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re: Wall Street Journal: Why College Football should be banned
Posted on 5/7/12 at 9:39 am to Govt Tide
Posted on 5/7/12 at 9:39 am to Govt Tide
quote:
I understand and agree with the basic principle that schools should be about academics first and foremost. However, I've never understood the argument that because a handful of football players may not be taking their college academic career seriously enough it means that the entire sport should be scrapped.
That's just one element of the argument. And it's more than a "handful" of football players. And how much energy, effort, and money goes into going the extra mile to make sure these players make the minimum grades necessary to stay eligible? University-paid tutors for athletes, dedicated study buildings for athletes, pressure on or acquiescence by professors to "accomodate" athletes, numerous excused absences from class for athletes, or even outright cheating by the athletes and/or school ... all in the name of keeping football players eligible with the NCAA and on the field.
quote:
It's an even crazier idea when you consider that football makes well over a hundred other scholarships available to serious students in a wide range of other sports available at each school. I assume the author realizes those opportunities go bye bye with college football's elimination.
What if we scrapped sports, pumped all available resources into actually educating students, and watched the school's endownment grow by leaps and bounds when alumni who were given top-notch educations become hugely successful in the real world and decide to give back. No football needed.
quote:
The benchmarks are a good idea because despite the veiled racist overtones of the author's article, a significant majority of these college football players actually graduate and become functioning members of society.
But it's not significant enough to justify the erosion of emphasis on academics.
quote:
What's with the sudden righteous indignation over college football anyway?
Nothing more than yet another periodic reassessment of the reality of modern-day college sports and whether it is "good" for higher education and society as a whole. No matter what side of the argument you are on, questions at least need to be asked.
quote:
Heck, if the idea is meaningless entertainment that is a distraction to secondary education then why limit it to college sports?
College sports is by far the biggest meaningless entertainment "distraction." I can't think of anything that comes close. I'd put frats at a distant second. Enormously distant.
quote:
If escalating coaching salaries are so evil then why not attack professional sports that benefit from the free athletic training that colleges provide in football, basketball, and baseball?
Pro sports is complicit in the elevation of college football, but it's the university presidents who are to blame. They are the ones with the (arguably) misguided priorities. Pro sports is just a business that is going to do what's best for itself ... and having college football as the de facto minor leagues of the NFL is good for business.
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You have single MLB players making annual salaries that equal the entire combined coaching salaries of entire BCS conferences and it's college football that is out of control?
MLB teams don't put themselves out there as educating the youth of America quite like colleges and universities do.
quote:
The author would probably lose his s### if you suggested New Yorkers had screwed up priorities following a team that had players making over 20 million dollars a season playing baseball. College football should be banned the same day MLB teams agree to lower their salaries in line with normal working people.
Entertainers make what they make because there is high demand for it. I don't care whether followers of sports have messed up priorities. That's their choice to make. But it shouldn't be up to colleges and universities to produce sports entertainers. They should be producing scientists and accountants and businessmen and teachers and economists and doctors and lawyers, etc. I don't have a problem with people wanting to become pro athletes, but it bothers me that institutions of "higher learning" have become their training grounds.
2
Posted on 5/7/12 at 9:47 am to ohiovol
quote:quote:
What if major colleges glorified academics (you know, stuff like math & science) rather than sports?
What if ghetto kids tried as hard to become Neil Tyson as do to become Michael Jordan or Barry Sanders?
Neither of these phenomena will ever happen until colleges rid themselves of televised sports (which means not in our lifetimes).
You do realize that people will still watch and idolize pro athletes, right?
That's fine. Idolize away. That has no bearing on whether schools should scrap football.
But just think if schools promoted academics as much as they promote sports. Maybe in time barriers could be broken.
This post was edited on 5/7/12 at 9:49 am
Posted on 5/7/12 at 9:54 am to gizmoflak
quote:
That's fine. Idolize away. That has no bearing on whether schools should scrap football.
But just think if schools promoted academics as much as they promote sports. Maybe in time barriers could be broken.
I really think you're making too many assumptions here. People watch college sports because they find them entertaining. Without college sports, people will just watch pro sports, or whatever else entertains them. Schools do promote their academics. We just don't hear about it as much because we're too busy watching sports.
Posted on 5/7/12 at 10:25 am to ohiovol
quote:
I really think you're making too many assumptions here. People watch college sports because they find them entertaining. Without college sports, people will just watch pro sports, or whatever else entertains them. Schools do promote their academics. We just don't hear about it as much because we're too busy watching sports.
I don't have a problem with people watching sports.
My argument is that the business of sports entertainment should not be entangled with institutions of higher learning. It tends to undermine their purpose.
Posted on 5/7/12 at 10:40 am to gizmoflak
quote:
College sports is by far the biggest meaningless entertainment "distraction." I can't think of anything that comes close. I'd put frats at a distant second. Enormously distant.
You aren't looking very close then. It's funny that college athletics (and college football in particular) have become such a boogie man all of a sudden. I'd say the reality TV media culture is a bigger and far more distructive distraction than college athletics. I'd also throw in video game, internet, etc technology in general as bigger a bigger distraction that sports. Sports, at the very least, fosters a healthy competitive lifestyle that encourages physical activity in many people who badly need it.
quote:
Entertainers make what they make because there is high demand for it. I don't care whether followers of sports have messed up priorities. That's their choice to make. But it shouldn't be up to colleges and universities to produce sports entertainers. They should be producing scientists and accountants and businessmen and teachers and economists and doctors and lawyers, etc. I don't have a problem with people wanting to become pro athletes, but it bothers me that institutions of "higher learning" have become their training grounds.
