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Something I Just Realized About Game Of Thrones (Book Readers Only)
Posted on 2/28/15 at 11:59 am
Posted on 2/28/15 at 11:59 am
Did they never bring up Joffrey being behind Bran's attempted assassination on the show? That's a pretty big detail to leave out IMO.
7
Posted on 2/28/15 at 12:04 pm to Korin
I guess not. I don't really remember it being resolved. I'm a little fuzzy how exactly it worked out in the books right now. Wasn't it pretty much just noted by Tyrion mentally as for how much a bastard Joffrey is? I don't think knowing exactly who did it ultimately had that much effect on events, but I can't really remember. I think it just developed Joffrey's character some more.
This post was edited on 2/28/15 at 12:05 pm
Posted on 2/28/15 at 12:05 pm to Korin
They barely brought it up in the books and the only reason the readers know is by process of elimination through characters' internal monologue. It's really not a big deal now that the Starks and Lannisters are all but destroyed.
Posted on 2/28/15 at 12:18 pm to Hugo Stiglitz
I thought Cersei was behind it. Why would Joffrey care to single out Bran? He had no idea that Bran witnessed Cersei fricking Jaime which led to Bran's fall.
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Posted on 2/28/15 at 12:20 pm to mizzoukills
Well (in the books), didn't Joffrey overhear his dad talking about how bad being crippled would suck and that someone should put the poor boy out of his misery (or something like that)? Then later on before his wedding, Joffrey remarks that he's had experience with Valyrian steel before after Tywin gives him the sword.
Posted on 2/28/15 at 12:33 pm to Korin
I read the books, but that comment never stood out as proof that he was behind Bran's death. It absolutely makes far more sense for Cersei to be behind his death. Joffrey killing Bran because he overheard Ned's conversation about pitying cripples is a weak reason at best, even if it is supposed to demonstrate how evil Joffrey is. Joffrey demonstrated evil enough that making him responsible for Bran's death is pointless. If this the author's intent is that Joffrey is indeed responsible, it's one of the weaker plot points in the story.
It makes far more sense for Cersei to be responsible.
It makes far more sense for Cersei to be responsible.
Posted on 2/28/15 at 12:35 pm to Korin
quote:
Did they never bring up Joffrey being behind Bran's attempted assassination on the show? That's a pretty big detail to leave out IMO.
No, but I don't think its THAT huge. What's done is done on that point and doesn't really affect character's decisions once they find out that he was behind it. It just makes Tyrion even more pissed at Joffrey and that's it.
Leaving out the fact that Tysha was exactly who she claimed she was is a huge. It completely changes the context of Tyrion's, Jaime's, and Tywin's characters, and especially Tyrion moving forward. That's a bigger omission.
Posted on 2/28/15 at 12:36 pm to mizzoukills
quote:
I thought Cersei was behind it. Why would Joffrey care to single out Bran? He had no idea that Bran witnessed Cersei fricking Jaime which led to Bran's fall.
Cersei wouldn't have been dumb enough to use a Valyrian Steel blade. Joffrey on the other hand was.
Posted on 2/28/15 at 12:42 pm to OMLandshark
quote:
There was no outright confession. Needless to say, spoilers ahead:
Tyrion concluded after his own investigations that it was his nephew Joffery who did it. Joffery overheard his father (King Robert Baratheon) saying that putting Bran out of his misery would be the merciful and brave thing to do. Wanting to impress Robert, Joffrey stole the dragon bone hilt dagger, hired an assassin and gave him the dagger with orders to kill Bran. Later, during a celebration (Joffrey's wedding I think), Tyrion strongly hinted to Joffrey that he knew all about his role in the assassination attempt. Joffrey's demeanor changed, which confirmed it in Tyrion's mind. But of course he never confessed.
Posted on 2/28/15 at 12:42 pm to mizzoukills
quote:
I read the books, but that comment never stood out as proof that he was behind Bran's death. It absolutely makes far more sense for Cersei to be behind his death. Joffrey killing Bran because he overheard Ned's conversation about pitying cripples is a weak reason at best, even if it is supposed to demonstrate how evil Joffrey is. Joffrey demonstrated evil enough that making him responsible for Bran's death is pointless. If this the author's intent is that Joffrey is indeed responsible, it's one of the weaker plot points in the story.
It makes far more sense for Cersei to be responsible.
Not really. Joffrey had a history of doing sick things to try and impress his dad (like the pregnant cat story).
Posted on 2/28/15 at 12:43 pm to OMLandshark
Well, that went over my head. I like the story better with Cersei being responsible. She probably didn't anticipate the assassin losing the knife in the murder attempt. Thats how I read it.
