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What's wrong with Social Security

Posted on 3/7/19 at 11:14 am
Posted by LSUFanHouston
NOLA
Member since Jul 2009
37162 posts
Posted on 3/7/19 at 11:14 am
There has been a lot of talk about the escalating benefit costs of social security, and how to "fix" it, to rein in runaway benefit costs.

To do this, we need to admit that SS is more like an entitlement and less like a benefit plan. That's going to be tough to do, because for decades it's been sold like a benefit plan. But if we are honest, we know that SS benefits the poor much more than it benefits the wealthy, due to the way benefits are calculated. So, to an extent, "means testing" already exists.

It's interesting, though. All manner of people - including "conservatives" on this board, jump out and down about how they "paid into social security and deserve a payout". However, they don't act like that about other forms of taxation.

Just like Obama's "if you like your plan, you can keep it" turned out to be a lie, democrats past discussions making it seem like SS is some kind of a pension plan, is also a lie.

When SS was created, this concept of a "retirement" as something fun and exciting didn't really exist. People worked for as long as they were physically able to, and once they stopped, they were given money to live on to help ensure they didn't go hungry in the couple of years between stopping working and death.

What's killing SS is the LENGTH of payments. It was never intended for people to draw benefits for 20 or more years.

What seems like the obvious answer would be to dramatically push back the retirement age - maybe to 75 - and get rid of early benefit payments - probably doesn't take in to account that, with certain careers and certain health issues, one may be able to live until their 80s or 90s, but may not be able to legit work for that long. Those later years, to be unfortunately cruel, aren't very productive when it comes to the ability to earn money.

I would probably set the age at 75, and then starting at age 70, if one cannot physically work - there would need to be some kind of private medical analysis to qualify this - then they can start taking benefits at an earlier age. I would start these regulations for anyone that is age 40 or under at the time of enactment.
Posted by Centinel
Idaho
Member since Sep 2016
43394 posts
Posted on 3/7/19 at 11:18 am to
quote:

I would probably set the age at 75, and then starting at age 70, if one cannot physically work - there would need to be some kind of private medical analysis to qualify this - then they can start taking benefits at an earlier age.


And 100% of this country would become disabled on or about age 70. If not earlier.

SSI/SSDI is already one of the most abused government programs that currently exists. Your plan would make that look like a drop in the bucket.
This post was edited on 3/7/19 at 11:18 am
Posted by Dr Hawkenbush
Iowa
Member since Aug 2018
32 posts
Posted on 3/7/19 at 11:21 am to
The problem is that it was basically set up as a Ponzi scheme, where you pay the original investors off with the investments of the new people. At that time, more people were joining and people were dying younger. Now the Ponzi scheme is collapsing. Pay off those who paid in. Stop collecting from the young. Let them invest on their own!
Posted by SammyTiger
Baton Rouge, LA
Member since Feb 2009
66858 posts
Posted on 3/7/19 at 11:21 am to
Right but currently ou get the benefits at what? 65?

Realistically I think I could Do my job till I’m 75. But how are you supposed to work in construction that long?
Posted by A10Rebel
Colorado
Member since Nov 2018
58 posts
Posted on 3/7/19 at 11:23 am to
How about I just invest the money I make myself and not give it to the government to put it away for me. This way I don't have to "hope" it's there when I decide to hang it up?

We all pay into SS but as far as I know I've never signed anything that guarantees it's going to be paid out to me?

Would you willingly do this for anything? If some investment house walked up to you on the street and said, "if you'll give me a portion of your income I'll make sure you have a steady income stream when you decide to retire. Oh and you don't have to sign anything for this we'll just make good on it when the time comes." Would anyone do this? Think about that.

This post was edited on 3/7/19 at 11:38 am
Posted by Wtodd
Tampa, FL
Member since Oct 2013
67506 posts
Posted on 3/7/19 at 11:23 am to
quote:

What's wrong with Social Security

Nothing....I'm collecting in 3 fricking years so leave it the hell alone......until I die, then it's yours
Posted by Mr. Wayne
Member since Feb 2008
10050 posts
Posted on 3/7/19 at 11:24 am to
quote:

Pay off those who paid in. Stop collecting from the young. Let them invest on their own!


This.
Posted by Homesick Tiger
Greenbrier, AR
Member since Nov 2006
54231 posts
Posted on 3/7/19 at 11:24 am to
quote:

Pay off those who paid in.


