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Message
Playoff Tie Controversy
Posted on 12/26/23 at 12:08 pm
Posted on 12/26/23 at 12:08 pm
I am just curious as to the Board's opinion:
I am in the Semis and me and my Cousin tied at 101 a piece. ESPN defaults to the higher seed wins a tie and there is no way to change that as the tie breaker other than to manually overrule it by the commish. My cousin is the higher seed so ESPN has placed him in the champioship.
Our league rules in a document outside of the ESPN website state that the team with the higher bench total wins in the event of a tie and my bench outscored his by a TON. His contention is that the full rule book wasn't shared with the league in years (League has been running since like 2010ish) and that the rules on the website should be what we go by because he specifically looked them up on the website to decide if he needed to strengthen his bench. He saw it was higher seed and therefore didn't pick anyone up (Transactions are $2 a piece so it wouldn't have been a free fix).
My argument is that the league has rules written that have never been amended and I was beaten in the playoffs several years ago by bench points (which is how I knew to contest the results). And the rules were never changed via vote and therefore we should use the rules as stated by the league whether they were shared recently or not.
I see his point but I also feel like I have a much stronger point.
The commish has decided that both of us have a legit point so we will decide the winner via coin flip. I guess I am ok with this result as it at least gives me a chance but I also feel like the rules should be what they are and that I am being shorted in this situation because I am closer to the commish than the other party involved.
Basically the league is full of extended family memebers and its a great way to keep up with more distant cousins. I would honestly rather this solution that we both agree to than have the commish rule in my favor and ruin relationships but I wanted to know what the board thinks.
Should the rules as stated by the league but not shared in several years be adhered to OR should the rules as stated on the website be adhered to OR is the coin flip a good compromise?
I am in the Semis and me and my Cousin tied at 101 a piece. ESPN defaults to the higher seed wins a tie and there is no way to change that as the tie breaker other than to manually overrule it by the commish. My cousin is the higher seed so ESPN has placed him in the champioship.
Our league rules in a document outside of the ESPN website state that the team with the higher bench total wins in the event of a tie and my bench outscored his by a TON. His contention is that the full rule book wasn't shared with the league in years (League has been running since like 2010ish) and that the rules on the website should be what we go by because he specifically looked them up on the website to decide if he needed to strengthen his bench. He saw it was higher seed and therefore didn't pick anyone up (Transactions are $2 a piece so it wouldn't have been a free fix).
My argument is that the league has rules written that have never been amended and I was beaten in the playoffs several years ago by bench points (which is how I knew to contest the results). And the rules were never changed via vote and therefore we should use the rules as stated by the league whether they were shared recently or not.
I see his point but I also feel like I have a much stronger point.
The commish has decided that both of us have a legit point so we will decide the winner via coin flip. I guess I am ok with this result as it at least gives me a chance but I also feel like the rules should be what they are and that I am being shorted in this situation because I am closer to the commish than the other party involved.
Basically the league is full of extended family memebers and its a great way to keep up with more distant cousins. I would honestly rather this solution that we both agree to than have the commish rule in my favor and ruin relationships but I wanted to know what the board thinks.
Should the rules as stated by the league but not shared in several years be adhered to OR should the rules as stated on the website be adhered to OR is the coin flip a good compromise?
11
Posted on 12/26/23 at 12:34 pm to Bert Macklin FBI
I’d personally go with the website rules. It’s understandable to have an outside rule book for certain things, but matchup tiebreaker is a standard option on the website and should have been updated.
Posted on 12/26/23 at 12:35 pm to Bert Macklin FBI
Tough argument for you. The rules should be on the website like ours are on CBS.
However, if y`all have played in the league for years and everyone knew the rules then you have a point. He didn`t want to worry about the bench because he didn`t want to pay for any pickups and nobody thinks about a tie happening until it does.
The commish in our league reminds everyone in an email before the playoffs begin what our tiebreaker is. If you don`t have rules on the website, your commish should do the same moving forward.
However, if y`all have played in the league for years and everyone knew the rules then you have a point. He didn`t want to worry about the bench because he didn`t want to pay for any pickups and nobody thinks about a tie happening until it does.