Posted on 2/28/15 at 12:44 pm to Korin
quote:
Did they never bring up Joffrey being behind Bran's attempted assassination on the show?
I think it was VERY BRIEFLY hit on in the show - between Tyrion and Cersei - and it may have even been when Tyrion pieced together that Joffrey had been responsible for the slaughter of Robert's bastards, not Cersei. They either combined those parts, or I'm conflating that scene with bits from the book.
But, don't quote me...
Posted on 2/28/15 at 12:57 pm to mizzoukills
quote:
Well, that went over my head. I like the story better with Cersei being responsible. She probably didn't anticipate the assassin losing the knife in the murder attempt. Thats how I read it.
But that dagger is ridiculously elaborate, and Valyrian Steel is so hard to come by that even Tywin has a hard time getting his paws on it. Cersei would in the very least be smart enough to just give him a butchers knife instead of one that would make Tywin Lannister blush.
Joffrey though, the badassness of the dagger appealed to him and he gave it to a commoner, where if the commoner actually realized it, he was holding something much more valuable than Joffrey could give him.
Posted on 2/28/15 at 1:12 pm to OMLandshark
quote:
But that dagger is ridiculously elaborate, and Valyrian Steel is so hard to come by that even Tywin has a hard time getting his paws on it.
Yeah - I initially thought it was a ham-fisted frame job by Littlefinger - then, I realized, he would have had to have word, fairly quickly, about Bran's fall, injury, and have someone already in place to attempt the job - even though he knew it was a frame up - the "assassin" would have to realize it was a suicide mission, dire wolf or no.
The books make it almost 100% certain it was Joffrey - I think the television show is supposed to make us at least consider it was Littlefinger.
(I'd have to review all the Tyrion and Cersei scenes from S1 and S2 to really figure out if my memory is shot, or they really covered the attempted assassination.)
I mean, once it was clear that it was Joffrey that overruled Cersei on Ned, and he killed Robert's bastards, it should be a given he tried to kill Bran - although his motivation isn't clear until the passage from the books (i.e. trying to impress Robert.)
Posted on 2/28/15 at 2:55 pm to Korin
I thought Littlefinger did it?
Posted on 2/28/15 at 3:00 pm to mizzoukills
I can't remember the exact details right now, but I remember that it was pretty clearly decided that Joffrey did it. Something about it being to poorly planned for it to have been Cersei. Also, it was sort of done in some weird way for Joffrey seeking the approval of his "father" who mostly ignored him.
Posted on 2/28/15 at 3:07 pm to Cockopotamus
quote:
I thought Littlefinger did it?
Nope, but the show leads one to believe littlefinger was behind it.
Posted on 2/28/15 at 4:28 pm to Korin
quote:
Well (in the books), didn't Joffrey overhear his dad talking about how bad being crippled would suck and that someone should put the poor boy out of his misery (or something like that)? Then later on before his wedding, Joffrey remarks that he's had experience with Valyrian steel before after Tywin gives him the sword.
This is the gist of it. He heard his dad talking about how being crippled would be awful and someone should put him out of his misery. He hired the assassin to impress his dad.
In the overall, it doesn't matter in the slightest at this point in the show nor in the books since Joffrey is dead in both. Had Joffrey lived on and it could lead to a show down then I could see it being a bigger detail to leave out. Through all of it, the show leaves it vague and allows you to believe that it could have been Littlefinger to add to his antagonist role behind most of the events.
As for the poster that mentioned the Valerian steel being tough to get for the Lannisters, it is mentioned several times in the books and once in the show that the Lannisters have never had a Valerian steel blade in their house. They are one of (if not the only) major house without a Valerian blade in their possession. Jamie made the comment when he received oathkeeper from Tywin that this was so I believe. Valerian steel was so rare that they are literally priceless, therefore, the Lannisters can't just go out and buy one.
Posted on 2/28/15 at 5:26 pm to Korin
I don't want to start another thread so here goes:
It seems kind of stupid to me the way this next season is shaping up. I mean, they took two seasons to film book 3, and now it seems as if they are going to cut about 75% of the last two books. That doesn't make any sense especially considering the source material has run dry. Why not make two seasons out of the last two books?
It seems kind of stupid to me the way this next season is shaping up. I mean, they took two seasons to film book 3, and now it seems as if they are going to cut about 75% of the last two books. That doesn't make any sense especially considering the source material has run dry. Why not make two seasons out of the last two books?
Posted on 2/28/15 at 5:28 pm to alajones
I think the HBO people are going to be liberal with the storyline and spice things up while keeping a good pace with the books.
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