You're now arguing that the point you made here was about repeat offenders, guys involved in distribution, some with violent crimes in their history?

I'm doing no such thing. I'm saying my comment wasn't limited to just first time offender and those in federal prison which were qualifiers you added.

quote:
You believe all violent protesters, everybody that ever lies while testifying before congress, everybody that fails to register as a foreign agent - they're all being treated the exact same way by our justice system?

No. As I keep saying, there is very clearly two justice systems and it turns on the money you have.

quote:
And now you're being disingenuous. It wasn't more than a post or two ago that I clearly said that I could give a shite about this Wiesselberg character, and if he cheated on his taxes he deserves to get the fines/penalties he's going to get. That doesn't change the fact that Cyrus Vance Jr, a dyed in the wool Dem, didn't turn a simple tax matter into a ridiculous political dog & pony show. You even mentioned that loads of libs are excited by this "pelt" or however you termed it.

Your very clearly care deeply. But fine.

quote:
Now tell me how disappointed you are with how Hunter Biden, a rich white dude, son of the president no less - has apparently skated on everything from kidding porn to gun violations to financial corruption. Do you honestly believe that if there was all the evidence of that shite on Donald Trump Jr's laptop that he'd be scot free, teaching at Tulane and selling art to rich liberals?

I think laws should apply to rich people too, so if he takes a charge, so be it. That said, I think the fact that I know Hunter Biden's name or that there was ever an Federal investigation into him the first place cuts against your argument. You mean to tell me there just random organic interest in Joe Biden's son just as he was beginning to look like a threat to Trump? C'mon now. It was a very political investigation because Fox News for some reason told y'all that people would care that Hunter Biden was a frick up and hold that against Joe Biden for some reason. Trump's Justice dept would have hit him with charges had they had them, but they didn't, so they didn't.

To answer your question though, Trump Jr skated on stealing from his charity and he probably will end up getting caught up in the this under-reporting thing. But it won't matter because rich people have a different justice system.

Stepping back, if there was actually a justice system that went after Republicans it would be aimed at one the 50 R Senators, none of whom are under criminal investigation, or one of the swing state Republican congressmen, none of whom are under criminal investigation. Trumpworld keeps getting investigated and its members convicted because they are corrupt AF.

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Posted by PiscesTiger

Concrete, WA

Member since Feb 2004

53696 posts

Posted on 7/4/21 at 1:23 pm to TheBoo

Trump is living in their heads .

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Posted by David_DJS

Member since Aug 2005

18015 posts

Posted on 7/4/21 at 4:09 pm to longwayfromLA

quote:
I'm doing no such thing. I'm saying my comment wasn't limited to just first time offender and those in federal prison which were qualifiers you added.

You take issue with violent offenders receiving prison time as repeat offenders when they're brought up on possession charges? Is that really what you were arguing?

quote:
No. As I keep saying, there is very clearly two justice systems and it turns on the money you have.

So Paul Manafort, General Flynn, and all the 1/6 rioters are poor people that get the shitty end of justice, as opposed to, for example, all the wealthy Antifa/BLM rioters using their vast financial resources to get better outcomes from the justice system?

quote:
Your very clearly care deeply. But fine.

It's funny how you need to imagine knowing things you cannot possibly know in order to make a point. It's also exceedingly weak.

Reality is I don't care about this guy. And here's another reality - I'm not a big fan of Trump. I have a posting history in these threads going back over a year where I've made clear I think he's weirdly egotistical, not very smart, and I think he shite the bed on COVID. So for you to suggest that I'm all worked up about one of his underlings being caught as a tax cheat casts the opinions/suggestions you post in an interesting light.

quote:
It was a very political investigation because Fox News for some reason told y'all that people would care that Hunter Biden was a frick up and hold that against Joe Biden for some reason.

Yeah, because rational adults need to be told by Fox News that kiddie porn is bad, or that the VP's son jetting around on AF2 to shakedown foreign governments/businesses isn't copacetic.

