Carl Granderson had the pressure on the play, which could have been blowed dead for a sack.
Winston hit his lone pass to start, which was a crossing route hookup to Lucas Krull with Nephi Sewell in coverage. Kirk Merritt had an outside run on the next play that was stopped by Isaiah Foskey. Winston took off running on the next play, but it was already blown dead after Ugo Amadi had the sack coming off a blitz from the slot. Jamaal Williams had the final play with a short run inside.
Haener's first play during his series was an inside run to Eno Benjamin that was stopped by D'Marco Jackson. Hit had a nice little hit stick on the play. Haener completed his first pass to Lynn Bowden Jr. with Troy Pride in coverage for an intermediate gain over the middle. The next pass attempt for Haener was incomplete to Benjamin in the flats. The final play of the series was a toss play to Ellis Merriweather for a short gain that was stopped by Ty Summers.
TEAM SERIES NO. 3: Tough series here to finish for the first team. Carr's first pass was incomplete as we got our first tipped pass at the line, courtesy of Khalen Saunders. The second was a sideline shot to Kawaan Baker, but the timing was obviously off the mark. Nathan Shepherd and Tanoh Kpassagnon combined for a sack on the third play, and then the series finished up with a deep right attempt to Chris Olave with Lonnie Johnson Jr. in coverage. He was open, but they didn't connect. Trevor Penning had a strong block on Carl Granderson in pass protection on the play.
Winston's final series saw him hit Rashid Shaheed on a slant for a short hookup to start. He then hit Lynn Bowden Jr. underneath on a curl with Nephi Sewell and Ugo Amadi around. Winston then tried Kawaan Baker near the sideline for an intermediate pass, but it was a little low. I once again honed in on Trevor Penning, who had a strong rep against Isaiah Foskey. The series ended with a deep hookup down the seam to Bowden Jr. with Sewell in coverage. Bowden Jr. made a really good adjustment to get the deep pass.
Haener's series started with an outside run to the left with Kirk Merritt, and then he had a rollout on the next play to throw back across the middle to Ellis Merriweather. The play was actually blown dead before the pass came out, but we still chart the throw. Haener tried a deep shot on the sideline to Kawaan Baker on the third play, it was close, but no cigar. The final pass was to James Washington down the right sideline, but it was overthrown.
Part 2 of 3
Here's all the breakdowns from the day, as it was more of a running day.
Derek Carr: 4/6 (7s), 1/1, 2/2, 0/3
Jameis Winston: 4/4 (7s), no passes, 1/1, 3/4
Jake Haener: 2/2 (7s), 1/1, 1/2, 1/3
7-ON-7: Carr's first series started with a nice floater for a deep gain left to Rashid Shaheed with Marcus Maye and Tyrann Mathieu around. Alontae Taylor made a nice pass breakup on a pass to the sidelines intended for Kendre Miller on the next play, and then Carr hit a deep crosser to Tre'Quan Smith with Jordan Howden and Tyrann Mathieu as the closest defenders.
Chris Olave had a fairly easy catch over the middle for a nice gain on the next play, but it was dropped. Lonnie Johnson Jr. was right there and would have had a big hit if it were a real game situation. Carr then hit Jimmy Graham in the flats for a short gain, and then the play of the day happened with Alvin Kamara going for a deep hookup running a wheel route out of the backfield with Zack Baun in coverage.
Jameis Winston got his series started by hitting Tre'Quan Smith on a curl route for a short gain, and then Kirk Merritt on a drag route working against Zack Baun. Jesse James had an easy hookup underneath for a nice gain on the next play with Troy Pride as the closest defender. Winston's last play was a hookup on the sideline to Keith Kirkwood on a quick out.
Haener only got two reps, as the Saints typically run 12 plays total during these drills. His first pass was for an intermediate gain near the sideline to Keith Kirkwood. His other pass was to Foster Moreau on a short curl hookup.
TEAM SERIES NO. 1: The run defense had a pretty strong series during Carr's reps, as Carl Granderson and Demario Davis had a nice run stop on an inside rush attempt to Jamaal Williams to start. Alvin Kamara had a run to the outside on the next play, with Marcus Maye and Bradley Roby stopping him for a short gain. The lone pass from Carr was a good hookup to Kawaan Baker near the right sideline with Zack Baun as the closest in coverage. The series ended with a run inside to Kamara that was stopped for a loss by Pete Werner.
Winston's series saw all runs, with the first going to Jamaal Williams inside that was stuffed by Malcolm Roach for a loss. Zack Baun had a tackle for loss on the next run play outside to Kirk Merritt. Miller came back with a decent run to the outside on the next play, and I specifically honed in on Nick Saldiveri getting a nice block on Bryan Bresee to help open a way. Eno Benjamin had the final carry that got to the second level going inside to close things out.