Why can't colleges do both? Why does a university with big time athletics have to choose one or the other? I'd agree with the argument in cases where school's that have no business trying to have big time college athletics are bleeding the school dry. However, the author thinks that any and all sports is just an unnecessary distraction when he and others who agree with him haven't shown any evidence that a school can't have both a successful athletic program AND be able to produce scientists, engineers, doctors, lawyers, economists, etc as well. The either/or finality of the author's argument is ridiculous.
P.S. I find it a little convenient too that you are apparently a Georgetown supporter and see college football as a waste of time and resources.
This post was edited on 5/7/12 at 10:42 am
Posted on 5/7/12 at 11:40 am to gizmoflak
quote:
I'd put frats at a distant second. Enormously distant.
Except for the fact that Greeks typically have above average gpa's when compared to non-Greeks. Oh and the 5 year grad rate is higher for Greeks.
Posted on 5/7/12 at 11:47 am to Govt Tide
quote:
You aren't looking very close then. It's funny that college athletics (and college football in particular) have become such a boogie man all of a sudden. I'd say the reality TV media culture is a bigger and far more distructive distraction than college athletics. I'd also throw in video game, internet, etc technology in general as bigger a bigger distraction that sports. Sports, at the very least, fosters a healthy competitive lifestyle that encourages physical activity in many people who badly need it.
I was talking about school-sponsored distractions, but I agree that the internet/reality TV-age encourages lots of degenerative behavior
quote:
Why can't colleges do both? Why does a university with big time athletics have to choose one or the other? I'd agree with the argument in cases where school's that have no business trying to have big time college athletics are bleeding the school dry. However, the author thinks that any and all sports is just an unnecessary distraction when he and others who agree with him haven't shown any evidence that a school can't have both a successful athletic program AND be able to produce scientists, engineers, doctors, lawyers, economists, etc as well. The either/or finality of the author's argument is ridiculous.
Well then, let's allow straight-up "Sports Entertainment" majors. Teach kids wanting to be pro athletes the business side of sports as well as train them physically to become a pro athlete. Make it a bona fide course of study instead of engaging in the current charade. But that might only further encourage massive athletic departments and higher emphasis on sports than other fields of study. Not sure that would be a good thing.
FWIW, I don't think ALL college sports should be gutted. I just think the Big Business of college sports, notably football, has gotten out of hand. Too much television and money involved.
quote:
P.S. I find it a little convenient too that you are apparently a Georgetown supporter and see college football as a waste of time and resources.
LSU undergrad, Georgetown Law ... I've experienced both extremes in terms of "football culture."
This post was edited on 5/7/12 at 11:52 am
Posted on 5/7/12 at 11:49 am to volfan30
Buzz Bissinger is probably the worst journalist in the world.
Posted on 5/7/12 at 11:49 am to lsu6294
quote:
Except for the fact that Greeks typically have above average gpa's when compared to non-Greeks. Oh and the 5 year grad rate is higher for Greeks.
which is why I said "enormously distant second"
If it weren't for stuff like Ben Wynne and SAE happening from time to time, I really wouldn't have a problem with frats
Posted on 5/7/12 at 11:50 am to volfan30
What purpose does any sport have in the purpose of higher education?
Posted on 5/7/12 at 12:16 pm to gizmoflak
quote:
which is why I said "enormously distant second"
So you agree that the "second biggest meaningless 'distraction'" correlates with higher grades and higher graduation rates?
This post was edited on 5/7/12 at 12:19 pm
Posted on 5/7/12 at 12:31 pm to lsu6294
quote:
So you agree that the "second biggest meaningless 'distraction'" correlates with higher grades and higher graduation rates?
the subject of frats is a whole other topic unto itself... I'll let the OT handle that one
Posted on 5/7/12 at 12:33 pm to gizmoflak
I agree. Just interesting when you throw that out when the numbers say differently.
Posted on 5/7/12 at 1:30 pm to gizmoflak
quote:
Well then, let's allow straight-up "Sports Entertainment" majors. Teach kids wanting to be pro athletes the business side of sports as well as train them physically to become a pro athlete. Make it a bona fide course of study instead of engaging in the current charade. But that might only further encourage massive athletic departments and higher emphasis on sports than other fields of study. Not sure that would be a good thing.
FWIW, I don't think ALL college sports should be gutted. I just think the Big Business of college sports, notably football, has gotten out of hand. Too much television and money involved.
I wouldn't have a problem with such a major. Whether academia finds "sports entertainment" a worthwhile pursuit or not, it is in fact a large and lucrative industry that provides many high paying jobs on and off the field/court/course. From that standpoint, it makes as much sense to have a major in sports entertainment as it does some of the more abstract majors like Philosophy. As long as such a major doesn't take away from the sciences and business at a school then it could only be a positive imho.
There is no doubt a lot of money involved in college athletics especially football. The solution is to pass rules and legislation that results in the big money sports enhancing the academic experience at colleges. Total elimination of college sports is an incredibly shortsighted idea unless every conceivable idea to make its impact on colleges a net positive isn't first totally exhausted.
This post was edited on 5/7/12 at 1:32 pm
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