As for holding something against Joe - do you think Hunter had the keys to AF2? Are you going to tell us that you believe Joe when he says he didn't know anything about Hunter's dealings in spite of the evidence that suggests otherwise?

quote:
Trump's Justice dept would have hit him with charges had they had them, but they didn't, so they didn't.

bullshite. Trump couldn't keep his own people from getting railroaded, what makes you think he could get the "wrong kind of guilty person" charged?

quote:
Stepping back, if there was actually a justice system that went after Republicans it would be aimed at one the 50 R Senators, none of whom are under criminal investigation, or one of the swing state Republican congressmen, none of whom are under criminal investigation. Trumpworld keeps getting investigated and its members convicted because they are corrupt AF.

You seem to think unless all conservatives are indicted (for whatever) and no liberals are involved with the justice system, the justice system must be fair and square from a Right/Left balance perspective.

Your opinions are actually a little surprising to me. We've debated a number of things in these threads, but I never took you for a hopeless liberal hack. Maybe it was because most of our debates were about the virus, and while that was political AF, it was easier to focus on statistics, etc.

Tell me - do you think the IRS was turned against conservatives during Obama? I hope you're not so bent you can't be honest about that, so then my follow-up question is this: Obama's IRS was caught f'n with Obama's political opponents, and a Republican-led congress did not hold anyone to account. Why is it so hard for you to believe that other federal agencies, particularly now with Dem oversight, can't be just as bent?

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Posted by the808bass

The Lou

Member since Oct 2012

111617 posts

Posted on 7/4/21 at 5:04 pm to longwayfromLA

quote:
I'm saying my comment wasn't limited to just first time offender and those in federal prison which were qualifiers you added.

You’re stupid.

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Posted by longwayfromLA

NYC

Member since Nov 2007

3331 posts

Posted on 7/7/21 at 1:06 pm to David_DJS

quote:
You take issue with violent offenders receiving prison time as repeat offenders when they're brought up on possession charges? Is that really what you were arguing?

If a violent criminal did his time and got out and then went back to jail because he a dime bag on him, yes, I take issue with that. I don't think anyone should be in jail over weed.

quote:
So Paul Manafort, General Flynn, and all the 1/6 rioters are poor people that get the shitty end of justice, as opposed to, for example, all the wealthy Antifa/BLM rioters using their vast financial resources to get better outcomes from the justice system?

No. Manafort is a crook, Flynn lied to the FBI and the 1/6 insurrectionists at the very least committed criminal trespassing and many of them did much, much more.

quote:

Yeah, because rational adults need to be told by Fox News that kiddie porn is bad, or that the VP's son jetting around on AF2 to shakedown foreign governments/businesses isn't copacetic.

The Trump administration investigated him, right? And kiddie porn and extortion are crimes, right? Did they charge him with that? Those are state crimes too. No enterprising DA wanted a shot. Maybe there's no there, there. That said, as I said before if sufficient evidence that he committed a crime were to come out, I'm all for subjected him to the same justice system that the poor are subject to. He's another rich a-hole to me.

quote:
You seem to think unless all conservatives are indicted (for whatever) and no liberals are involved with the justice system, the justice system must be fair and square from a Right/Left balance perspective

No. I'm saying that your contention that justice is skewed against conservatives is such weak sauce that the first three examples you gave are not just clearly worthy of investigation, but clearly guilty. Last year, there was credible evidence that two Republican Senators committed insider trading by liquidating positions ahead of the COVID crash but after getting private briefings cluing them in on what was coming. Wouldn't they be the single best targets of a Justice System hell bent on hurting conservatives? What about similar insider trading accusations against several members of Trump's cabinet, including McConnell's wife? But you're claiming this grand conspiracy exists because a Republican-led justice department went after Manafort for being a crooked agent of a foreign government(Note: Trump fired Manafort for being a crook and too close to a foreign government), Flynn for lying (Note: Trump fired Flynn for lying), and a bunch of people who filmed themselves committing crimes for committing the crimes found on those films. I mean, i guess.

quote:
Tell me - do you think the IRS was turned against conservatives during Obama?