I'm good with that.

quote:

Stop collecting from the young.


Then you can't accomplish your first quote.

Posted by anc
Member since Nov 2012
18148 posts
Posted on 3/7/19 at 11:25 am to
quote:

What's wrong with Social Security



It exists.

The coming Baby Boomer Retirement Crisis is going to usher in socialism in this country. My in-laws averaged making six figures for the past 20 years and they have $8,000 in retirement savings. Its an extreme example, but there's a ton of people approaching retirement age that do not have retirement savings.

This post was edited on 3/7/19 at 11:27 am
Posted by Zach
Gizmonic Institute
Member since May 2005
112619 posts
Posted on 3/7/19 at 11:27 am to
quote:

What's killing SS is the LENGTH of payments. It was never intended for people to draw benefits for 20 or more years.


You're leaving out a big factor. All sorts of SSI/disability additions that were never intended when SS was created.

If you weigh 600 pounds you need a lot of food to maintain the weight that qualifies you as disabled. So, your benefits can be thousands just to feed your face.

Posted by Centinel
Idaho
Member since Sep 2016
43394 posts
Posted on 3/7/19 at 11:28 am to
My retirement plans have never included seeing a penny of Social Security. True means testing will happen in the next ten years, if not sooner.

If you have a 401k with a decent amount of money in it, forget every seeing a dime of what you paid in to SS.

Posted by Homesick Tiger
Greenbrier, AR
Member since Nov 2006
54231 posts
Posted on 3/7/19 at 11:28 am to
quote:

The coming Baby Boomer Retirement Crisis is going to usher in socialism in this country.


FDR wasn't much of a visionary in not seeing this was he?
Posted by ShortyRob
Member since Oct 2008
82116 posts
Posted on 3/7/19 at 11:28 am to
quote:

What's wrong with Social Security

When it was started, there were 13 people paying in for every 1 receiving benefits.

We are on our way to that being sub 2:1.

All other issues are ancillary to this one.
Posted by RogerTheShrubber
Juneau, AK
Member since Jan 2009
261689 posts
Posted on 3/7/19 at 11:31 am to
There's a shite load of "disabled" people collecting SSI that are fully capable of working.
Posted by Zach
Gizmonic Institute
Member since May 2005
112619 posts
Posted on 3/7/19 at 11:33 am to
quote:

There's a shite load of "disabled" people collecting SSI that are fully capable of working.


Hell, they're on Judge Judy every day.
Posted by tigersandsaints
Member since Dec 2005
6511 posts
Posted on 3/7/19 at 11:54 am to
quote:

What's killing SS is the LENGTH of payments. It was never intended for people to draw benefits for 20 or more years.


So I can pay into this scam for 50 or so years but God forbid I collect for 20 or 25 years?
Posted by ShortyRob
Member since Oct 2008
82116 posts
Posted on 3/7/19 at 11:56 am to
quote:

What's killing SS is the LENGTH of payments. It was never intended for people to draw benefits for 20 or more years.

Well, I mean, that's just not true.

They knew SOME would receive benefits that long. The dumb fricks just didn't contemplate that over time, their actuarial tables would go to shite and there would be no political will to keep SS in line with actuarial principles.

Posted by jchamil
Member since Nov 2009
16549 posts
Posted on 3/7/19 at 11:58 am to
quote:

Pay off those who paid in. Stop collecting from the young. Let them invest on their own!


I've only been paying in for 10 years, but I'd gladly kiss that $$ goodbye if it meant I could take care of my own retirement from now on and not pay in another dime
Posted by NC_Tigah
Carolinas
Member since Sep 2003
124189 posts
Posted on 3/7/19 at 12:01 pm to
quote:

To do this, we need to admit that SS is more like an entitlement and less like a benefit plan.
Except that is not what it is at all.

SS is a program which forces working Americans to lend portions of their earnings to the US government at substantially submarket rates.

FDR needed to fund his big government. SS was a way for FDR to essentially force Americans to buy US Savings Bonds, except at about 1/2 the ROI. He paved the road to Hell, and Americans have heartily thanked him for it ever since.

It was political genius!

This post was edited on 3/7/19 at 12:06 pm
Posted by Centinel
Idaho
Member since Sep 2016
43394 posts
Posted on 3/7/19 at 12:03 pm to
quote:

There's a shite load of "disabled" people collecting SSI that are fully capable of working.


Yup, the latest DSM was god's gift to anyone who wanted to get on disability for life.

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