Haener's reps were mostly runs, with a Ellis Merriweather attempt right to start. Anfernee Orji had the stop on the play. Kirk Merritt had a cut right on the next play in which J.T. Gray was there for the stop. His lone pass was a swing one out to the right for a nice gain with Koda Martin out in front making a nice block. Eno Benjamin had the final carry outside with Nick Anderson getting the stop.
TEAM SERIES NO. 2: Carr's second series started with an outside run with Marcus Maye and Demario Davis in pursuit. The defense had Bryan Bresee and Malcolm Roach in to start on the interior here. The next play got shut down by Carr due to something not being right during the process leading up to the snap. The offense came back with a nice run with Kendre Miller on the next play with good blocking from Erik McCoy. Miller also had really good vision on his attempt.
Carr hit a deep crossing route on the next play to Taysom Hill off the deep left sideline with Marcus Maye and Pete Werner as the closest defenders. He closed out the series hitting a crosser to Tre'Quan Smith with Ugo Amadi in coverage. Carl Granderson had the pressure on the play, which could have been blowed dead for a sack.
Winston hit his lone pass to start, which was a crossing route hookup to Lucas Krull with Nephi Sewell in coverage. Kirk Merritt had an outside run on the next play that was stopped by Isaiah Foskey. Winston took off running on the next play, but it was already blown dead after Ugo Amadi had the sack coming off a blitz from the slot. Jamaal Williams had the final play with a short run inside.
Haener's first play during his series was an inside run to Eno Benjamin that was stopped by D'Marco Jackson. Hit had a nice little hit stick on the play. Haener completed his first pass to Lynn Bowden Jr. with Troy Pride in coverage for an intermediate gain over the middle. The next pass attempt for Haener was incomplete to Benjamin in the flats. The final play of the series was a toss play to Ellis Merriweather for a short gain that was stopped by Ty Summers.
TEAM SERIES NO. 3: Tough series here to finish for the first team. Carr's first pass was incomplete as we got our first tipped pass at the line, courtesy of Khalen Saunders. The second was a sideline shot to Kawaan Baker, but the timing was obviously off the mark. Nathan Shepherd and Tanoh Kpassagnon combined for a sack on the third play, and then the series finished up with a deep right attempt to Chris Olave with Lonnie Johnson Jr. in coverage. He was open, but they didn't connect. Trevor Penning had a strong block on Carl Granderson in pass protection on the play.
Winston's final series saw him hit Rashid Shaheed on a slant for a short hookup to start. He then hit Lynn Bowden Jr. underneath on a curl with Nephi Sewell and Ugo Amadi around. Winston then tried Kawaan Baker near the sideline for an intermediate pass, but it was a little low. I once again honed in on Trevor Penning, who had a strong rep against Isaiah Foskey. The series ended with a deep hookup down the seam to Bowden Jr. with Sewell in coverage. Bowden Jr. made a really good adjustment to get the deep pass.
Haener's series started with an outside run to the left with Kirk Merritt, and then he had a rollout on the next play to throw back across the middle to Ellis Merriweather. The play was actually blown dead before the pass came out, but we still chart the throw. Haener tried a deep shot on the sideline to Kawaan Baker on the third play, it was close, but no cigar. The final pass was to James Washington down the right sideline, but it was overthrown.
Part 2 of 3
Posted on 8/4/23 at 4:06 pm to hellsu
GENERAL OBSERVATIONS AND NOTES
Jon Gruden was in attendance for practice. He should be here for the next several days in an observer capacity to help with any input. There were some periods where he was talking a lot with Alvin Kamara and Derek Carr.
Jahri Evans continues to integrate and insert himself in practice with the interior offensive line. We see a lot of Doug Maronne as the main authority there. Several players have complimented what Evans brings to the table for the group.
It could be situational, but Jordan Howden looks like he's the extra defensive back in the pecking order right now. During walkthroughs inside with him on the field, he was actually in the back half of the defense with Marcus Maye. Marcus Robertson was coaching him up on positioning and such.
Alontae Taylor is growing in the slot, as well as Ugo Amadi. Amadi made a few nice plays on the day and is a climber.
Zack Baun is a frequent picked on target in the passing game. There's some growth needed there, but there was one play that stood out that is a compliment to his growth. It was during 7-on-7's when he was able to chase down Kirk Merritt, which is no easy feat. We'll see where things are at when we get into the preseason.
Wil Lutz ended up missing two of his kicks today, finishing 5-of-7. He missed his second kick after hitting the right uprights in his first few attempts, and then when he missed his first kick in the second frame was wide right. Lou Hedley was the holder.