I think the IRS is turned against non-rich people in that they are, irrespective of which party is in charge, the rich are rarely audited or even policed despite committing tons of fraud.

quote:
Obama's IRS was caught f'n with Obama's political opponents, and a Republican-led congress did not hold anyone to account.

In real life, the Republican congress made up a story about about the IRS was differentially targeting conservative political groups who were committing tax fraud by claiming tax exempt status even thought they were explicitly political. This drove a lot news and made you guys very angry. Both the Republican-led FBI and Republican-led Treasury Department did investigate. And ultimately a Republican FBI Director's report and later a Republican Treasury Dept IG's report both found the IRS was equally targeting liberal groups that were committing tax fraud by claiming tax exempt status even thought they were explicitly political. But once you guys tells yourselves something, there's no talking you out of it, so here we are all these years later and y'all still believe the initial lie. Oy.

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Posted by jimmy the leg

Member since Aug 2007

34435 posts

Posted on 7/7/21 at 1:24 pm to longwayfromLA

quote:
But once you guys tells yourselves something, there's no talking you out of it

I believe you to be a paid shill.

I hope it as obvious to everyone else here as it is to me.

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Posted by David_DJS

Member since Aug 2005

18015 posts

Posted on 7/7/21 at 1:58 pm to longwayfromLA

quote:
Flynn lied to the FBI and the 1/6 insurrectionists at the very least committed criminal trespassing and many of them did much, much more.

Great. Now do Andy McCabe (among so many others) and the Kavanaugh insurrectionists.

Do you understand what a two-tiered justice system is?

quote:
The Trump administration investigated him, right? And kiddie porn and extortion are crimes, right? Did they charge him with that? Those are state crimes too. No enterprising DA wanted a shot. Maybe there's no there, there.

You're a riot. You argue there's equal justice and as proof, your evidence is the legal system being bent. And let's just pretend we haven't seen all the evidence of Hunter's crimes, right?

Now tell me how my arguments are "weak sauce" again. You are opening some eyes in this thread.

quote:
But you're claiming this grand conspiracy exists because a Republican-led justice department went after Manafort for being a crooked agent of a foreign government

You have a real problem understanding imbalance, "two-tiered justice" - because all you do is argue one side. Yeah, take issue with Republicans doing this and that, and argue their indictments/convictions are proof of criminality. What you're conveniently leaving out of your fair/balanced equation are all the Democrats who've done the same, that never even got legal scrutiny. And to argue that this legal scrutiny never happening is proof that there was nothing there, is retarded, particularly when the evidence is already in the public domain.

quote:
In real life, the Republican congress made up a story about about the IRS was differentially targeting conservative political groups who were committing tax fraud by claiming tax exempt status even thought they were explicitly political. This drove a lot news and made you guys very angry. Both the Republican-led FBI and Republican-led Treasury Department did investigate. And ultimately a Republican FBI Director's report and later a Republican Treasury Dept IG's report both found the IRS was equally targeting liberal groups that were committing tax fraud by claiming tax exempt status even thought they were explicitly political. But once you guys tells yourselves something, there's no talking you out of it, so here we are all these years later and y'all still believe the initial lie. Oy.

From NPR (hardly right wing media):

"The controversy began in 2013 when an IRS official admitted the agency had been aggressively scrutinizing groups with names such as "Tea Party" and "Patriots." It later emerged that liberal groups had been targeted, too, although in smaller numbers.

The IRS stepped up its scrutiny around 2010, as applications for tax-exempt status surged. Tea Party groups were organizing, and court decisions had eased the rules for tax-exempt groups to participate in politics.

In a legal settlement that still awaits a federal judge's approval, the IRS "expresses its sincere apology" for mistreating a conservative organization called Linchpins of Liberty — along with 40 other conservative groups — in their applications for tax-exempt status.

And in a second case, NorCal Tea Party Patriots and 427 other groups suing the IRS also reached a "substantial financial settlement" with the government."

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Posted by longwayfromLA

NYC

Member since Nov 2007

3331 posts

Posted on 7/9/21 at 2:10 pm to David_DJS

quote:
Great. Now do Andy McCabe (among so many others) and the Kavanaugh insurrectionists.