The commish in our league reminds everyone in an email before the playoffs begin what our tiebreaker is. If you don`t have rules on the website, your commish should do the same moving forward.
This post was edited on 12/26/23 at 12:37 pm
Posted on 12/26/23 at 12:54 pm to Bert Macklin FBI
I would use total points or even head to head if y'all are playing that format. I would probably use total points throughout the regular season first. Lots of teams with high points get screwed time and time again when playing head to head
This post was edited on 12/26/23 at 2:08 pm
Posted on 12/26/23 at 1:00 pm to Esquire
quote:
I’d personally go with the website rules. It’s understandable to have an outside rule book for certain things, but matchup tiebreaker is a standard option on the website and should have been updated.
According to the commish, ESPN does not allow you to adjust tie breaker rules on their website anymore and just defaults to higher seed. He learned of this by the same situation ocurring in another league he is in. He says there is a huge reddit thread about it but I did not double check him.
Posted on 12/26/23 at 1:02 pm to Bert Macklin FBI
Our league went with tenths this year for scoring as we had too many ties last year, this year there were some close ones but no ties whatsoever.
If you had written rules outside of the internet, then it should be that.
However, I think bench scoring is dumb unless there is a chance that it will come into play.
Double edged sword!
If you had written rules outside of the internet, then it should be that.
However, I think bench scoring is dumb unless there is a chance that it will come into play.
Double edged sword!
Posted on 12/26/23 at 1:02 pm to Bert Macklin FBI
quote:
tied at 101 a piece.
Just for clarification, do yall not use the decimal system?
Posted on 12/26/23 at 1:05 pm to LSU999
quote:
The commish in our league reminds everyone in an email before the playoffs begin what our tiebreaker is. If you don`t have rules on the website, your commish should do the same moving forward.
This part was clearly a lapse by our commish on sharing the rules just in case.
I'd fully agree if the commish didn't say that he tried to change the tie breaker on ESPN and it doesn't allow. He said you can set one for the regular season but playoffs defaults to higher seed and isn't flexible.
The "everyone knew" is kinda iffy because I wasn't even confident we had the rules actually written, I contested to see if we had written rules because I knew I had been beaten by bench points in the past.
Technically everyone had seen the rules at some point and since it was used in the past, should have known but like I said I wasn't even sure we had written rules so that goes to show how often they were shared.
Posted on 12/26/23 at 1:09 pm to TigerLunatik
quote:
Just for clarification, do yall not use the decimal system?
No its a very antiquated league that was started prior to decimals being a thing and has morphed strangely over the years. We have a few older uncles that vote for the weirdest rules while vetoing common sense rules.
We don't have decimals and we also don't have TEs. We have 3 flexes with only 1 WR and 1 RB. This is all because they kept getting pissed that the younger kids knew which 3 TEs to draft and the rest of the TEs sucked so it put them at a disadvantage. They also would end up with WAY more RBs or WRs than could be played and not enough of the other position hence the flexes.
The weird rules part is why I think the league rules as written should be held to. Its not like we have a cookie cutter ESPN league.
And like I said, I am OK with the coin flip decision as it stops any relationships from being damaged and is fair enough. I have seen friendships completely end over fantasy disputes and $1,000 or whatever we win isn't worth that imo.
This post was edited on 12/26/23 at 1:14 pm
Posted on 12/26/23 at 2:17 pm to Bert Macklin FBI
I’d agree with the coin flip or some other random tiebreaker to keep the peace and just make sure in the future the commissioner sends out the rulebook before the draft and before the playoffs every year and no excuses allowed
Posted on 12/26/23 at 3:01 pm to Esquire
quote:
I’d personally go with the website rules. It’s understandable to have an outside rule book for certain things, but matchup tiebreaker is a standard option on the website and should have been updated.
I have asked about 10 people and this board what they think and its come back almost 50/50 with people taking either side. This is truly a crazy scenario.
Posted on 12/26/23 at 3:04 pm to Eighteen
Why would yall decide bench points are more important than higher seed? I think the reason espn does it that ways is because there isn’t a “home field advantage”, so it makes sense that the higher seed moves on.