Blake Gillikin handled punting duties on the day, and here's all the unofficial hang times I have from the day: 4.81, 4.41, 3.46, 4.48, 4.61, 4.51, 4.38, 4.75, 4.03, 4.50.
We're seeing a little bit more two running back sets in the offense. There was one of the plays in walkthroughs that had Alvin Kamara run an angle with Jamaal Williams going into the flats.
Kamara was also among the punt return group today that included Keke Coutee, Rashid Shaheed, Ugo Amadi, and Chris Olave.
One of the things Trevor Penning said today that's worth relaying. He said that his injuries were more bad luck than anything. First injury was toe got caught in the turf. Wasn't even sure on second, as it was after the play. He also talked about working on technique some, how to plant on his feet.
part 3 of 3
Jon Gruden was in attendance for practice. He should be here for the next several days in an observer capacity to help with any input. There were some periods where he was talking a lot with Alvin Kamara and Derek Carr.
Jahri Evans continues to integrate and insert himself in practice with the interior offensive line. We see a lot of Doug Maronne as the main authority there. Several players have complimented what Evans brings to the table for the group.
It could be situational, but Jordan Howden looks like he's the extra defensive back in the pecking order right now. During walkthroughs inside with him on the field, he was actually in the back half of the defense with Marcus Maye. Marcus Robertson was coaching him up on positioning and such.
Alontae Taylor is growing in the slot, as well as Ugo Amadi. Amadi made a few nice plays on the day and is a climber.
Zack Baun is a frequent picked on target in the passing game. There's some growth needed there, but there was one play that stood out that is a compliment to his growth. It was during 7-on-7's when he was able to chase down Kirk Merritt, which is no easy feat. We'll see where things are at when we get into the preseason.
Wil Lutz ended up missing two of his kicks today, finishing 5-of-7. He missed his second kick after hitting the right uprights in his first few attempts, and then when he missed his first kick in the second frame was wide right. Lou Hedley was the holder.
Blake Gillikin handled punting duties on the day, and here's all the unofficial hang times I have from the day: 4.81, 4.41, 3.46, 4.48, 4.61, 4.51, 4.38, 4.75, 4.03, 4.50.
We're seeing a little bit more two running back sets in the offense. There was one of the plays in walkthroughs that had Alvin Kamara run an angle with Jamaal Williams going into the flats.
Kamara was also among the punt return group today that included Keke Coutee, Rashid Shaheed, Ugo Amadi, and Chris Olave.
One of the things Trevor Penning said today that's worth relaying. He said that his injuries were more bad luck than anything. First injury was toe got caught in the turf. Wasn't even sure on second, as it was after the play. He also talked about working on technique some, how to plant on his feet.
part 3 of 3
Posted on 8/4/23 at 4:31 pm to hellsu
quote:
Zack Baun is a frequent picked on target in the passing game. There's some growth needed there, but there was one play that stood out that is a compliment to his growth. It was during 7-on-7's when he was able to chase down Kirk Merritt, which is no easy feat. We'll see where things are at when we get into the preseason.
That quote is no lie, if you go back to the previous Camp takeaway reports Baun is frequently working against the pass. Zack Baun's development is crucial. There is not much proven depth beyond the starters.
quote:
We're seeing a little bit more two running back sets in the offense. There was one of the plays in walkthroughs that had Alvin Kamara run an angle with Jamaal Williams going into the flats
I would like Carmichael to start using some 2 rb sets in the offense. They use to do well on the short yardage 3rd downs with a fullback lead blocking or using that 2nd back as a decoy particularly now with a wider variety of talented options.
Posted on 8/4/23 at 4:47 pm to hellsu
Does anyone think we'll ever go back to using the screens as effectively as when we had Thomas, Reggie etc?
I just feel like Kamara does really well by making people miss.
I just feel like Kamara does really well by making people miss.
Posted on 8/4/23 at 5:50 pm to JRE1980
quote:
Does anyone think we'll ever go back to using the screens as effectively as when we had Thomas, Reggie etc?
With so many teams playing so much "big nickle" as their base, which puts an additional defender who specializes in tackling in space on the field, I'm not sure that the screen game can be quite as big a part of an offense as it was then.
Posted on 8/4/23 at 6:23 pm to PuddinheadSr
quote:
With so many teams playing so much "big nickle" as their base, which puts an additional defender who specializes in tackling in space on the field, I'm not sure that the screen game can be quite as big a part of an offense as it was then.
True, but it’s still about creating mismatches and not being predictable with personnel. We can get defenses into personnel packages where the screen can be effective. Or just get it to AK as a receiver. I think the goal is getting him the ball in space close to the LOS and let him work more than it is getting it to him in an actual “screen.”
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