So your argument for a justice system stacked against Republican is:

1. McCabe, a Republican, not being prosecuted

2. Democratic protesters being arrested (over 300 of them) for pounding on the doors of, but notably never entering the Supreme Court building.

Do you understand what a two-tiered justice system is?

quote:
What you're conveniently leaving out of your fair/balanced equation are all the Democrats who've done the same, that never even got legal scrutiny. And to argue that this legal scrutiny never happening is proof that there was nothing there, is retarded, particularly when the evidence is already in the public domain.

Plenty of Democratic politicians go to jail - Jim Trafacant, Jessie Jackson Jr, pretty much every other major Democratic politician in Louisiana, and most materially Anthony Weiner. What's happening is that you guys tell yourselves ridiculous stories about Clinton killing people or pedophile cannibals, but none of it stands up to scrutiny and then you complain about the courts being unfair.

quote:
From NPR (hardly right wing media)

From the Trump administration, hardly a left-wing one.
Again, both the Republican-led FBI and Republican-led Treasury Department did investigate. And ultimately a Republican FBI Director's report and later a Republican Treasury Dept IG's report both found the IRS was equally targeting liberal groups that were committing tax fraud by claiming tax exempt status even thought they were explicitly political.

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Posted by longwayfromLA

NYC

Member since Nov 2007

3331 posts

Posted on 7/9/21 at 2:11 pm to jimmy the leg

quote:
I believe you to be a paid shill.

Ever turned up any of the Krakens you've been looking for? Any day now, right?

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Posted by dgnx6

Baton Rouge

Member since Feb 2006

68941 posts

Posted on 7/9/21 at 2:18 pm to longwayfromLA

quote:
C'mon now. It was a very political investigation because Fox News for some reason told y'all that people would care that Hunter Biden was a frick up and hold that against Joe Biden for some reason. Trump's Justice dept would have hit him with charges had they had them, but they didn't, so they didn't.

no, it was the illegal dealings from when Biden was vice president, before trump was even running. Thats when the investigations should have happened and found nefarious dealings with the bidens while holding office. His son just happened to go off the rails while Trump was president.

Trump being president should not have anything to do with investigating the Bidens, they should have been regardless.

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Posted by David_DJS

Member since Aug 2005

18015 posts

Posted on 7/9/21 at 3:01 pm to longwayfromLA

quote:
So your argument for a justice system stacked against Republican is:

1. McCabe, a Republican, not being prosecuted

2. Democratic protesters being arrested (over 300 of them) for pounding on the doors of, but notably never entering the Supreme Court building.

Do you understand what a two-tiered justice system is?

McCabe is as much a Republican as you are a rational liberal.

Now tell us about the 300 Kavanaugh protestors that did six months in solitary confinement.

quote:
Plenty of Democratic politicians go to jail - Jim Trafacant, Jessie Jackson Jr, pretty much every other major Democratic politician in Louisiana, and most materially Anthony Weiner. What's happening is that you guys tell yourselves ridiculous stories about Clinton killing people or pedophile cannibals, but none of it stands up to scrutiny and then you complain about the courts being unfair.

This is getting old. Give the Clinton cannibal BS a rest. Instead of hiding behind the cannibalism nonsense, how about telling us how Hunter Biden and the Biden family has been treated the same as the Trump family by US law/intelligence. Tell us how the Biden campaign was spied on, how Biden's dealings with Hunter's foreign business associates were investigated, etc., etc.

Seriously, address the matters surrounding Hunter and the rest of the Biden family, given that's most timely. Is your argument that there is no evidence of wrongdoing as compared to a mountain of evidence of Trump family wrongdoing which justified all the investigations into their affairs?

Do you believe Hunter traded access for $$$'s, or is that fake news?

quote:
From the Trump administration, hardly a left-wing one.
Again, both the Republican-led FBI and Republican-led Treasury Department did investigate. And ultimately a Republican FBI Director's report and later a Republican Treasury Dept IG's report both found the IRS was equally targeting liberal groups that were committing tax fraud by claiming tax exempt status even thought they were explicitly political.

Link?

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