If he's been in the league since the beginning and was aware of the tiebreaker rules, then it should be the rules in y’all separate file. If not, it should be the rules on the website.
Also, how did y’all have this issue years again and not adjust to fractional scoring? Sounds like a lazy commish
If he's been in the league since the beginning and was aware of the tiebreaker rules, then it should be the rules in y’all separate file. If not, it should be the rules on the website.
Also, how did y’all have this issue years again and not adjust to fractional scoring? Sounds like a lazy commish
This post was edited on 12/26/23 at 3:06 pm
Posted on 12/26/23 at 3:04 pm to Bert Macklin FBI
quote:
its a very antiquated league that was started prior to decimals being a thing
That is a very easy fix that takes no time to set up for next season and would eliminate all of this nonsense. I think I've seen one tie since they started doing .1 per yard. It's the only way to go. I'm not sure I'd play in a league that doesn't do that now.
Posted on 12/26/23 at 3:10 pm to TigerLunatik
quote:
That is a very easy fix that takes no time to set up for next season and would eliminate all of this nonsense. I think I've seen one tie since they started doing .1 per yard. It's the only way to go. I'm not sure I'd play in a league that doesn't do that now.
I'm gonna push for it but when the league started we would only get 1 point for every 25 rush or rec yards and it took a monumental effort to convince the league to move to 1 point every 10 yards.
But removing the TE and having 3 flex players won by a landslide.
Posted on 12/26/23 at 3:12 pm to Bert Macklin FBI
Just curious, is it ppr? I’m assuming no
Posted on 12/26/23 at 3:17 pm to lance814
quote:
Just curious, is it ppr? I’m assuming no
No. We did vote in 1 point every 5 receptions though.
Its a very nuanced league with unusually low scoring totals. In general 101 points blows your opponent out in most weeks. I won the first round of the playoffs 77-73
Posted on 12/26/23 at 3:19 pm to lance814
quote:
Why would yall decide bench points are more important than higher seed?
Because regular season results should have no bearing on the playoffs. Once the playoffs start, everyone is on equal footing. The bench players are at least on your team and have results that can be tallied for the week.
quote:
If he's been in the league since the beginning and was aware of the tiebreaker rules, then it should be the rules in y’all separate file. If not, it should be the rules on the website.
Not only was he in the league, he was the original commissioner.
quote:
Also, how did y’all have this issue years again and not adjust to fractional scoring? Sounds like a lazy commish
The old people in our league don't like changes unless they feel like they benefit from them and vote common sense down.
This post was edited on 12/26/23 at 3:21 pm
Posted on 12/26/23 at 4:31 pm to Bert Macklin FBI
Do y’all wait to get the stats in the USA Today paper the day after the games?
Posted on 12/26/23 at 5:05 pm to Bert Macklin FBI
quote:
We don't have decimals
This is your problem. I have played fantasy football for almost 20 years in multiple leagues and have never seen a tie. I also think the highest seed should get the win since it is the website rules and the regular season success should count for something. Using bench players to decide a game is ridiculous. One team may have a bunch of handcuffs and hurt players.
This post was edited on 12/26/23 at 5:33 pm
Posted on 12/26/23 at 5:08 pm to Bert Macklin FBI
quote:
Because regular season results should have no bearing on the playoffs. Once the playoffs start, everyone is on equal footing. The bench players are at least on your team and have results that can be tallied for the week.
Regular season absolutely has bearing on the playoffs as it determines where you’re seeded. I’m assuming y’all are fine with the espn standard there which doesn’t reseed after week one. So 1 plays 4/5 regardless of if the 6th place team wins the first week or not. At least higher seed makes logical sense from a home field advantage standpoint, since there’s no true home field advantage in fantasy football. Using the players you decided not to play because they’re on your bench is ludicrous. With y’all scoring system, I’m surprised there aren’t more ties. Yall are incentivizing teams to drop players on out for the week, because they will hurt the team being on their bench.
With that said….
quote:
Not only was he in the league, he was the original commissioner
You should move on based on this statement
This post was edited on 12/26/23 at 5:10 pm
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